Thoughts on Vaping from an old man.

[Grimwald]

Unfortunately I'm one of the old guys who didn't stop soon enough, but I'm not quite bad enough for oxygen. I now have "ologists" (cardi and pulmon). The ologists say that vaping for the last 5 years was the best thing I could have done.

What always griped me was the media (with the help of cloud chasers). Every news program designed to demonize vaping has "the good doctor" on one side with his white lab coat a stethoscope, (why does a white lab coat make you an expert), and the guy who runs the local vape shop with piercings, tattoos and a backwards baseball cap. Who do you think an uniformed public is going to believe.

Give me a grey haired guy in a suit with life experiences and I'll counter that doctor in the lab coat.

 

[vapdivrr]

I know alot say that the clouders on utube are just a small fraction, but at least in my area they are not. 90 percent of the vapors I see in my town are just like what I see on utube and I believe it's a growing number. Besides the ridiculous clouds, it's also the sound, that sucking, slurping air sound that goes along with dl inhales is just as annoying to me, so you have someone looking like a chimney and sounding like they are smoking the funny stuff...I agree, it is ruining the vaping image . Personally I feel if your doing something that is kind of bad for you (I know it's many many times safer then cigs, but it still is not entirely good for you) why show it off? I'm proud that I quit cigs but I'm still not proud I'm doing something unhealthy and to publicly over show this, is kind of strange to me. I know it's not as bad as drinking alcohol, but if you had to drink all the time, people kind of hide it, I mean bad habits are not usually shown off. To me, inconsiderate cloud blowing is like having a nic patch competition, to see how many you can fit on your body, or seeing how many nicoret gums you can put in your mouth and spitting out large amounts if saliva or having a alchol drinking competition to see how much vomit you can produce.

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[sofarsogood]

I would like to give you some background on me. I am 71 years old and have smoked since I was 13. I quit tobacco 5 years ago and turned to vaping. Before that I was a 4 pack a day cigarette smoker then switched to a pipe while in the Army and smoked 42 years inhaling the pipe. Fortunately my lungs are clear and have not contracted COPD. I found 2 of my best friends dead in their homes. I was the first person to find them. They died 3 years apart. There is a legion of gray haired people who can be of assistance in countering the FDA. The vaping community is ignoring us.
I sit at the VA and see many of my fellow veterans on oxygen and know there are many more who will be in that state in the future. The vaping community is now in the hands of the young and I feel you are destroying the benefits of getting people to quit tobacco. The vaping community is turning into a cult. I am not insulting the community but looking at it from the perspective of one person on the outside looking in.
Do you want the older, gray haired grandpa and grandma's on your side then take a good hard look at the vaping community. Go on YouTube and all you see are wanna be Grimm Greens and Pete(Phil) Busardo's. Some of them need to be strangled to be honest. I would do it but it's only a video. Nick Green changed his format and has also gone over to the dark side.
So if you want to help the vaping community get the Baby boomers on your side. Get Grandma and Grandpa into vaping. You will have them around for much longer and hopefully you never have to see them on oxygen. It is an ugly thing.
Me, criticize me if you want. I don't care. I care about getting people off tobacco and the way I see it the message being given is not a positive one. Thanks for listening .

I smoked for a long time too. I'm stocked up but got politically active because I feel compassion for people who still smoke and want them to have the same opportunity I got. The people opposing ecigs all benefit from the taxes. They have a conflict of interest and need to shut up.

Here's a true story that's on point. Last Friday (June 30) at lunch break a coworker (electrician) and I went to a nearby Wild Bill's tobacco shop where I helped him buy a Pico, Nautilus 2 and a bottle of 18mg liquid. I advised him, if he's a confirmed vaper when the moment comes that he is serious about stopping smoking the chance of success will be much higher. The following Monday (yesterday) after lunch I noticed EMT people in the building clustered around my coworker buddy and he was sitting down, plugged into a bunch of stuff, and looking embarrased. He's already had a previous heart attach. The EMT's told him to go home. He did that under his own power. Tomorrow may be I'll find out if he is feeling more motivated. This is life and death stuff we're talking about.

 

[djsvapour]

I enjoyed the thread opener. Fair play for expressing yourself. Many things I agree with.
Trouble is, I vape a 30w mod with Cubis 0.6 from 9-5 and then for fun at home, I bring out the large hardware. It would be hypocritical for me to argue for or against any type of Vaping. Youtube and reviewers annoy me for other reasons; fake promotion of brands and the distinctly lame self-promotion of people who want to be somebody. I wouldn't waste 10 minutes of my time admiring someone half my age with internet followers until they've done something useful with their lives but maybe (or not maybe, definitely) they have converted a young smoker into a vaper. Can't argue with that either.
Tough questions. No easy answers. Yup..

 

[stols001]

It is all just really complicated. And, (EXCEPT THE COMPETITIONS) unfair to say one style of vaping is better than another... and doing so is JUST caving in to BT cigalikes. I'm just really not big on youtube or really any other social media, like FB, too many ......, I have a hard enough time dealing with the real life ones, though it is useful and my kid has taught me how to use Youtube for demonstration purposes only. I'd be more likely to use it to figure out how to fix my insinkerator safely, than to watch people blow clouds. To be fair, with most of my new vape gear I'll have a gander at some demos/reviews, but I usually avoid the OTT stuff, it's just that sometimes (for me) a picture is worth a thousand words.

The way the media self-selects and pits "experts" that look like.... Well, they don't look like doctors (and most demonstration videos I've watched have been pretty low key, and fact oriented) that's for sure. Of COURSE they're going to use ppl who are EAGER to get in the spotlight, etc., and select someone with Maori style facial tattoos and fifteen piercings, drat it. It's like that show "Naked and Afraid" there has to be some MAJOR tattoo going on or something.... Visual interest or something? They throw in the odd survival expert, but mostly it's naked exibitionists willing to suffer in order to be on TV.

I view it as similar to politics, any vape experts in the media should be the ones who *don't want to be there* and would never seek it out, but that would be too factual and awesome, so it's never going to happen.

BTW, it's not the thread doing it, but I feel OLD (I just threw my back out while dragging my kid around Tucson, which hasn't happened in over a decade. BUT I DID NOT SMOKE, win! Yes, I know. I figure once I get to 30 days not smoking, things will ease up. My good old Higher Power is like, "Learn to deal with every possible annoying situation without vaping, Anna, you deserve it for not stopping sooner." I think. It's working

Anna

 

[mountaingal]

Well a lot of good comes from vaping. I have saved my health and my wallet. It has been 5 years since I had a cig. I think it all comes down to RESPECT, I never vape in stores or restaurants.
I feel a little weird when a child sees me vaping, so I only vape on the streets if children are not around.
I don't chase clouds, but my gear puts out a lot of vapor. (1.2-1.4Ω coil and 16watts. I am considered a "tootle puffer".)
I would say, to please consider, any vape is saving the health of those vaping.
I am 58 and smoked for 40 years. I have some grey hair. Haha

 

[OlderNDirt]

I won't bore anybody with my smoking/vaping history, let's just say I've been around a while.

While some of the youth activities may not do anything to promote the good of vaping, I really don't think it has any major impact on the demonization of vaping. The FDA and all its "helpers" has that well in hand! Regardless of age or gender, there are just too many (not sure what name to attribute to them) ready to point and shame anybody putting a hand anywhere near their mouth and exhaling anything visible.

I have thought myself that the industry is missing a big part of what vaping is all about by focusing on youth. I get it! I understand marketing. But we older folk are a big part of the industry and that should be reflected somewhere, even if minimally, in pro vaping media. Not all of the old set have and use high ohm set-ups. I'm the old guy that spends time at my "local" vape shop and those young whippersnappers delight in showing me their latest, greatest sub-ohm gear.....and I buy and use some of it. They even told me about the 95 year old woman who's helper brings her in occasionally and how her eyes lit up when trying a hit from a Stick V8. She smiled, said "that is nice", and walked out with one.

So those kids, even all the young customers coming and going, have not only accepted this old guy into "their world", but seem truly interested in my participation. There are always some, and not just the young, that "get stupid." That will never change. The rest of us (hope I am in that grouping) better stick together!

 

[Mada]

I would like to give you some background on me. I am 71 years old and have smoked since I was 13. I quit tobacco 5 years ago and turned to vaping. Before that I was a 4 pack a day cigarette smoker then switched to a pipe while in the Army and smoked 42 years inhaling the pipe. Fortunately my lungs are clear and have not contracted COPD. I found 2 of my best friends dead in their homes. I was the first person to find them. They died 3 years apart. There is a legion of gray haired people who can be of assistance in countering the FDA. The vaping community is ignoring us.
I sit at the VA and see many of my fellow veterans on oxygen and know there are many more who will be in that state in the future. The vaping community is now in the hands of the young and I feel you are destroying the benefits of getting people to quit tobacco. The vaping community is turning into a cult. I am not insulting the community but looking at it from the perspective of one person on the outside looking in.
Do you want the older, gray haired grandpa and grandma's on your side then take a good hard look at the vaping community. Go on YouTube and all you see are wanna be Grimm Greens and Pete(Phil) Busardo's. Some of them need to be strangled to be honest. I would do it but it's only a video. Nick Green changed his format and has also gone over to the dark side.
So if you want to help the vaping community get the Baby boomers on your side. Get Grandma and Grandpa into vaping. You will have them around for much longer and hopefully you never have to see them on oxygen. It is an ugly thing.
Me, criticize me if you want. I don't care. I care about getting people off tobacco and the way I see it the message being given is not a positive one. Thanks for listening .

I agree with everything you mentioned except for Phil Busardo feedback. It seems you are now following his channel. He has an identical point f view. He is not a fan of cloud vaping at all and he even decided few months ago to stop reviewing any DTL RTA's and only focus on MTL and equipment that can convert smokers to vaping. Just to be fair to the man.

 

[TedP]

Welcome to the board. I'm a certified Crusty Olde Phart™ myself. I also think the cloud busters are annoying and not nearly as amusing to watch as they seem to think. OTOH, I also tend to ignore them. I am not worried about vaping personally: I make my own juice and can build mechanical mods all day. That's something you might want to consider; at least the juice part. It's no harder than mixing a recipe to bake a cake. Cheaper, too. As in way, way cheaper.

We are in the same club but don't consider myself crusty. We basically all started vaping for the same reason. To get off tobacco. Vaping is a viable alterative to tobacco. When the uninformed community sees the videos and and there is some guy tattooed from the neck to the fingers tips the impression is no a good one. I went to the Tampa vape fest if you want to call it that. It was one big cloud fest. I walked thru the venue once got disgusted at what I saw and left also I'm 71 and don't like being called Dude. I was sadly disappointed in what I saw. Sorry there are more negative impressions out there than positive. I build my own atomizers and mix my own juices . So I'm set up for myself but there is a whole army of smokers that we need to address to join the vaping community. For their health not mine. Those two good friends I found dead in their houses were on oxygen. That was ugly

 

[TedP]

I agree with everything you mentioned except for Phil Busardo feedback. It seems you are now following his channel. He has an identical point f view. He is not a fan of cloud vaping at all and he even decided few months ago to stop reviewing any DTL RTA's and only focus on MTL and equipment that can convert smokers to vaping. Just to be fair to the man.

I like Phil Busardo and know his history. Genuine Kudos to the man.

 

[listopencil]

I like Phil Busardo and know his history. Genuine Kudos to the man.

One thing I think we can agree on is that salesmen and 'media' pushing for high Wattage cloud chasing isn't helping everyone who wants to use vaping to get off of smokes. I mentioned this in another thread today but this last Spring I helped three coworkers get back on vaping and get off of smokes. Not only three coworkers but the wife of one of them as well. They all went into vape shops with very serious intentions and assumed that they had to get the latest and most expensive equipment to help themselves out. They all walked out with cloud chasing rigs, and I'm sure the salespeople were happy to take their money. They couldn't get off the cigs with those because they couldn't produce a vape that felt like smoking. I explained the benefits of MTL and let them try my mods/tanks out...and they've been smoke free all Summer. Too bad the salespeople didn't do the same thing. I'm a fan of Busardo too, by the way. He's really helped me out with his videos and covers a lot of ground.

 

[r77r7r]

I've had plenty time to consider this all having been thru the mech mod craze. I didn't like it all at first, but nowadays I'm not going to demonize people that don't vape the way I do. Heck, if I turn my vape Up a few watts, I am blowing clouds compared to the way that we vaped a few years ago. The obnoxious guy is going to find a way to be obnoxious. We are not the bad guys here.

 

[djsvapour]

I wonder what effect the TPD in Europe will have on the trend towards bigger equipment? I met 3 vapers today out on my travels; all of them over 45 (y.o.) and all vaping mini Nautilus with fairy high nicotine. The older generation seems more cynical about 'unnecessary' power and the younger vapers will soon find out the true cost of running quad coils and 100w. Those of us in it for the long haul DIY liquids, build coils; it's all rather anti the trend to suck newbies into high power vaping. Uptake is stagnant in the UK, I mean almost negative movement which is worrying. In a way the EU government has inadvertently created a barrier that didn't need to exist - they don't understand the harm caused by the ban on 20+ mg and in a way are to blame if young smokers end up cloud chasing when a good MTL set up would have got them off smoking.
Some thoughts, rather disconnected.
Let me puff my lemon waffle at 38.8w and everyone keep posting. Fascinating stuff.

 

[listopencil]

I wonder what effect the TPD in Europe will have on the trend towards bigger equipment? I met 3 vapers today out on my travels; all of them over 45 (y.o.) and all vaping mini Nautilus with fairy high nicotine. The older generation seems more cynical about 'unnecessary' power and the younger vapers will soon find out the true cost of running quad coils and 100w. Those of us in it for the long haul DIY liquids, build coils; it's all rather anti the trend to suck newbies into high power vaping. Uptake is stagnant in the UK, I mean almost negative movement which is worrying. In a way the EU government has inadvertently created a barrier that didn't need to exist - they don't understand the harm caused by the ban on 20+ mg and in a way are to blame if young smokers end up cloud chasing when a good MTL set up would have got them off smoking.
Some thoughts, rather disconnected.
Let me puff my lemon waffle at 38.8w and everyone keep posting. Fascinating stuff.

I have heard that England is very pro-vape. I saw a video comparing England to a very anti-vape Canada and a somewhat neutral USA.

 

[TedP]

One thing I think we can agree on is that salesmen and 'media' pushing for high Wattage cloud chasing isn't helping everyone who wants to use vaping to get off of smokes. I mentioned this in another thread today but this last Spring I helped three coworkers get back on vaping and get off of smokes. Not only three coworkers but the wife of one of them as well. They all went into vape shops with very serious intentions and assumed that they had to get the latest and most expensive equipment to help themselves out. They all walked out with cloud chasing rigs, and I'm sure the salespeople were happy to take their money. They couldn't get off the cigs with those because they couldn't produce a vape that felt like smoking. I explained the benefits of MTL and let them try my mods/tanks out...and they've been smoke free all Summer. Too bad the salespeople didn't do the same thing. I'm a fan of Busardo too, by the way. He's really helped me out with his videos and covers a lot of ground.

You're right about the salesman. I walked into a new vape shop and the guy tried to push an Alien 220 on me. All I wanted was some juice and wire. Like I said in another post all I need is my istick with a cubis tank and .6 ohm atomizer and 30/70 juice and it fits all my needs. Good work on getting the coworkers on to vaping. I doing the same for my daughter in law and my neighbors here in Florida.

 

[listopencil]

What I am seeing right now is that a lot, if not most, of the companies are offering different versions of their tanks. One at 2 ml that they tout as compliant and then a larger one. Sometimes with an extender so they minimize parts inventory. I have already seen a positive to the TPD though. The industry started really paying attention to leaking issues. I still don't like the TPD overall, and I'm going to have to find some tea flavored juice to throw in a harbor if it shows up here.

 

[djsvapour]

I have heard that England is very pro-vape. I saw a video comparing England to a very anti-vape Canada and a somewhat neutral USA.

We have a lot of people on-side. It's a ridiculous game though. MPs stood up and gave account of how vaping can work and yet the non-smoking politicians just can't accept the harm reduction argument. It's almost as if 'quit or die' is still order of the day and people who are supposed to work for us, the voters just can't accept a third way.

 

[listopencil]

You're right about the salesman. I walked into a new vape shop and the guy tried to push an Alien 220 on me. All I wanted was some juice and wire. Like I said in another post all I need is my istick with a cubis tank and .6 ohm atomizer and 30/70 juice and it fits all my needs. Good work on getting the coworkers on to vaping. I doing the same for my daughter in law and my neighbors here in Florida.

I'm happy with my Vaporesso Auorora, my EVOD Pro at 1.0 Ohms, and my NaughtyX at 1.8 Ohms. I have recently gotten into Temp Control and it feels nicely pipe-ish to me. And, hell yeah, keep fighting the ugly sticks!

 

[listopencil]

We have a lot of people on-side. It's a ridiculous game though. MPs stood up and gave account of how vaping can work and yet the non-smoking politicians just can't accept the harm reduction argument. It's almost as if 'quit or die' is still order of the day and people who are supposed to work for us, the voters just can't accept a third way.

Maybe give it some time, I think. Let the culture change. You're ahead of us over there. I'd like to be able to point to England as an example of how to do it. There's a good chance that it will happen.

 

[Tonee N]

We are in the same club but don't consider myself crusty. We basically all started vaping for the same reason. To get off tobacco. Vaping is a viable alterative to tobacco. When the uninformed community sees the videos and and there is some guy tattooed from the neck to the fingers tips the impression is no a good one. I went to the Tampa vape fest if you want to call it that. It was one big cloud fest. I walked thru the venue once got disgusted at what I saw and left also I'm 71 and don't like being called Dude. I was sadly disappointed in what I saw. Sorry there are more negative impressions out there than positive. I build my own atomizers and mix my own juices . So I'm set up for myself but there is a whole army of smokers that we need to address to join the vaping community. For their health not mine. Those two good friends I found dead in their houses were on oxygen. That was ugly

Common courtesy
Common sense
Don't draw unwanted attention to yourself.
My name is Sir, not dude. Respect your elders!
What i do is my business unless I do it in public, then it becomes part of societies business.
If you want attention, become a celebrity or politician.
Vote and fight for your faith, family, and your rights.

Trying to sum it all up without writing a book or making it a 30 second emergency broadcast message with a color test pattern on the screen.

Please continue with your normal broadcasting.

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