So - are we getting it or are we not - nicotine
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Ok, ok, ya found me out, but the snuff is out. My wife said so. OTD and I have discussed this and she won 
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Not surprised then, i r a space cadet.
So we'll see ya from time to time in the Smokeless tobacco forum?
So we'll see ya from time to time in the Smokeless tobacco forum?
Perhaps Exo can do a titration of cig soak liquid so we know the answer.
My guess is that a cold soak for 24 hours in PGA + VG extracts a lot of the nic.
And both the color and and taste are good.
The last I made was 5 cigs of tobacco - max nic 50mg. I let the solution evaporate down to about 2ml so had a max of about 25mg / ml.
About 20 cigs of vaing from just 5 cigs. Even if only half was extracted, that would still be twice as much use from the highly taxed tobacco - and without any combustion products
I'd be very interested in an experimental determination of the nic content achievable this way - and so would many others.
It also makes a ban less likely as it would be kindof pointless.
My guess is that a cold soak for 24 hours in PGA + VG extracts a lot of the nic.
And both the color and and taste are good.
The last I made was 5 cigs of tobacco - max nic 50mg. I let the solution evaporate down to about 2ml so had a max of about 25mg / ml.
About 20 cigs of vaing from just 5 cigs. Even if only half was extracted, that would still be twice as much use from the highly taxed tobacco - and without any combustion products
I'd be very interested in an experimental determination of the nic content achievable this way - and so would many others.
It also makes a ban less likely as it would be kindof pointless.
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Perhaps Exo can do a titration of cig soak liquid so we know the answer.
My guess is that a cold soak for 24 hours in PGA + VG extracts a lot of the nic.
And both the color and and taste are good.
The last I made was 5 cigs of tobacco - max nic 50mg. I let the solution evaporate down to about 2ml so had a max of about 25mg / ml.
About 20 cigs of vaing from just 5 cigs. Even if only half was extracted, that would still be twice as much use from the highly taxed tobacco - and without any combustion products
I'd be very interested in an experimental determination of the nic content achievable this way - and so would many others.
It also makes a ban less likely as it would be kindof pointless.
I recently did a PGA extraction on some tobacco to see if it would provide a viable alternate to the procedure I've been using to isolate WTA. The PGA pulled out a ton of junk that my WTA procedure leaves behind, and further processing was hampered by a horrible emulsion, so for isolating WTA, the PGA was a bad idea.
However, the PGA did at least a decent job pulling out the alkaloids, so for a soak, it's probably not too bad. I'd think that 5 PGA extracted cigarettes, concentrated to 2 mL in PG or VG would be a bit on the harsh side?
DVap, I can see being a bit edgy coming off a run of WTA. Remember my statement?
One could get as easily hooked on it as we were on an analog. It's that good.
Make a great break from the norm treat though.
Why do the NRT makers just stick with the nic? They cant be stupid with all thier resources. It doesnt solve the addiction issues, but sure as hell has less bad crap in it.
I'm doing fine with the snus and vapng. Thunder Frosted is goooood........
One could get as easily hooked on it as we were on an analog. It's that good.
Make a great break from the norm treat though.
Why do the NRT makers just stick with the nic? They cant be stupid with all thier resources. It doesnt solve the addiction issues, but sure as hell has less bad crap in it.
I'm doing fine with the snus and vapng. Thunder Frosted is goooood........
Care to hazard any guesses as to what the extra junk may have been DVap?
So far I've taken to lurking with Igor, but I'm bound to pop up sooner or later
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When i get time I'll maybe ponder how to refine the process. So far, I've ascertained but lost the links I saved due to an unintended Windows restart, of the reasoning, that having some VG alongside the PGA is important/wise.
Will be some ashing of gunk of course. I just hope that the need to do this goes away, but in case, it's worth being ready.
Long long ago I though about 'prevaping' e-liquid to remove dry residues but was worried about the loss of alkaloids through oxidation and thernal decomposition; however, if 90% plus is possible, might be worth reconsidering this as a way forward, with the assumption that most of the unwanteds would not vaporise. (The problem of trapping the 'vapors' is not simple, but again some loss could be tolerated; might even have some benefits over the WTA production method you used - avoiding unvaporisable alkaloids*.)
~~~
* For example, tannins as found in tea and wine are MAOIs but also resins (responsible for tea stains); such alkaloids though potentially welcome even would likely not particpiate in the psychoactive effects of smoking or vaping (at least not vaping).
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So is there any compilation of data for the rest of us to ponder? I am hoping that some suppliment is available to assist. For me it's been 7 months since I had a cigarette. It was easy at first because I had a lot of hope that I had found a way to finally kick the cig. It still seems to be getting worse instead of better. I'm very much dissappointed at the outcome. No one outside of our group has a clue as to what we are going through.
I feel your pain
. I had figured a time of adjustment during detoxification, but as time went on I became more unbalanced and the feeling of wanting, that didn't exist in the beginning, grew to monstrous proportions, leaving me mentally disabled...........Ok, more so than when smoking.
GABA shows promise in reducing cravings. I think TBob said he was giving it a try, so will hear back on that soon I guess. O have some around, somwhere; just need to cjeck the expiration date
ps: or maybe try a tobacco soak as described earlier to get a wider balance of alkaloids.
Btw, if ever doing a tobacco soak, dont let the solution dry too much, it will ozidise quickly them; but more importantly the conventration will increase so be very careful!
ps: or maybe try a tobacco soak as described earlier to get a wider balance of alkaloids.
Btw, if ever doing a tobacco soak, dont let the solution dry too much, it will ozidise quickly them; but more importantly the conventration will increase so be very careful!
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GABA shows promise in reducing cravings. I think TBob said he was giving it a try, so will hear back on that soon I guess. O have some around, somwhere; just need to cjeck the expiration date
I'm looking forward to learning of his GABA test run. He seems to be the most likely candidate test its potential
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Kin, point me in the right direction for info regarding the GABA supplements please.
Preferably something written on a level I can understand
GABA sources, supplement vs natural.
Accepted usage and dosage, that kind of thing.
I've only done a quick search or two, but I'm either getting sales sites or medical papers that are written in language way over my head.
Have I missed IANAN?
I bought GABA at my local health food store, where I get my other stuff. The store did not have a powder form, which I've seen advertised on the Internet, but did have 500mg lozenges that dissolve in the mouth. Bingo, just like my Stonewall pellets. So I've been using three lozenges a day. (And I often have a GABA and Stonewall dissolving at the same time. At night, I dissolve a GABA and 5mg melatonin sublingual at the same time.)
I have no idea whether I need to wait days or weeks for any effect to be felt, or whether there should be a quick response as it is being absorbed. Whatever, I can't say I'm feeling anything yet. I'm sure I'm not harming myself, so I'll continue to take these, along with my niacin (to counter vasoconstriction) and melatonin.
My present routine, using any nicotine alternative that I want at the moment, is doing a good job of keeping cravings in check. But I certainly understand the increasing desire to return to the old satisfaction of cigarette smoking. I, too, thought it would pass. The nicotine would leave my system in a few days; I'd forget the "habit" part; and I'd be an ex-smoker.
Forget it! Didn't work that way for me. And many others I've spoken with who still wanted cigs after five years, 10 year, 37 years in one case. And some went back. So we're like the alcoholic who can never have a drink. We want one. But one will lead us back to 30 a day.
That's where I'm at.
I'm loving the WTA, however. I'll find a way to transition from it to soaked snus in a cartridge when the time comes.
I have no idea whether I need to wait days or weeks for any effect to be felt, or whether there should be a quick response as it is being absorbed. Whatever, I can't say I'm feeling anything yet. I'm sure I'm not harming myself, so I'll continue to take these, along with my niacin (to counter vasoconstriction) and melatonin.
My present routine, using any nicotine alternative that I want at the moment, is doing a good job of keeping cravings in check. But I certainly understand the increasing desire to return to the old satisfaction of cigarette smoking. I, too, thought it would pass. The nicotine would leave my system in a few days; I'd forget the "habit" part; and I'd be an ex-smoker.
Forget it! Didn't work that way for me. And many others I've spoken with who still wanted cigs after five years, 10 year, 37 years in one case. And some went back. So we're like the alcoholic who can never have a drink. We want one. But one will lead us back to 30 a day.
That's where I'm at.
I'm loving the WTA, however. I'll find a way to transition from it to soaked snus in a cartridge when the time comes.
Melatonin, by helping one to get a good, deep sleep can help with anything, certainly with good mood (and sleep being where the brain biochemistry 'resets' and growth and repair hormones most come into play).
Niacin I have experimented with in the past to see if it might help reduce hair loss by promoting blood blow in the peripheries / skin; internally or topically. Lots of interesting science in this too, NO etc.
Best advice I have on hair loss is reduce stress, and use shampoos with copper and zinc.
* btw the niacin flush is a histamine release so unsuitable for people who use anti-histamines; this reduces over time as histamine stores get used up. Niacin (nicotinic acid, vitmin B3) is an antioxidant that inhibits the creation and action of damaging free radicals; it also lowers blood levels of low density lipoproteins (the 'bad' ones) bringing the low and high into better balance (cholesterol is an essential in human bbiology, though needs a god balance of the high and low types to balance their transportation roles) and triglycerides (basically, fats).
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It's possible it could take up to a month before you're aware of a difference, but I would think within a couple weeks.
Interesting and disheartening to hear you say this. But the fact seems that no matter what we do, something is still out of place and that something squeezes tighter and tighter as time goes on
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Y
I believe some don't realize, yet. I know I didn't 'til on down the line. Most likely I never would have if my mind had the ability to make the turn instead of going straight at the curve...if ya know what I mean....
I have to agree with that statement TV. I have found myself somewhat shamefacedly admitting that I have not yet quit all analogs. I really want to do so, but..........
Hey, don't be ashamed. If I get to a point that I need to suppliment with an analog I will. As it stands I'm experimenting like OTD and his rowdy friends and finding relief in snus. So far so good, but as TBob shows, the search for completeness goes on. Some do fine with just the nic and I'm happy for them, but I'm not one of them. Wish I was. Some of us need the mind adjusting, self medicating, psychoactive effects of tobacco. Our only recourse is prescription drugs and I'm not interested. I've read many of your posts and I, as well as everyone else who've found this thread as a parking spot, understand. And remember that, most likely, many throughout this forum who are part of the "what's your problem" crowd are going through the same as us
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