ohm's...mahs....volts....oh my!!
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Ok I think I get that one with a single coil but then John says:
Volts x volts / resistance = total watts to the coil or coils. Dual coils, divide that by two.
Amps = Watts / voltage required to develop those watts.
So just give me that same example with the dual coil please. I'm getting:
(3.7 x 3.7) / 1.7 = 8.05 watts. 8.05 / 2 = 4.025 watts
4.025 / 1.7 = 2.36 amps
What am I doing wrong here? The single coil pulling 4.74 and the dual 2.36 which would be less power. Maybe for the dual core you meant multiply by 2 instead of divide? Surely I'm doing this wrong.. just give me that same example for a dual core so I can understand.
Edit: punching that first set of numbers into http://www.ohmslawcalculator.com/ohms_law_calculator.php
gives me 2.17 amps so wouldn't the formula be
8.05 / 3.7 = 2.17 amps ??
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It's hard to make Any Recommendation to people one way or another. Everyone has Different needs and Everyone is on a Different Budget.
For me, it's pretty easy. Have to have a ciggie look-alike? Get a Volt. OK with something that doesn't look like the thing that's killing you? Get a Twist or three. Want something fancier to use when you're not using your Twists? Get a ProVari V2, an Apollo SS VTube, or a Smoktech VMax, in that order. And I think it would be the rare indivdual who "needs" constant voltage. I also find it odd that people who have been spending $1000 - $5000 a year on cigarettes are suddenly on a tight budget when it comes to proper vaping equipment.
For me, a VVPV is perfect. I can dial it Up or Down to find the Sweet Spot for any Given e-Liquid.
Ditto. So again, I don't see why anyone would recommend constant voltage to anyone.
I did the Normal Progression.
Ultra Mini.
Mini Pen Style
Pen Style
Long Pen Style
eGo/Riva
Box Mod
Box Mod VV
Provari
Mini Lava Tube
Not sure how "normal progression" squares wth a contention that peple have widely varying needs. I think peoples' needs are fairly similar; a good-vaping, reliable device. There really aren't all that many slam-dunk choices IMO.
Most people get to a VVPV sooner or Later. So I don't get too concerned when people recomend an eGo/Riva to someone using a Pen Style PV. Because an eGo/Riva is a Great PV and many people making the Recommendation arn't using a VVPV yet.
I do not understand this at all. I think people will get a better vape with variable voltage, so why wait? A 650mah Twist is about $22. If people want to experience constant voltage, they can set a Twist to 3.7 volts and leave it there.
Maybe small steps is easier to take than someone saying your should buy a $225 Provari.
A $22 Twist (two or three is better) is a pretty small step.
For me, it's pretty easy. Have to have a ciggie look-alike? Get a Volt. OK with something that doesn't look like the thing that's killing you? Get a Twist or three. Want something fancier to use when you're not using your Twists? Get a ProVari V2, an Apollo SS VTube, or a Smoktech VMax, in that order. And I think it would be the rare indivdual who "needs" constant voltage. I also find it odd that people who have been spending $1000 - $5000 a year on cigarettes are suddenly on a tight budget when it comes to proper vaping equipment.
For me, a VVPV is perfect. I can dial it Up or Down to find the Sweet Spot for any Given e-Liquid.
Ditto. So again, I don't see why anyone would recommend constant voltage to anyone.
I did the Normal Progression.
Ultra Mini.
Mini Pen Style
Pen Style
Long Pen Style
eGo/Riva
Box Mod
Box Mod VV
Provari
Mini Lava Tube
Not sure how "normal progression" squares wth a contention that peple have widely varying needs. I think peoples' needs are fairly similar; a good-vaping, reliable device. There really aren't all that many slam-dunk choices IMO.
Most people get to a VVPV sooner or Later. So I don't get too concerned when people recomend an eGo/Riva to someone using a Pen Style PV. Because an eGo/Riva is a Great PV and many people making the Recommendation arn't using a VVPV yet.
I do not understand this at all. I think people will get a better vape with variable voltage, so why wait? A 650mah Twist is about $22. If people want to experience constant voltage, they can set a Twist to 3.7 volts and leave it there.
Maybe small steps is easier to take than someone saying your should buy a $225 Provari.
A $22 Twist (two or three is better) is a pretty small step.
That is where I did Good with e-Cigs when I started.
I told myself that if they worked, and I actually did feel Better than smoking, than even if I spent $175 a month on e-cigs(what I spent on Analogs) I was doing fine.
I kinda wish I hadn't taken all the Half Steps to get to the Provari, but you have to remember, the Provari really didn't exist when I started using e-cigs.
Heck, I remember when the eGo came out.
LOL
Because people get in their Happy Ruts and Don't see that there is any need to spend More Money on something they Allready have. We all do it for certain things.
It's kinda like a Garage Door Opener. Until you have had one, you don't really think about it. If you want your car in the Garage, you have to get out and open the Door.
But Once you have one, there is no way you can go back.
I was Very Happy when I was at the eGo Stage. Didn't really think it could get better. Why spend $200 on something that works just as well as an eGo that I allready Own?
But then Madvapes did some sale and I bought this VVPV Box Mod for like 10 Bucks.
It was Real Crude but I could see that VVPV was worth doing. I used that Box Mod for like a week and then Ordered my Provari.
So I can understand someone who is using a Fixed Voltage PV and are Happy with it. And I can understand wanting to Recommend something that works for them.
zoid, thanks for taking my last post so well. I just am very passionate about geting people off of cigarettes, for a whole lot of reasons, including my Dad dying from them and my best friend now in the process of doing the same.
And I just put two and two together (6,643 posts, 2 1/2 year veteran) and finally "get" why your list is so long! Kinda hard to buy something that hasn't been made yet.
Congrats on all those posts, BTW. That's a lot of PIF, and I salute you.Amazing advances are being made in vaping tech (I'm looking forward to the first variable wattage/variable voltage APV), and recommending variabe voltage to beginners just got a WHOLE lot simpler in the last two months thanks to the Joyetech eGo-C Twist. IMO it is a 99% no-brainer and a great addition to ANYONE'S collection of gear.
As for "Heck, I remember when the eGo came out"; I remember when color TV's came out, if that makes you feel any better.
***
Take it away, Grimm:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ol-Ol8qWPic&feature=g-all-c Grimm Green Twist Game changer
And CRANK this up:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=im9XuJJXylw chubby checker the twist
I remember when THIS came out too! (And when the Beatles came on the scene a well).
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Ah, OK, got it. Common area of confusion. Took me a few months to figure it out.
Here's how I understand it:
Let's use an example of a 2.0 ohm single coil and a 2.0 ohm dual coil at 3.7 volts (but get a VV Twist LOL)
A KEY POINT is that a 2.0 ohm dual coil would use two 4.0 ohm coils wired in parallel to yield a total resistance of 2.0 ohms.
Single 2.0 ohm coil:
3.7v x 3.7v / 2.0 ohms = 6.84 watts per (single) coil.
6.845 watts / 3.7v = 1.85 amps
Dual 2.0 ohm coils:
3.7v x 3.7v / 2.0 ohms = same 6.845 watts divided between two coils = 3.42 watts per coil
Same amp draw, but only half the heat per coil.
To get the amps down, use a higher resistance single coil at a higher voltage (with your Twist, perhaps)
V squared = 3 x 6.84 watts
V squared = 20.52
SqrRoot of 20.52 = 4.5 volts
6.84 watts / 4.5 volts = 1.52 amps. Since batteries are rated in milliamp hours, the fewer amps you use to create a desired wattage gives you longer battery life. 1.52/1.85 = almost 20% less drain on the battery for the same wattage to the coil.
Confused? I am! LOL
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zoid, thanks for taking my last post so well. I just am very pasionate about geting people off of cigarettes, for a whole lot of reasons, including my Dad dying from them and my best friend now in the process of doing the same.
And I just put two and two together (6,643 posts, 2 1/2 year veteran) and finally "get" why your list is so long! Kinda hard to buy something that hasn't been made yet.
...
No Problem...
I could tell you were Genuine about you Desire for people to have the Best PV Possible.
For many, e-Cigarettes are still to New and Ever Evolving. And it is Confusing. Ohms, Volts, How to use it. Fill it. And all the Slang and Abbreviations.
My theory is as long as a person has Switched to e-Cigs and isn’t using Analogs, their doing Good even if their using an 88 mAh Blu. If they like e-cigarettes, they get to a VVPV. It’s the Natural Progression.
And yes, things have Changed Exponentially since I started vaping. And they have Changed in a Good way.
Anyway, we should let this thread get back to Ohms and Volts. Good posts and Topic but I don’t want Hibiscus doesn’t get the idea that we are all a bunch of Thread Hijackers.
But I am, and I'm darn proud of it!
****
Ok, something on-topic .... hmmmmm ....
Well, I'm tired, so how about just one more pitch for variable voltage by virtue of the fact that in addition to all of its many other benefits, it allows you to maximize battery life by using the highest possible resistance coil that still lets you put sufficient watts to the coil at the upper range of the VV device's voltage output level.
(If I already said this, all apologies - like I said I'm tired).
think of electricity as water.
a battery is a tank of water.
volts .. pressure .. how high the tank is off the ground.
resistance ., a restriction in the line, the higher the resistance the thinner the pipe.
mAh .. how big the tank is.
current .. the flow rate through the pipe.
a switch is a valve.
if you want to keep going, a capacitor is a tank with a rubber diaphragm in the middle sealing one side from the other.
an inductor .. well a bit trickier, but its sort of the inertia of the water in the pipe, if you try and stop it in a hurry you get a big pulse of pressure and it travels back up the pipe.
a battery is a tank of water.
volts .. pressure .. how high the tank is off the ground.
resistance ., a restriction in the line, the higher the resistance the thinner the pipe.
mAh .. how big the tank is.
current .. the flow rate through the pipe.
a switch is a valve.
if you want to keep going, a capacitor is a tank with a rubber diaphragm in the middle sealing one side from the other.
an inductor .. well a bit trickier, but its sort of the inertia of the water in the pipe, if you try and stop it in a hurry you get a big pulse of pressure and it travels back up the pipe.
"So I can understand someone who is using a Fixed Voltage PV and are Happy with it. And I can understand wanting to Recommend something that works for them".
That reminds me of a funny little saying my Mom had: "You're not happy, you just think you are". LOL
The funny thing is, it can be kinda true. I've had people say "my vape is perfect with my constant voltage device", to which I say "OK, well then it will be more perfect with variable voltage".
The benefits of variable voltage are IMO indisputable, and I will never, ever recommend a constant voltage device to anyone starting out unless they ABSOLUTELY have to have a look-alike. (Hmm ... makes me wonder when the VV Volt will be coming out .... thanks to the Twist, probably sooner rather than later).
That reminds me of a funny little saying my Mom had: "You're not happy, you just think you are". LOL
The funny thing is, it can be kinda true. I've had people say "my vape is perfect with my constant voltage device", to which I say "OK, well then it will be more perfect with variable voltage".
The benefits of variable voltage are IMO indisputable, and I will never, ever recommend a constant voltage device to anyone starting out unless they ABSOLUTELY have to have a look-alike. (Hmm ... makes me wonder when the VV Volt will be coming out .... thanks to the Twist, probably sooner rather than later).
Same amp draw... thank you John, that is what I was trying to understand. Yes, I have an ego twist and I love punching in numbers to the Ohm's Law Calculator
I just needed to know for example if putting in numbers for a DC 1.5 ohm if I actually enter 1.5 in the resistance field or something different. Just wanted to be sure I was using it correctly for a dual core. My main objective is to get the lowest amp usage at my desired wattage.
All I have now is a dc 1.5 and a dc 3.0 for my twist (waiting on some 2.0 ohm single coils). So instead of running this 1.5 @ 3.4 V pulling 2.26 amps on the battery I could run my DC 3.0 @ 4.8V pulling 1.6 amps... so even with the higher voltage the battery should last longer correct? Plus I'm getting the same wattage so I can have my cake and eat it too if I'm figuring this correctly.
cheers,
cho
I really like where this thread went. I'm sitting here happy with my eGo-C Upgrade VV, but knowing I 'should' have another battery on hand.....I have been looking at just getting a 650mah eGo. Much more food for thought now that I have read through this.
John, your signature line led me to price an Antari and I about spit my coffee all over the screen....LOL!!! Hilarious!
John, your signature line led me to price an Antari and I about spit my coffee all over the screen....LOL!!! Hilarious!
Nothing wrong. Your formulas are correct. Mroutlaws's are a little off.
I=P / R doesn't exist.
The correct formula is:
I=Sqrt(P / R)
The short answer is that for a boost circuit (Twist, Provari, LT) the amps at the cartomizer don't matter. This thread will explain in more detail. Make sure and read all of it, as there is an epiphany about mid way through.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modding-forum/315209-boost-all-bucked-up.html
Well I read the thread and alot of it flew straight over my head but I think I get the jist of it:
I can have my cake but can't eat it also. The current is pretty much irrelevant with the twist in the ohm calculator: DC 1.5,
DC 3.0 or SC 2.0 ohms... the runtime on my twist should be about the same for all. ??
Unfortunately... This is Usually True.
Curse the Law of Conservation of Energy. Curse it to Hell. And Curse the Day Leibniz was born for that matter.
I agree to an extent, however once a person knows what they do like, that's what they like. Ironic that my VV is set up to vape just like my 3.7v all mechanical mod.
One of us is about to learn something. Please God, don't let it be me! LOLOL
From what I think I know, I think you have it 100% correct.
STEAL on Boge single coil cartos:
Boge Mix n Match (5 Boxes) Boge single coils .92 each
LOL! Sorry about your monitor; maybe it was time to upgrade anyway?
Let me make it up to you - come on over and let's fire up the Antari! The only problem is finding it again to turn it off! LOL
[I don't really have one, but please don't tell anyone. "Our little secret", ok?]
That touches on what I still don't fully understand. That's kinda saying "hey, I like what I have, so regardless of the science that says that there's something that will give a more optimum vape under a wider variety of circumstances, and can also increase my battery life, I'm going to stick with what is arguably inferior because I like it".
I don't expect you to change your view in the face of logic and reason; that's pretty (and all-too) rare. I say this more for the others reading this thread.
*****
I now have it on very good authority that a variable voltage device will not afford better battery life by letting you use a higher-resistance coil, when you are comparing fixed voltage devices to variable voltage devices.
It is still my understanding that your will get better battery life on a given variable voltage device, regardless of the circuitry involved, by using a higher resistance coil to achieve a given number of watts, but that variable voltage in and of itself will not afford better battery life than a constant voltage device, regardless of the resistances involved.
I respectfully ask for a review of my thinking by anyone who cars to offer a kind, non-judgmental opinion of it. TIA.
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