Question about my mystery battery conundrum.....

[V666]

Hey y'all

I recently went to my local Vape shop, for any Londoners that's smokium on Cheshire street, great bunch of really helpful guys.. But they did sell me some 18650 batteries, and I won't lie, in the nervousness I had at the time about being totally brand spanking new to vaping at the time, I didn't get the full lowdown on what I had actually bought... So now having used them for a pretty reasonable amount of time I have some questions about these batteries.

It turns out I purchesed some 18650 2500mAH 3.7 volt batteries, soooo

1. The batteries come in an unmarked box but have a label with the specifications on, is there a possibility they are counterfeits, or is this normal for batteries like this.

2. How powerful is this battery exactly?

2.1 What mathematical equation should I use to determine how low I can build safely on this battery.

3. 'Bonus question' with this battery and the lovely Excalibur mod, what should I build that will be safe, I have some hybrid drippers that i'd love to try on it

Sorry if that's a whole bunch of questions, but I just don't seem to be able to wrap my noggin around all the terms and the sciences and jargon goin down! Totally willing to learn but sometimes it's easier when someone lays it on the table for ya, plus the advice on here seems top notch and comes highly recommended!

Cheers
Vinnie

 

[suprtrkr]

I am assuming there is no brand name on the label? Any chance you could post a pic? Is there any model or lot number on the battery? Right off the bat-- and bearing in mind I am not an expert-- the only batteries I recall without a manufacturers name on the wrapper are Sony and Panasonic. AW, LG, MNKE and Samsung have their names on it, although it can be hard to tell with LGs as it just says "LG" as the first two characters in the model number. If we assume the 2500 mAh figure is correct, that's about maximum storage capacity for a 20 amp battery; the Samsung 25R has that much and it is 20 amps. I know of no other honest 20 amp cell with more. It would also be mid-to-low storage capacity for a 15 amp battery, and low storage for a 10 amp. Reference to the Ohm's Law Calculator informs me a 10 amp draw at 4.2 (full charge) voltage takes a .42 Ohm coil. Thus, if you keep your builds in the .5 Ohm or above range your draw on a single battery will be less than 10 amps, leaving you not much safety margin on a 10 amp, about 30% on a 15 amp and about 50% on a 20 amp cell, respectively. A pic would be really useful...

 

[dc99]

Steam Engine | free vaping calculators This will also help with building and whats safe. Im with suprtrkr about the picture. If you find one online like it just link the site

 

[V666]

I am assuming there is no brand name on the label? Any chance you could post a pic? Is there any model or lot number on the battery? Right off the bat-- and bearing in mind I am not an expert-- the only batteries I recall without a manufacturers name on the wrapper are Sony and Panasonic. AW, LG, MNKE and Samsung have their names on it, although it can be hard to tell with LGs as it just says "LG" as the first two characters in the model number. If we assume the 2500 mAh figure is correct, that's about maximum storage capacity for a 20 amp battery; the Samsung 25R has that much and it is 20 amps. I know of no other honest 20 amp cell with more. It would also be mid-to-low storage capacity for a 15 amp battery, and low storage for a 10 amp. Reference to the Ohm's Law Calculator informs me a 10 amp draw at 4.2 (full charge) voltage takes a .42 Ohm coil. Thus, if you keep your builds in the .5 Ohm or above range your draw on a single battery will be less than 10 amps, leaving you not much safety margin on a 10 amp, about 30% on a 15 amp and about 50% on a 20 amp cell, respectively. A pic would be really useful...

Pic comin right up! This is the only label on the battery.

 

[suprtrkr]

That could be a Sony VTC5, except the VTC5s are supposed to be 2600mAh and (just by barely) 20 amp batteries. I say this because I use Sony VTC4s exclusively, and the newer ones have a very similar label, except they say 2100mAh. Is there a square, machine readable scan code block on them, up by the positive end? Sony does not intend their batteries for retail consumers and they are not labeled with their name or much of anything else. Does the battery have an even colored green wrapper, with no visible seams? Can you take a pic of the whole thing and the positive end?

 

[Mooch]

Pic comin right up! This is the only label on the battery.

It seems to be green...I think.
Peel off the white label. Do you see faint lettering coming from underneath the green wrap? If yes, what does it say?

 

[V666]

It seems to be green...I think.
Peel off the white label. Do you see faint lettering coming from underneath the green wrap? If yes, what does it say?

My word! You sir are a genius! There is indeed lettering underneath, turns out its a Samsung who knew. Also there is no readable bar code on the battery like some others I've seen, so I'm guessing it's still potentially a counterfeit battery?

 

[suprtrkr]

OK, now we got it. That looks like a real Sammy 25R, with the old green wrapper. The new ones are blue. Here's a link to a real one. The top two lines look right, and the bottom line is probably, left, month or something, and right, lot number. As for exactly what you have... I am not sure. It could be new/old stock when you bought it. They changed colors... hhhmmm... a year ago? @Mooch ? Help! Unfortunately, it could also be a used battery reclaimed from equipment. I am a bit curious as to why they'd stick a label on it to cover the Sammy markings if it wasn't. That's a good battery to begin with, I can't see why anybody would want to hide what it is. What kind of charger are you using? Mine-- an Xtar VC4-- has a readout to show how many mAh went back into the battery each charging cycle. As they age, and lose capacity, you can see they are charging less and less, and use a lower current to charge. That's as good indication as to when to think about replacing them. If you don't have a charger like that, and you're going to use IMR batteries a lot, you might consider getting one. The top brands appear to the Nitecore and Xtar. The Efest LUC is also well thought of. They're worth the money, IMHO, just in the battery care they take and the extra life you can get out of them by taking good care of them. Batteries are expensive, you may have noticed, and dangerous when mishandled. Just common sense to take good care of them. To your top question, however, that's a good native battery, even if a bit old. Keep your builds up above the .5 Ohms I recommended and you should still be OK, even if it is a bit old and has lost some capacity.

 

[V666]

OK, now we got it. That looks like a real Sammy 25R, with the old green wrapper. The new ones are blue. Here's a link to a real one. The top two lines look right, and the bottom line is probably, left, month or something, and right, lot number. As for exactly what you have... I am not sure. It could be new/old stock when you bought it. They changed colors... hhhmmm... a year ago? @Mooch ? Help! Unfortunately, it could also be a used battery reclaimed from equipment. I am a bit curious as to why they'd stick a label on it to cover the Sammy markings if it wasn't. That's a good battery to begin with, I can't see why anybody would want to hide what it is. What kind of charger are you using? Mine-- an Xtar VC4-- has a readout to show how many mAh went back into the battery each charging cycle. As they age, and lose capacity, you can see they are charging less and less, and use a lower current to charge. That's as good indication as to when to think about replacing them. If you don't have a charger like that, and you're going to use IMR batteries a lot, you might consider getting one. The top brands appear to the Nitecore and Xtar. The Efest LUC is also well thought of. They're worth the money, IMHO, just in the battery care they take and the extra life you can get out of them by taking good care of them. Batteries are expensive, you may have noticed, and dangerous when mishandled. Just common sense to take good care of them. To your top question, however, that's a good native battery, even if a bit old. Keep your builds up above the .5 Ohms I recommended and you should still be OK, even if it is a bit old and has lost some capacity.

A most satisfying answer my friend! As for the charger I'm using an intellicharger, my logic was I didn't want to risk overcharging so I got the intelli charger.

I had never heard of nitecore batteries or Xtar for that matter, I'm totally willing to invest in good batteries, the gods honest truth is I had no clue what I was doing when I bought these batteries, nice little learning curve, and thankfully I haven't blown my hand off in my inexperience!

 

[KenD]

The green's are the newer ones I believe.

Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk

 

[V666]

The green's are the newer ones I believe.

Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk

I have yellow ones as well, any idea what those ones are, also apparently samsungs.

 

[suprtrkr]

A most satisfying answer my friend! As for the charger I'm using an intellicharger, my logic was I didn't want to risk overcharging so I got the intelli charger.

I had never heard of nitecore batteries or Xtar for that matter, I'm totally willing to invest in good batteries, the gods honest truth is I had no clue what I was doing when I bought these batteries, nice little learning curve, and thankfully I haven't blown my hand off in my inexperience!

Ah, lol, no. The brands Xtar and Nitecore were for chargers. Your intellicharger is probably a Nitecore. For batteries, I'd say Samsung 25Rs under 15 amps, 50-60 watts. Over that, go with Sony VTC4s. If you intend to routinely run above 20 amps/over 150 watts, get some LG HB6s.

 

[V666]

Ah, lol, no. The brands Xtar and Nitecore were for chargers. Your intellicharger is probably a Nitecore. For batteries, I'd say Samsung 25Rs under 15 amps, 50-60 watts. Over that, go with Sony VTC4s. If you intend to routinely run above 20 amps/over 150 watts, get some LG HB6s.

Lol put that down to massive inexperience! I've got my Excalibur, and a snow wolf to get new battery's for, so LG HB6s sound good.

 

[suprtrkr]

I have yellow ones as well, any idea what those ones are, also apparently samsungs.

The model should appear on the label with Sammies. The top line of the printing will say IXR18YYY-ZZZ, where X indicates chemistry, Y is size and Z is model number. The photo OP posted reads INR18650-25R. His are 25R batteries.

 

[V666]

The model should appear on the label with Sammies. The top line of the printing will say IXR18YYY-ZZZ, where X indicates chemistry, Y is size and Z is model number. The photo OP posted reads INR18650-25R. His are 25R batteries.

I guess I'd better check under the label on the yellow ones as well, I think I need to invest in some battery wrapping as well, starting to get a few holes here and there..

 

[suprtrkr]

Lol put that down to massive inexperience! I've got my Excalibur, and a snow wolf to get new battery's for, so LG HB6s sound good.

The HB6s are excellent batteries, but I do not recommend them unless you intend a *lot* or really high amp draw. They're expensive, for one thing, and their capacity sux big time. The VTC4s are 2100 mAh batteries, while the HB6s are only 1500. FWIW, I run VTC4s in my Snow Wolf and my mechanicals all the time. It's my go-to battery. According to @Mooch 's tests, these can be run to 30 amps without dangerous overheating, although they are technically 20 amp batteries. However, running them over 20 amps shortens their lives. If you're really going to routinely run them above 20 amps-- contest mod or something-- yes buy the HB6s and put up with charging a lot. Otherwise, I think you'll like the VTC4s a lot better. Most people I know don't routinely vape at wattages that high as they do not have stainless steel lips.

 

[suprtrkr]

I guess I'd better check under the label on the yellow ones as well, I think I need to invest in some battery wrapping as well, starting to get a few holes here and there..

Definitely. A hole in a wrapper is very bad news. That can give you an autofire. You really don't want to go there.

 

[Mooch]

My word! You sir are a genius! There is indeed lettering underneath, turns out its a Samsung who knew. Also there is no readable bar code on the battery like some others I've seen, so I'm guessing it's still potentially a counterfeit battery?

No bar codes on the 25R's, looks pretty good. Here's a genuine green 25R (the codes might be different though)...



Does the top and bottom of your battery match these, as best as you can tell?

 

[Mooch]

OK, now we got it. That looks like a real Sammy 25R, with the old green wrapper. The new ones are blue. Here's a link to a real one. The top two lines look right, and the bottom line is probably, left, month or something, and right, lot number. As for exactly what you have... I am not sure. It could be new/old stock when you bought it. They changed colors... hhhmmm... a year ago? @Mooch ? Help! Unfortunately, it could also be a used battery reclaimed from equipment. I am a bit curious as to why they'd stick a label on it to cover the Sammy markings if it wasn't. That's a good battery to begin with, I can't see why anybody would want to hide what it is. What kind of charger are you using? Mine-- an Xtar VC4-- has a readout to show how many mAh went back into the battery each charging cycle. As they age, and lose capacity, you can see they are charging less and less, and use a lower current to charge. That's as good indication as to when to think about replacing them. If you don't have a charger like that, and you're going to use IMR batteries a lot, you might consider getting one. The top brands appear to the Nitecore and Xtar. The Efest LUC is also well thought of. They're worth the money, IMHO, just in the battery care they take and the extra life you can get out of them by taking good care of them. Batteries are expensive, you may have noticed, and dangerous when mishandled. Just common sense to take good care of them. To your top question, however, that's a good native battery, even if a bit old. Keep your builds up above the .5 Ohms I recommended and you should still be OK, even if it is a bit old and has lost some capacity.

I don't know when they started making the new green ones. They became widely available a few months ago.

From what I've heard they put the white labels over the actual battery markings for two reasons...
- To prevent direct price comparison with other vendor's batteries of the same type, particularily for B&M's.
- To make it less confusing to battery purchasers. Most don't really care what battery it is, just so that it works. The basic white labels simplify things.

 

[edyle]

I guess I'd better check under the label on the yellow ones as well, I think I need to invest in some battery wrapping as well, starting to get a few holes here and there..

Holes in the wrapper are bad news if they go in a bottom fired metal tube mech.

btw, I don't think you mentioned what mod/s you are using