Hello all! I have a question regarding titanium coils. I've been vaping for a couple years and recently got into TI grade 1 medical wire on an ipv3li. I'm using the TFV4 rta. I just built a coil at .3 ohms, did some light heating to the wire to get hot spots squared away, and the wire color was blue which I've seen is how it should look. I started vaping and about 30 minutes later, out of interest, I took the rta back off to look at it. The wire has now taken on a grey color. This is after vaping 470 Fahrenheit at 70J on the ipv3. I know the cotton was wicking correctly and it's not like the temperature was heating up, the temp control was doing its job. I've read that grey wire is bad but I haven't come across an explanation why. I know that titanium oxidizes at around 1100 Fahrenheit. My question is, why would gray wire be bad if temp control is keeping the device at around 470 Fahrenheit? That shouldn't be anywhere near hot enough to oxidize titanium. Is there an explanation as to why the color gray is bad when it comes to titanium wire? I've included a picture of the wire so everyone can see what I'm talking about. Any help or explanations would be appreciated!
Titanium Coil Question RE: gray coils and oxidation
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Ti, Ni, stainless steel, Kanthal (iron-chromium-aluminium), nichrome (nickel-chrome) all oxidize at room temperature giving them a thin layer of oxidation that protects the material under it. When they get hot they oxidize faster.
What you want to avoid is to get the wire too hot like when dry burning and the wire gets hot enough to glow. At these temps Ti starts to build a thick layer of oxidation quickly. As far as I can tell the jury is still out on weather this is unhealthy, but it certainly could be so I don't do it. If you stay in TC mode with 600 deg F being the max temp you will not have this problem.
ETA: I did some testing with Ti and posted about it here. As you can see I didn't get any white oxidation on the wire until I was over 700 deg F, but that was without juice on it.
What you want to avoid is to get the wire too hot like when dry burning and the wire gets hot enough to glow. At these temps Ti starts to build a thick layer of oxidation quickly. As far as I can tell the jury is still out on weather this is unhealthy, but it certainly could be so I don't do it. If you stay in TC mode with 600 deg F being the max temp you will not have this problem.
ETA: I did some testing with Ti and posted about it here. As you can see I didn't get any white oxidation on the wire until I was over 700 deg F, but that was without juice on it.
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Awesome, thanks a lot for the info. I figured that was the case but lately I've been seeing people warning against gray wire on different forums without any links as to why so I wanted to make sure my understanding was correct. If you are using a temp control device it wouldn't make sense if TI02 was produced since you shouldn't be anywhere near those levels. I wonder if the oxidation at room temp you are referring to will end up being shown as dangerous in some way as well though.
You're very welcome.
There is IMO not enough information known about these health issues yet to be sure. Chromium can make hexavalent chromium (Cr(VI)) which is really bad to inhale in quite small quantities. That involves SS, Kanthal and nichrome. Nickel can also make a bad oxide I think, but it's been a while since I've read about it. Ultimately it all depends on how much of the bad stuff is produced when vaping, how much is actually vaporized and how deep into our lungs it goes.
The way I look at it is vaping got me off smoking and that was a really good thing for me. My doctor also thought I was better off vaping under the circumstances and is still supportive after 3 1/2 years. OTOH I would never suggest anyone who does not smoke take up vaping as a hobby.
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Nothing wrong with the coil in you picture. Titanium will form a thin passivizing oxide layer even at room temp. That's what gives it a bit of gray cast, but it isn't a problem, 'cause it stays put on the wire substrate. Now if you get it beyond a certain (really hot) temperature, then the oxide rapidly gets thicker, turns white, becomes mechanically unstable, and begins to flake off the coil, like this:
That, you do not want. But that simply does not happen until the wire is glowing bright orange and if your wire gets that hot while vaping, you're smoking, not vaping.
Nothing wrong with the coil in you picture. Titanium will form a thin passivizing oxide layer even at room temp. That's what gives it a bit of gray cast, but it isn't a problem, 'cause it stays put on the wire substrate. Now if you get it beyond a certain (really hot) temperature, then the oxide rapidly gets thicker, turns white, becomes mechanically unstable, and begins to flake off the coil, like this:
That, you do not want. But that simply does not happen until the wire is glowing bright orange and if your wire gets that hot while vaping, you're smoking, not vaping.
Haha, that's for sure! I'm not sure where the information is coming from that has people saying gray wire is bad with titanium, but I've seen it in multiple forums now. Glad to see it's not really an issue as far as TI02 is concerned at least. Thanks much for your explanation!
Yeah, your coil looks exactly like it should. I'm not even sure that there is any dis colorization at all, because the wire itself is grey. The blue tint from pulse cleaning isn't permanent. Considering that many people switch between wattage and tc mode with their titanium coils, I would think that you don't have much to worry about at 470.
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