On the quality of mechs

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turbocad6

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do you have any idea how much work and time it takes to start with just raw materials and design and machine them into a unique mod with perfect fit and finish, perfect button action and then to produce a relatively small quantity of these to sell? many times hand machining is even involved. believe me the high prices asked are not because the mod makers are greedy and making a killing it's because these prices are necessary as a return on their investment and for it to be profitable enough to be worth doing it in the first place. I can guarantee that the first hand built prototype of virtually any high end mod winds up costing well over $1,000 to develop and build the first one... if only one is built then it would cost well over a grand for that one, building 100 or 2 or 300 is necessary to spread the costs to a per unit cost of a few hundred each...

now take china who does no R&D besides figuring out how to "copy" others designs, essentially stealing them, and then gearing up to produce thousands of them. it's a known fact that the cost of development must be shared over the quantity of products ultimately produced, so producing a few hundred of something that you also have much R@D, trial and error and testing, it's no wonder these real deal mod makers mods cost a whole lot more than someone who steals a design and then mass produces them, child slave labor and peanut wages and poor working conditions combined with mass production all contribute to much lower costs per unit.

ok, consider this, go to a wood worker and request that he makes a toothpick for you out of some specified wood you desire and built to your specs... how much do you think that toothpick would cost you? why? how does that compare to the cost of buying a box of 1,000 toothpicks from walmart? per toothpick?... obviously no one would request something like this from a woodworker because it would never be cost effective and that one toothpick will cost you many times more than 1,000 toothpicks from walmart, but here we are talking about something completely different. here mod makers are developing and producing something that doesn't exist quite like they envision it, they are innovating, and developing, not stealing and mass producing.

the difference in cost is a result of many reasons and what makes being a mod maker a difficult task. fortunately there are at least some who appreciate the difference and understand why something may cost what it costs. if there wasn't then we would have no innovations and we'd all still be vaping cigalikes...

low quantity high quality proprietary developed designs always costs way more per unit than mass produced copies. it's just the scale of economics in manufacturing....
 

Topacka

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What exactly are you looking for? The question you posed in the beginning was you were wondering about the quality. Well the quality of many mechs are top notch. Much better than a cheap EGO or cigalike that will die/break after a while.



Cheers.....:toast:

Oh, sorry for the misinterpretation. I just meant to compare mechs to other mechs.
 

DanDC

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Sep 16, 2012
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Just let the mod makers price it how they want and people buy what they want... seriously, with all the stupid stuff people waste their money on, a "metal tube", however expensive it may be, that keeps you from smoking should be the least of your concerns. I am perfectly happy with my launcher v2 clone, would I like to have the better machined original? yeah! would I pay $180 for it? nope. so I don't. It's that simple.
Btw, anyone looking for an inexpensive ($50) and well built mech mod, take a look at the Hamoriko SS from mini-ecig.com, I saw todd's review on it today, seems like a winner.
edit: they also have it in titanium for $84 which kinda blew my mind.
edit2: it's out of stock ... still, might be worth it to keep an eye on it.
 
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Topacka

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IMHO, clones don't really fit into these kinds of discussions. You can't compare prices of items mass manufactured from someone elses design in a Special Economic Zone to something that came out of a workshop (in far lower quanta) in any other economy.

Mechanicals, simple as they appear, are precision crafted. Of course, some are not, but that's another discussion. To crank out precision crafted items of high quality, you need quality machinists working on quality machines. Machinists and machines who (I suppose) make quality equipment for industrial use. To displace their man-hours and machine-hours to making mods, you have to pay accordingly. You don't pay based on the difficulty of what they're crafting. As in, a "simple" mech mod. You pay for what they can't make while doing so.

I don't intend to defend each and every mod out there and say they're all worth their weight in gold. However, once you've saved several thousand dollars by not smoking... and know exactly what you want from your gear; in terms of form and functionality... paying a couple hundred bucks for something you use all day, every day... might not seem all that crazy. Believe me: We've all been there. "WHAT?! $200 for a metal tube?!"
That is exactly the kind of answer I was looking for. Something obvious staring me in the face that I was just missing.
 

xtwosm0kesx

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Well, paying for original art is a little different than paying for a mass produced item, lol. And, as an artist, Carter's work is pretty generic, not worth $3000, IMHO, but knowing how to engrave like that is a dying art. I have some engraving stuff around here somewhere, I'm thinking about giving it a shot myself - my experience is mostly putting detail into bronze sculptures I did in college, though, and putting serial numbers on bicycles and such.

And, yes, if I have any aptitude for it, I may offer custom design work - I won't be as expensive as Carter, but I won't be cheap, either.

Wow, you obviously have done zero research into his work.

I suggest you get informed before you start insulting a quite talented artist.

Ill expect some examples of your art work to be posted.

http://www.ottocarter.com/
 
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Portertown

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Clones are great for many reasons:
Low cost
Most will work correctly and give a satisfactory vape
Usually require some fine tuning/tinkering
Are mostly available anytime to purchase
Most will last a fair amount of time


Originals also have their strong points:
Better quality
Will work correctly out of the box
Hold their value, with very good resale market
Most will last almost forever
Spare parts are available if needed in the future(good luck finding parts for clones)

I bought one of the Poldiac clones and it works ok, not perfect, but ok. I really like the button location on the side at the top. This clone convinced me this is the type of mechanical mod I want to use. So I ordered an original Poldiac Aname and it is on it's way from Greece. I ordered it early Friday morning and it will be here Wednesday. Just a little faster delivery than a slow boat from China.
 

Myrany

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Here is how I look at my mechs. I paid a highish price for my 2 REO Grands. Not outrageously high, but they were not cheap either. They are solid well made devices that I will have for years. The man that makes them backs up his work with extremely fine support. There is no cheap clone out there.

My real reason for buying them is twofold.

1. I discovered I like the vapor and flavor of dripping but I hate dripping. A bottom feeder lets me have the vapor and flavor and have a tank on board.

2. I can repair it myself. If Vapocalypse comes I can keep vaping for years with these 2 devices.
 

bones1274

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Personally, I would rather spend my money on a legit mech instead of a clone and support the person that originally designed it. Yes, I could go to the flea market and get my wife a fake Coach purse for 1/10th the price of a real one, and it looks like the real thing, but she will always not feel quite right about trying to pass off a knock off as the real thing. I feel the same way about clones.

As for cost, at least we have this forum and we are educated on what the actual cost of ecigs/mods should be. This company below charges $249.00 for an EGO-T kit and $49 for 10ml of liquid. (a few weeks ago it was $79). I feel sorry for the poor suckers who buy this.....

Ego T Kit
 

bones1274

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Here is how I look at my mechs. I paid a highish price for my 2 REO Grands. Not outrageously high, but they were not cheap either. They are solid well made devices that I will have for years. The man that makes them backs up his work with extremely fine support. There is no cheap clone out there.

My real reason for buying them is twofold.

1. I discovered I like the vapor and flavor of dripping but I hate dripping. A bottom feeder lets me have the vapor and flavor and have a tank on board.

2. I can repair it myself. If Vapocalypse comes I can keep vaping for years with these 2 devices.

Exactly. I have a REO Grand also and have been using the same one for over 3 years. It cost $140 to purchase, less than a months worth of smokes, and has paid itself off over 36 times already. It is used daily and still is as good and strong as the day I bought it.
 

Nataani

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In my experience the original devices are always better than the clones. I have an original chi you and an original nemisis. Both are far superior to their clone counterparts in terms of the quality of machining, parts, threading, VD, etc.

The "why spend money on a metal tube" is not a valid argument imo. The reason I try to own all original mods / VVs / RDAs / etc is because I actually want to support the people who R&D them, rather than a chinese sweatshop. The R&D costs that go into mods is far more than may be expected, and as a result, the mods are not cheap. The chinese manufacturers who steal the designs are thieves, simple as that. The reason I own K101s instead of the empire mod is because they were my first ever mods, and were gifted.

I understand that not everyone can afford the pricetag of some original mods. For that reason I dont condemn those who do choose to buy clones. That said, I hope that when those who do can afford the price of an original rather than a clone, get the original. Supporting those who make these mods only means more and better products in the future.
 

sleepingbuffalo

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Dec 18, 2012
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I just got my first mech, a Maraxus for 65.00 (clone) love the looks and it works great! after I got it I looked up the original the cost 275.00 I am one of those vapors that can not afford triple digit price tags (someday) I also looked at the 50 cal by V3 tronics LOVE it but not 190.00 worth of love, sorry guys I know about the R&D that goes into any new product and I understand that, but I have a budget and those originals just don't fit. if the funds were available would I? Ya I would support them just as I do my local B&M on most things (their juice not so good.....) If I need something NOW I don't yell about the mark-up they have to have to stay in business. it's a fact of life! to each his own I guess, I can not fault somebody for paying the higher cost for the originals nor can I fault somebody that will only buy the cheaper "clones" but if the clone gives them problems they have no room to **tch about it. you get what you pay for (this from a guy that bought a few clones and has problems with a few of them)
 

BillyWJ

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Wow, you obviously have done zero research into his work.

I suggest you get informed before you start insulting a quite talented artist.

Ill expect some examples of your art work to be posted.

Otto Carter III's Artwork

I designed the cover for Guns N' Roses Appetite for Destruction. Now tell me I've done no research. I'm a professional artist and corporate designer and Illustrator, I've been an artist my entire life. My portfolio site is www.fusedarts.com. I've worked for the likes of Motorhead, Black Sabbath, Great White, Asia, and many, many others, and that's just my freelance work. I won't list my professional sites, I don't want to be linked here for that.

Still want to play?

I stand by my opinion, the carved ecig mods they sell from him are generic and not that special - and not worth $3k. Looking at his other work, it's even more obvious he spends a lot more time and creative effort on other things.
 
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deanthemachine

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Not true it is a valid question for someone who hasnt been vaping long in todays market, What I would like to see and what would validate the question even further would be if China could actually just design their own mods for once instead of stealing everyone elses design, then this whole argument would be moot.

If you could compare a nemesis to a Yeeglo xyr40 or something and say see there is no difference, then yea why would you pay top dollar. but since china waits for someone else to design a killer mech or atty then just simply use it as a template to steal money It isnt a fair fight...... someone sat in a room somewhere and said "what if i make the threads to this tolerance and the battery pin this thick? how will this affect the voltage drop? and thats what you pay for. and in the case of things like SuperT rollers and poldiac it is a couple people working the mills themselves not a sweatshop filled with 14 year olds 24/7.

Even if the Chinese do start designing their own stuff, the King and Nemesis will still cost ~$200, which is what the OP was questioning. It is a valid question and imo the valid answer is workmanship, you get what you pay for. The Chinese know the world thinks their products are crap, so investing a lot in design is money they might not get back. There strategy is keep the costs low and sell it for dirt cheap and it works for them.

This question comes up in almost every industry so it suprises me so many ask on here. "Why should I buy a DeWalt or Milwaukee drill when this Black and Decker or Harbor Freight drill is half the cost?" Ask a contractor why. "Why should I buy a Mac for graphic design when I could get a cheap 400 desktop?" - Ask a graphic artist. Truth is some know that a product is better but the price difference does not justify the difference, some do not have that limitation.

If a company tries to sell cheap goods for high prices they will not last long, the market will eat them up. The reason DeWalt, Milwaukee, Provari, and companies that make real mechs last as long as they have and can survive at those prices is there is higher quality there, and there is a market for people who want quality.
 
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