Please help with question to Provape-Battery Voltage

[Moodyfisherman]

So I sent this email to Provape about the Check Battery (CB) menu voltage funtion reading compared to a voltmeter/battery charger voltage difference.

"A few months ago the low battery light would flash a lot sooner than it would normally and I would put it on the charger and put in a fresh charged battery. Next day the battery low light would start flashing and same scenario, I would replace with fresh battery.
So I checked the voltage on the Provari V2.5 before it went into the non digital charger (bought in the start up package) and it would be 3.2 - 3.4 volts. I thought the batteries were draining faster than usual but were only 4-months old. So I check each battery with a voltmeter and they were all at 4.1-4.2 volts off the charger but when checked on the mod they were showing 3.8-or lower volts?
Now I have a digital Xtar VP1.....batteries charge to 4.2volts @.5amps charge rate every time....voltmeter is 4.2 volts but the mod shows 3.8volts +or- everytime??"

Their response:


Hi Terry,
I would be happy to help you with this!
Our batteries will provide a full charge reading of 4.1 or 4.2, although these are 3.7 volt batteries. The surface charge exceeds the usage charge by about 0.4 volts. Due to this, you will see the voltage drop quickly between the original reading of 4.1 or 4.2 to about 3.7 or 3.8 under load, when a carto/atty is attached. At that point, you will get a more stable reading and the voltage will drop at a much slower rate. The thing you want to be most concerned with when checking battery stability is how long a fully charged battery will last before the battery dies and you are no longer able to vape.
I hope this helps answer some of your questions! If you have any follow up questions or concerns, please let me know.
Best Regards,

Krys

My question was why does the battery show 4.2V but when you use the CB function on the Provari why does it only show 3.8V?....Can someone explain what they said please?

 

[twizted]

I think what they're saying is that 3.7 is the ”real” max charge on the battery. Even tho most batteries come off the charger at 4.1-4.2 volts, they won't hold that limit but only for a short time. Depending on battery size & usage, anywhere between 4-10 hours sounds about normal.

YMMV but for me,

18350 = 2-4 hours
18490 = 4-6 hours
18600 = 6-10 hours

Again this all depends on your vaping habits & coil ohms.


Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk

 

[Moodyfisherman]

That makes sense but from the charger to the Provari in less than 30 seconds...
4.2 on the charger LED
3.8 on the Provari CB...

Low voltage button flashing-3.2V
Digi charger/mulitmeter-3.6V....

The .4V difference was my question to them...is the CB function always going to read .4V lower than realtime Voltage checks?

Sorry but my pea brain does not compute

 

[twizted]

When your battery reaches a 4.2 charge on the charger it will always read 4.2 because the charger is not putting a load on the battery. And if your battery was to drop enough voltage while on the charger the charger would instantly apply a charge again.

Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk

 

[ENAUD]

Moody, I assume you are testing with an atomizer on your ProVari, what ohm is the coil? Have you tested the voltage of these batteries without the atomizer attached? Have you tested the resistance of the atomizer? My batteries all read 4.2 or 4.1 volts when fresh, on all my ProVari's, and this is with 1.4-1.8 ohm single coils. As said previously, the ProVari tests voltage under load, you can hear the atomizer hiss a little while this load is checking your batteries voltage.

 

[Rickajho]

BcuuUUuuuz...

At the end of the charge cycle the Xtar continues to monitor the battery voltage on the display - but not under load.

If you download and read the PDF instruction sheet for your Provari it states that the Provari tests the battery under load, and warns you to have a device attached to the Provari when checking batteries or you risk damage.

So right there you have two different tests which will give two different results: no-load and load.

BUT:

What is going on with your batteries?

A properly working Li-On charger charges the batteries up to 4.2 volts and then terminates the charge cycle. But that does not mean the battery will maintain at 4.2 volts while it sits. As ProVape rightfully pointed out 4.2 volts is not the optimal working voltage of a Li-On battery - only it's charge termination voltage. As the batteries age out the voltage will "roll back" from 4.2 volts farther and faster at the end of the charge cycle - even with no use. Put a load on the battery - as the Provari does when it does CB - and the drop happens purty fast on older batteries.

If you leave the batteries in the Xtar charger for a couple hours once the charge cycle is complete (yes, you actually can do that.) what does the display show? I have some 6 month old eFest batteries that now "roll back" to 4.0 volts in under an hour once the charge cycle is over. They will do that as they wear out. You didn't say how old these batteries are - or what kind - but if you are charging 18350 batteries twice a day X five months of use = 300 or more charge cycles and they are wearing out.

 

[Train2]

Also, just for kicks. Take that freshly charged battery, and use the CB function on the ProVari - WITH NOT ATOMIZER ATTACHED.
It should be much closer. The difference is the battery voltage being check while under load or not - without an atomizer, you should get a reading over 4. Put an atomizer on it, and you'll get the under-load reading (and you'll hear it fire)...

If you had an "in line" voltage meter that checked the battery while connected to a circuit, you'd get that ProVari CB reading, too - but your charger can't do that.

 

[Ozwald]

Also, just for kicks. Take that freshly charged battery, and use the CB function on the ProVari - WITH NOT ATOMIZER ATTACHED.
It should be much closer. The difference is the battery voltage being check while under load or not - without an atomizer, you should get a reading over 4. Put an atomizer on it, and you'll get the under-load reading (and you'll hear it fire)...

If you had an "in line" voltage meter that checked the battery while connected to a circuit, you'd get that ProVari CB reading, too - but your charger can't do that.

Since the Provari fires when you check that, that's not a good habit to get into. Having no load is hard on the electronics.

It's not as bad as something like an amateur radio which you can fry doing it just once, but it's still not good for it.

But agreeing with most of the above, the difference you're seeing is the difference between a loaded circuit & an unloaded circuit. The actual value of resistance will not affect it though.

 

[Train2]

I could be wrong, but I THOUGHT that it checked, found no load, and did a no-load battery check - WITHOUT firing.
Cuz you DO get two different readings with and without a load. I figured if it tried to fire with nothing attached (even under CB) you'd get an error, and not a reading.

Not sure how to find out though - and it's not like I often need to check my battery without a topper on...

Since the Provari fires when you check that, that's not a good habit to get into. Having no load is hard on the electronics.

It's not as bad as something like an amateur radio which you can fry doing it just once, but it's still not good for it.

But agreeing with most of the above, the difference you're seeing is the difference between a loaded circuit & an unloaded circuit. The actual value of resistance will not affect it though.

 

[Ozwald]

I could be wrong, but I THOUGHT that it checked, found no load, and did a no-load battery check - WITHOUT firing.
Cuz you DO get two different readings with and without a load. I figured if it tried to fire with nothing attached (even under CB) you'd get an error, and not a reading.

Not sure how to find out though - and it's not like I often need to check my battery without a topper on...

It would have to have an internal load then. If it did, I wouldn't see why all Cb functions wouldn't be routed through it, atty attached or not. It's safer, more consistent & cheaper to produce since it doesn't have to decide where to route the electricity.

 

[Train2]

Makes sense!
I'm not particularly "current" on electronics...

It would have to have an internal load then. If it did, I wouldn't see why all Cb functions wouldn't be routed through it, atty attached or not. It's safer, more consistent & cheaper to produce since it doesn't have to decide where to route the electricity.

 

[Ozwald]

Makes sense!
I'm not particularly "current" on electronics...

I took some classes & I have the highest level HAM radio license issued in the States. I don't really follow it or keep up on it, but the basics don't ever change. Honestly I'm surprised that they don't have a dedicated internal resistor for Cb. It's cheap & the unit will never have to fire the atty to check the battery. Plus having a set, known resistance makes the Cb function easier in theory... you can't know voltage without knowing the resistance, so it takes a variable out of the equation. But who knows, I've never looked at the board in one or know how they accomplish tasks, so maybe the way they have it set up is for a very specific reason.

Either way, I wouldn't recommend firing it or doing any function that fires it without a load attached.