PG vs. VG

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buttersmom

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I used to make bath & body products, still make soap, and really like the idea of using VG instead of PG. Other than the amount of vapor (+) and the potentional clogging (-), what are some pros & cons of using VG over PG? Thanks!

PS:
Used to make lip gloss with VG and a little flavoring & coloring - want a NICOTINE lip gloss? COMPLETELY kidding of course......:ohmy:
 

rolygate

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PG and VG are similar chemicals in some ways, PG = propylene glycol, VG = propane 1,2,3 triol. Both sound fairly grim but so does anything when called by its chemical name, eg dihydrogen monoxide or hydronic acid (water).

Both are solvents, diluents, have a high carbohydrate content, vapor carrier agents, vaporize well in air, and are virtually inert in humans. In other words they are ideal for this job, since they dissolve some things about as well as alcohol, keep them in solution well, create a nice-looking mist when heated, and are more or less inactive to humans (meaning they are approved as safe to inhale or ingest in any way as most people are tolerant to them).

As far as preference goes, it's purely a matter of taste, like anything else. A 50-50 mix is popular, as is 90-10 PG-VG. 100% VG is fine, however it seems a good idea for that purpose to add something like EM, ethyl maltol, or PGA.

VG may be more acceptable for those who seem intolerant to PG. Or, people might want to use a vegetable product instead of a manufactured one. In that case you should probably buy something named specifically as Vegetable Glycerine on the label, since it can be manufactured synthetically like anything else. All 'VG' is not of vegetable origin despite the name.

For practical purposes it works as well as PG. It's slightly thicker so benefits from dilution. Mixed with PG it gives better TH. It's a 'cooler' and 'sweeter' vape although many would not notice that, it is a matter of tiny percentages. Some people are VG-only vapers, there is a social group for that. You can get 100% VG liquids. Flavors are currently very restricted though, so it is sometimes necessary to add PG-based flavors, if you don't mind doing that instead of hunting for flavorings with no PG.
 
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buttersmom

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LOL Glycerin is actually a by product of making soap (soap from scratch) and most mfg's remove it for resale as it's own product. It's good in lotions, etc also but it doesn't take much.

I JUST started vaping and feeling like I'm getting the hang of it better, but nearly all the time it makes me hack, like a joint. I don't hack WHILE I'm smoking a cig.........wondering if it could be the PG juice so looking into the VG since I'm going to get a couple bottles of something next week. Could just be the "methol" flavor I suppose...
 

Shaka

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rolygate said it all. He is our resident PG, VG genius.

What I can't understand is if they are used for beauty products, how come they make my hands feel so yucky?:p

Agree! Can't add much to Roly's post.

Yucky because it's full strength on your hands. Both have antimicrobial properties and diluted with water vg is good for moisturizing the skin.

Always had a bottle of glycerin in the med cab as I was growing up...my mother used it for cold sores inside my mouth...cleared it up in a day.

btw, I'm a vg only vaper.
 

rolygate

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suddenlyno - rolygate said it all. He is our resident PG, VG genius.

Hah - thanks but I'm only repeating what the chemists here have said, although since I'm not a chemist and it was done from memory, there will be some inaccuracies.

I forgot humectant (thanks for that jog) and also they are both bactericides (thanks for jooging the memory with that reference to killing cold sores). It means that: there is a tendency for it to dry the throat for example, as it attracts moisture (seems to only apply to PG though, at least in my case); and both kill bacteria very effectively. PG has actually been used as an atmospheric bactericide apparently. Or, another way to look at it is, when you get into the thick fog at a disco there may be less risk of catching Legionnaire's Disease. For those that are worried.

Mainly, I'm interested in this because I only use VG, and live in a small country, so full supplies are tricky. Some flavors I make myself.

The VG vapers group is in the Social Group forums - but as this site is so big here's a link:

VG USERS ONLY - E-Cigarette Forum

Somewhere in among Zombie Vapers and NW Steampunks... :)
 

suddenly

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I JUST started vaping and feeling like I'm getting the hang of it better, but nearly all the time it makes me hack, like a joint. I don't hack WHILE I'm smoking a cig.........wondering if it could be the PG juice so looking into the VG since I'm going to get a couple bottles of something next week. Could just be the "methol" flavor I suppose...[/QUOTE]
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I have read that PG will coat your throat. That could be why you are having this problem. Smart move going to VG.:)
 

DaveP

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I tend to vape mostly VG liquids because I don't care for harsh TH and I like the thicker vapor from VG. I mix drops from both in a cart frequently. I'll add a drop of PG chocolate or vanilla intermixed with a VG tobacco flavor to modify the taste and thin the juice.

It's strange that some PG and some VG juices are smooth and others are harsh throat hits. Another thing that enters into the equation is nicotine content. I smoked 2 packs of Doral Ultra lights a day before vaping. That got me .1 x 40 or 4mg of nic a day. I'm vaping 24mg. At first, after I started vaping, I would get dizzy if I smoked an ultra light. The effect is not so much as it once was. I think I am actually getting more nic now than I did when I was smoking, although my lungs have cleared up and I can inhale and exhale completely with no wheeze! I can also run up and down stairs without having to stop and catch my breath or wait for my heart rate to slow back down. Anything that allows an old smoker to do that can't be bad.

I plan to ease down to the teens in nic and maybe lower as I experiment with nic levels. My next order with include some PG no-nic favorite flavors to mix with my 24mg VG juces and experiment a with the results. I do know that I can go longer between vaping sessions than I could smoking .1mg Doral Ultra lights. I used to smoke half a dozen with coffee before I left the house each morning. Now, I can wake up, have coffee, hit the PV a few times and not feel the urge to "have another one".

Back on topic, I prefer a mix and I think that will end up being somewhere between 50/50 and 80/20 (VG/PG) depending on the flavors.
 
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CaptJay

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You can use the foodgrade cheapo stuff for DIY - you dont HAVE to buy it from a vaping store.
FWIW I found that I get more 'throat and tongue coating' with all VG than mixes with PG/VG. I'm not oversold on ALL PG either though because the TH is too much for me personally. I mostly go for 80/20 on the PG/VG ratio which seems to work well.
There is an alternative to both of these called PEG, but I don't think there are many (at least I haven't heard of any) suppliers who use it in juices.
 

buttersmom

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ewwww lol PEG from Wiki:
Polyethylene glycol (PEG) is a polyether compound with many applications from industrial manufacturing to medicine. It has also been known as polyethylene oxide (PEO) or polyoxyethylene (POE), depending on its molecular weight, and under the tradename Carbowax.

PEG is just a prefix for some things 'tho - PEG50 is Shea Butter :)
 
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