I didn't say all clones were bad or horrible, I said a lot of times authentics are going to be made better and with anything a knock off has the chance to have better quality, but it's not as likely. Are all authentics perfect or great quality? NO! The point I was making is that alot of clones exist in any market and there's people willing to pay for it, you and other people in the vape community may not get why people by authentics, like I don't get why people by clones in other markets. I would rather have an original rather than a clone no matter what it is or even if the clone version is better quality, if I can't afford the original or aren't willing to pay a high price tag for that product whatever it might be I'd buy an authentic product at a lower price point.
The (polite) Clone/Authentic discussion! :D
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I didn't say all clones were bad or horrible, I said a lot of times authentics are going to be made better and with anything a knock off has the chance to have better quality, but it's not as likely. Are all authentics perfect or great quality? NO! The point I was making is that alot of clones exist in any market and there's people willing to pay for it, you and other people in the vape community may not get why people by authentics, like I don't get why people by clones in other markets. I would rather have an original rather than a clone no matter what it is or even if the clone version is better quality, if I can't afford the original or aren't willing to pay a high price tag for that product whatever it might be I'd buy an authentic product at a lower price point.
I agree about the lower priced authentics. For example the Infinite CLT. Very well made and a steal for 34.99. Not too many originals are lower priced, so that's why we go for clones of the higher priced products.
I have 3 RDAs that are clones, the first one I bought was a Nimbus clone not sure who made it, and I didn't know about clones or what the hell a Nimbus was but it was cheap so I bought, since I was testing out mechs and rebuildables, but compared to the authentic it wasn't even half of the quality, the material, thickness of the base, post, and cap was all of lesser quality. I also bought 2 Infinite clones, one was made pretty good it wasn't bad quality, but not as good compared to the authentic, the other Infinite clone I got was a complete POS, the metal was supper thin, the post holes weren't even leveled with each other and the airflow holes were not centered or evenly spaced.
There are more and more coming out now, Sigeli has authentic RDAs for $15-30 and there's been UD igo-l and igo-w line and there are more like that around, same with mechanical mods, but many people chose to buy a clone anyway over an affordable authentic product.
I can't speak for everyone, but if there's a nice rda that I want, and it's $100+ but the clone is ony $24.99, I'm gonna go with the clone. If there's an original rda for $30, of course I'm not gonna buy the clone 
There's nothing wrong with a cheaper purse, if you like it and it works and is good material why not? Yes, everyone has a different mentality, like I buy aunthetic mods and RDAs and drip tips but I buy the cheaper high end pieces, and coming from clones it feels good to say mine is authentic. Same is if you ever bought or was given a Gucci bag, while your bag worked great and the price was probably very reasonable, for some reason it's more of a proud feeling you get when it comes to owning a nice original product.
It depends how much you like something, that some people will get and others won't why others will pay so much, there are many people out there that have brand preference and name brands, while others don't. There are many people who will never use anything that's a clone or replica and there are many who couldn't care less.
I personally don't care if 90% of people on ECF use clones, that's their choice, and their money. I myself would rather have a few good authentics than 5-50+ clones especially how new authentics that are coming out are becoming more reasonable compared to $200+. Honestly I must of purchased $300+ on clones that just sit they don't ever see rotation anymore, but I can't put someone down for owning a clone. It's just not my preference, if I could I would trade all my clones for 1 authentic mod, but that's not likely to happen.
I can't speak for everyone, but if there's a nice rda that I want, and it's $100+ but the clone is ony $24.99, I'm gonna go with the clone. If there's an original rda for $30, of course I'm not gonna buy the clone
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I'll pay a decent price for an original, but if it's so far apart that I can't consider it, I'll find the best clone I can and hope it works well. Like has been said, even originals can have issues.
I get it, especially the pride of having a high-quality original. I am never one of the people that say "it's sillly, or wrong" or whatever. If I could afford it I'd probably buy more top of the line originals. Someday I'd like one, but I have no problem with clones either, and I see where they suit their purpose. I know, right now, I can't see myself paying for a high-priced original for the reasons I stated,... however, I sure can appreciate a beautiful authentic Panzer and I drool over the up-coming ProVari V3... sigh... hahaha. I can definately appreciate them.
Re-reading that I realized I didn't really explain that correctly and it sounded like I was double talking in a way.... I mean that while sure, I could scrimp and save for a high priced mod right now, but it wouldn't be reasonable for me, and my 'old-timers' mentality won't let me spend that kind of money on something that I can get a decent version of much cheaper---WHEN I have other needs that the money should go to.
IF money were not an issue and I had several hundred dollars in disposable savings... ProVari here I come... haha.
If someone is getting their first mech or rda and have never used one, I have no problem telling someone to test out a clone since if they don't like it, it won't hurt as much losing out money, unfortunately clones don't have a good resale value if any. Myself I was smoking about a 7-8 pack a week at around $6.xx-7.50 a pack so I was spending about $45-60 a week on cigarettes not including lighters, gum, cologne etc. With DIY, I spend only maybe $2 a day, and a mod being $200 or less is less than 1 month of buying cigarettes a disposable product, for me I can rationalize the higher expense.
Just as an example:
Pretending a pack is $5, (which I know some people pay less or more, but just as medium) and a person smokes a pack a day for a year.
$1,825 a year
$5,475 for 3 years
$9,125 for 5 years
$18,250 for 10 years
+ any additional expenses that are involved with smoking ie: lighters, butane, lighter fluid, mints, cologne etc
Of course people who can buy cartons will have a lower yearly cost.
So for certain users who say they smoked 2 packs a day for 5+ years and say they can afford it but, say they can't justify spending $200 on a device, makes no sense to me.
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I use that cost analysis too for people who complain about the startup (and sometimes on going cost of vaping) HOWEVER,
I was one of those cheapos tho escaped to roll your own when taxes went into hyper drive and for a long time only spent about $12 a month on my cigarettes (yeah they were crap, but Ifigured if I was going to kill myself, I wasn't going to break my wallet to do it) even when the government in its infinite wisdom decided to tax loose tobacco aand tubs the same as cigarettes, it still only cost me about $50 a month compared to what would have been $150 a WEEK in the chicago area for name-brand massproduced cigarettes.I don't really care about the costs of vaping. For me it's worth the health benefits. However, I still at this point in time can't afford the higher priced originals. I have nothing against them, or the people who want them as long as they respect my choices and abilities at the moment as well.
The few cheaper authentic mods I've held in my hand (like the magneto) didn't impress me with their build quality like my panzer clone did, and cost $25 more. Like I said earlier, I have no brand loyalty or preference. What matters to me are build quality: is it machined well with good materials and does it function correctly, and aesthetics: do I like the way it looks and feels in my hand? Hindsight I wouldn't have gotten the nemy clone (nothing wrong with it, it functions like a champ, there are just other mod styles I like better), but I really desired trying out the mech world, and even among clones I couldn't have gotten a better deal on all the equipment I needed to get started. I basically paid the store cost, because I was ready to buy a K100 and the guy knew I would be more happy with the nemy, so he threw together a kit with the nemy instead, and I paid less for the whole kit then the price tag that was on the nemy. All that being said, if there is an authentic in the $30 range that I like the quality of, and the design of, yes I would happily purchase that instead. Clones are popular because they are based on tried and true popular designs. Even for someone like me who couldn't care less about brand/status, a good quality clone usually fits the bill better. The design is popular for a reason. I've been in b&m vape shops where the workers there are using quality clones over cheaper authentics, and will tell you up front that they are clones, because the clone they are using works better then the low cost authentics they carry. So for the same price tag, which will I, who am seriously limited in funds, choose? The one that gives ME the better vape experience. I capitalize me because vape experience is a personal thing that numbers and facts have little to do with, can't quantify personal feelings. Some people adore the nemy, but while they both hit close to the same, and my nemy uses better silver plaited contacts, I much prefer my panzer clone. Someday I plan to upgrade my contacts....i hear there is gold plaited ones available for the panzers, but that won't be for awhile, still recovering from the impulse purchase of said panzer clone.
I don't hate on people for buying authentics, if my finances would support it I would do the same if the mod met my criteria. I just hate when authentic users hate on those of us who buy clones. Especially if side by side my clone will perform just as good, and sometimes better then their expensive authentic mod.
I don't hate on people for buying authentics, if my finances would support it I would do the same if the mod met my criteria. I just hate when authentic users hate on those of us who buy clones. Especially if side by side my clone will perform just as good, and sometimes better then their expensive authentic mod.
I use that cost analysis too for people who complain about the startup (and sometimes on going cost of vaping) HOWEVER,
I don't really care about the costs of vaping. For me it's worth the health benefits. However, I still at this point in time can't afford the higher priced originals. I have nothing against them, or the people who want them as long as they respect my choices and abilities at the moment as well.
Ok, you're case is different than many vapers who were heavy ex smokers, but, the ones who can't justify $200 that were buying a pack a day for years. When I think about it for myself, I can't justify buying enough cigarettes when I could of bought a new cheap car or several used cars as a more drastic example to show how much money was wasted. I know some clones aren't the cheapest but for those people complaining about $40-60 mods when they can afford it is a bit silly to me since many people will buy tons of cheap clones in excess.
Cheapo...hmmm!!! Like me and many DIY juice people trying to save money.
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Is that directed to me? Because, I'm not putting anyone down for buying a clone. I have purchased some in the past, it's just not for me.
That wasn't directed at anyone.....i always quote their post if I am. It was just a general statement on my feelings of the issue
Authentics and the attitudes that go with them remind me of some of the most rude and inconsiderate Harley Davidson enthusiasts I've interacted with. The kind of jerks who hate on guys with anything that isn't a Harley, and generally consider themselves superior for spending more money for the same or less performance. Not that everyone who owns a Harley or a high end authentic is a raging jack hole, just enough of them to become a cliche and make me feel vaguely dirty for owning any of the same things.
I bought clones because they allowed me to get into mechs and rebuildables with 2 kayfuns and charger and batteries for $120 vs $200+ for the authentic mech $180-200 for two kayfuns and then $20 for batts, $20 charger and then shipping = $440-460 +- sure I smoked more than that in a a year but what people seem to be foregetting is that we don't have that extra 1800 a year that we would've saved from quitting available the day we quit.....for me I usually only have an extra ~50-$100 after my bills are paid. So yes I guess I could've saved up for a couple months and bought authentics but I enjoy having any extra dollar I can because I never know when an emergency might come up. But I usually shop cheaply for everything harbor freight , wally world, etc, except maybe my shoes or car but I do my research most of the time, I really have no dog in this fight and honestly don't care if ppl buy authentics or clones. I just enjoy savings.....
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Gah! Harley owners drive me nuts! What does it mean when a Harley isn't leaking oil? It means it's out of oil.
What does it mean when a Harley isn't leaking oil? It means it's out of oil. 
I'd definitely buy the authentic, and give credit to the original creator of the design, especially if it's good quality and a good performer. I personally don't buy clones to support cloners, or "stick it to the man"
. If I appreciate an original design, and the authentic is worth the price, I wouldn't hesitate to give my money to the creator. Because they are professional, and are trying to give the consumer the best price, I LOVE when a manufacturer sacrifices to give the consumer an awesome deal, rather than the consumer sacrificing to give the manufacturer a good deal. I mean in every other (American) business, it's almost an economic business law to "compete FOR the consumer". That was one of the (few
) things I took away from my economics classes I took last semester, is that competition is good for a business, and especially the CONSUMER. I almost look at it like any other business model; it's a dog-eat-dog world, and if you don't offer the better deal, unfortunately everyone will realize that, and you'll be "eaten". I will gladly pay extra for quality, in fact I welcome that, but if the quality doesn't relatively match up with the price, then someone is most likely making extra money off of you.I'm not on either "side of the fence"
, in fact their are few clones that I own, because they are often "cheap" quality-wise, BUT if find a clone that's performs the same or better, for a fraction of the price, that's simply a better deal, and someone out there put in some effort to compete (harder) for my mulah!
I hate the Igo-W personally, it's terrible, and the CLT kicks the crap out of it in almost every way. (It's a decent atty for those that like it don't get me wrong.) I simply find the best performing atty I can find to put on top of it
.That at the moment is the (authentic) Asmodus RDA, and it's a KILLER setup. Even if the asmodus clone was known to be just as good, I'd still end up buying the original, because I believe Asmodus has an amazing design, that is different than the run-of the mill atty.
To me, this is where we may differ brother, just because an atty is authentic, DOES NOT, guarantee that it's better/more impressive in any way. The Igo's are a perfect example of that ironically, they are all authentic, but frankly I've never liked any of them besides the Igo w14 & original w2 (discontinued), and even that had a post that would spin when I built hard on it. They are an original company, that sell mediocre atty's. 90% of the clones I've ever bought we're all miles better than the Igo's I've tried.
I'm an authentic LOVER, there's nothing I like more than an original design, in which I can pay tribute to the creators of that intellectual property. But if the quality standards don't pass my rigorous tests, and I deem it to be "over-priced", then I'll most likely end up trying the clone for a better price (if aforementioned clone passes my standards as well, I won't buy a crappy product, no matter the cost.). Some recent authentics that have blown my MIND for price to quality ratio recently are the; Odin RDA, and the 454 block. AMAZING atty's for under 80$!
I'm not cheap, I just research my .... off to find the best, period. But if for some reason a $20 atty is my ultimate favorite at the time, you bet your bottom dollar I'll put it on top of my 500$ atty. I mean why not if it's your favorite atty? Are you afraid someone will scoff at you, or it'll ruin the "coolness" of your setup?
all these people talking about voltage drop this and voltage drop that, how they have to have silver plated oxygen free copper pins and hi conductivity mod tubes....
ever consider that the batterys positive and negative contact surfaces are just plain old steel and maybe some chromium on it??? theres your FIRST voltage drop and most likely the worst one to deal with.... so in effect, all that hi end stuff in your mod is doing what????
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