Using PWM instead of Variable Voltage?

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twgbonehead

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I've read through a lot of posts about sing linear regulators for VV mods, and some using Switching-regulators. I think there's much simpler solution; using a PWM circuit, something like this one:

DPRG: A Simple PWM Circuit Based on the 555 Timer


Most of the linear regulator circuits I've seen here don't use LDO regulators, but even so a linear regulator burns a lot of power (it burns off the voltage, so there is a 1:1 relationship between the current flowing through your atty and the current coming from your battery, if the battery is 7V and you're running at 4V, you're wasting almost half of your battery life).

The second solution I've seen is a switching-regulator module. This is a beautiful solution (particularly in the flyback configuration, since the output is totally independent from the input; you can get 6V from a 3.3v battery, or 3V from a 7.4V battery with the same circuit, for example). But switching regulators require bulky caps and inductors, and tend to be a little expensive.

For driving a carto, though, a PWM circuit would seem to be a great choice. It's much simpler than a switching regulator, and it doesn't waste battery power like a linear regulator. Also, the switch you use doesn't have to carry the whole current; the switch can provide the "+3-+18V" supply (which is very small), the "VMotor" supply can be permanently connected to the battery. (From the diagram above)

As an extra modification, this circuit might also provide a "touch-switch" feature. If you use a very low-power 555 (such as the TS555, available from DigiKey for under $1)

Digi-Key - 497-2299-5-ND (Manufacturer - TS555IN)

you could take pin 4; instead of connecting it to the supply voltage, take it to ground through a 10M resistor. Your finger (between pin 4 and the +5 supply) should be able to provide the 10 pA required (and since you would want to drive the carto shell at +5V, the outer shell of your e-cigg would be at the right potential).

But, even if you want to use a generic bipolar 555 from your junk box, the circuit ought to work well and be really small. The unusual thing about this circuit, of course, is that you would drive the outside of the carto with the + side of your battery, which isn't usually done but isn't really an issue either.

The on resistance of the MosFet is really small (.026 ohms!) and should work really well in this app.

The only disadvantage to a PWM circuit is that it can't boost the voltage; the battery voltage you have is the max it can supply (minus the loss through the transistor). So, you wouldn't use it in a single-battery configuration, it's only for a multi-batt setup.

I'll be working on this, but it will probably take a couple of weeks for me to get it all together, clumsy/busy/lazy as I am. If you try this out and it works for you, let me know! If you want to commercialize it, go for it! (I'd be happy to eval a couple of units <is_there_a_smirk_icon?> )
 

twgbonehead

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Hi, VpnDrgn,

Thanks for the info, one of the (bizarre) drawbacks of ECF is that there's just too much info here! I really did expect that SOMEONE would be doing PWM, since it's an obvious solution. LDO's will help get closer to max power, but still don't solve the efficiency problem. And, as I mentioned above, switchers are the cadillac; I was hoping to provide a solution that was something in-between, and more accessible for DIY. Buying a kit just seems like cheating! ;-)
 

VpnDrgn

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Don't get me wrong. If you can make PWM DYI, you will have EVERY modders attention.

The Darwin reads the ohms of whatever atty/carto you use and automatically adjust the voltage to
hit the selected wattage. Select 8 watts and it adjust on the fly automatically to anything that you
put on it. Including adjusting to changes in atty/carto as you use it.
 

AttyPops

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I think I talked about PWM some in the MCU discussions a while back. It's easy to implement PWM and button up/down logic with a microcontroller. That said, it makes a build a lot more complicated than it has to be. Switching regulators are near 90-95% efficient so why bother unless you have to implement other features. I have some MCUs sitting around, but have not found a good reason to over-complicate my e-cig builds yet. Was even going to implement a "talk to user" interface instead of a readout for displaying voltage. Bah.

The MCU could have buttons for up/down, a PWM logic for "voltage control", read atty ohms, have a data connection for usage statistics, implement a "vaping quit plan", blink lights, have readouts, talk to you, whatever. Remember KISS too.

A 510 and eGo are PWMed. Doesn't even come close to getting my attention. Remember that a switching regulator is basically an adjustable PWM circuit already since it switches on/off real fast. Everything is built into one neat little package for a few bucks.

That's not to say you can't have fun with your build. Go for it if you want to. Just adding some previous thoughts, and of course my

2 cents.
 
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VpnDrgn

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Well attyPops, the rest of us are not e-lec-tronic geniuses. :?:

While I understand 510's and Ego's use pulse tech for better batt life, a talking PV is just ridiculous.
It would, however, be nice to have a module that allows DIY'ers to make their units adj wattage
with the auto adjust for ohms like the Darwin.

I know PWM does not equate to adj wattage but after the stir that Darwin created,
that's how it connected in my head.
 

5cardstud

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Correct me if I'm wrong. I'm going to take a stab at this: The only thing the Darwin will adjust is the voltage which in turn can change your wattage and amperage. The resistance is fixed to the atty you have installed.

I don't know about that but I do know it's a very nice mod.
 

Zen~

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I built a crude PWM circuit using a 555 timer and mosfet last fall... It was a "buck only" circuit that was able to reduce the power going to the atty by reducing the amount of time the circuit was on, relative to the amount of time the button was pushed.

It took up too much space for any of the tube mods I was building, so I put it aside, because I wasn't interested in making a box mod with the circuit in it. On the breadboard, the battery life was crazy good!
 

VpnDrgn

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Correct me if I'm wrong. I'm going to take a stab at this: The only thing the Darwin will adjust is the voltage which in turn can change your wattage and amperage. The resistance is fixed to the atty you have installed.

The Darwin reads the resistance of the atty/carto and auto adjust the voltage to give you the wattage that you set it at.
If you set it at 8 watts, it will give you 8 watts now matter which atty/carto you put on it, automatically.
You adjust the wattage, not the voltage, it does everything else to give you the desired wattage.
 

Zen~

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You adjust the wattage, not the voltage, it does everything else to give you the desired wattage.

Point of clarification... You don't adjust the wattage, you set the wattage... it seems like a small point, but it's not... IT adjusts the voltage based on the wattage you set, relative to the fixed resistance of the atty.
 

breaktru

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The only thing the Darwin will adjust is the voltage which in turn can change your wattage and amperage. The resistance is fixed to the atty you have installed.

Isn't that what I said. I know you select a wattage. But it's done by the voltage change.
 

AttyPops

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Well attyPops, the rest of us are not e-lec-tronic geniuses. :?:

While I understand 510's and Ego's use pulse tech for better batt life, a talking PV is just ridiculous.
It would, however, be nice to have a module that allows DIY'ers to make their units adj wattage
with the auto adjust for ohms like the Darwin.

I know PWM does not equate to adj wattage but after the stir that Darwin created,
that's how it connected in my head.

Dude, it's all cool. I was just discussing it. Laying some of my thoughts out since we have discussed it before. BTW... I disagree that talking is worse than a readout (unless you are hearing impaired) in that it fits in a smaller space. Could be beep/boop too. Or maybe a RGB color gradient. Anything to communicate voltage (or wattage) without a bulky display that takes up a lot of room and requires a ton more connections.

I was really discussing the 555 timer driving a PWM circuit idea from the OP vs a switching regulator. Oh, and I'm not an electronics genius. It is, however, an interesting discussion. And if you want to do the auto-wattage calc reading atty ohms, I think you'll want an MCU rather than a 555 timer chip unless a special purpose circuit already exists for it somewhere. The main point was:
1) A switching regulator is already PWM-ish (not exactly, but close enough)
2) Anything more probably requires an MCU for the extra features (like wattage selection rather than voltage selection)
3) Few feature make adding the complexity of an MCU desirable. I listed some things you COULD do... but why?

OTOH... it sure would be a fun project. Definitely worth it for fun. So is a 555 timer. But electronics projects are ....fun by definition.
 
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VpnDrgn

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Isn't that what I said. I know you select a wattage. But it's done by the voltage change.

While technically the only thing it adjusts is the voltage, it reads the resistance and calculates needed voltage for a set wattage.
VV is certainly cheaper and easier for DIY, but you have to fiddle every time you change atty or carto.
With the darwin, if you like your cinnabun at 8.5 watts and your tobacco at 9 watts, you don't have to worry about which atty you have in it.
I am no fanboy for darwin but it sure would be nice to be able to DIY that function.
The OP and AttyPops where throwing around enough lingo it sounds like they should be able to figure that out for us. :)
 

VpnDrgn

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Dude, it's all cool. I was just discussing it. Laying some of my thoughts out since we have discussed it before. BTW... I disagree that talking is worse than a readout (unless you are hearing impaired) in that it fits in a smaller space. Could be beep/boop too. Or maybe a RGB color gradient. Anything to communicate voltage (or wattage) without a bulky display that takes up a lot of room and requires a ton more connections.

I was really discussing the 555 timer driving a PWM circuit idea from the OP vs a switching regulator. Oh, and I'm not an electronics genius. It is, however, an interesting discussion. And if you want to do the auto-wattage calc reading atty ohms, I think you'll want an MCU rather than a 555 timer chip unless a special purpose circuit already exists for it somewhere. The main point was:
1) A switching regulator is already PWM-ish (not exactly, but close enough)
2) Anything more probably requires an MCU for the extra features (like wattage selection rather than voltage selection)
3) Few feature make adding the complexity of an MCU desirable. I listed some things you COULD do... but why?

OTOH... it sure would be a fun project. Definitely worth it for fun. So is a 555 timer. But electronics projects are ....fun by definition.

My post came across a little flippant, wasn't going for that. Just being a little snarky about all the tech speak.
 

AttyPops

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N.P.

Here's a link from another post where the current topic is voltage regulator options. This shows a PTN0405c in a compact form. Although, most of us can't master breaktru's build techniques, it is compact.

.44 mini Booster Box Mod Variable Voltage

Now, that's not to completely discourage using a 555. Just noting that when done he had it in a 2xAA case. Now a 555 + power MOSFET + ect. will still take up space. I think it is interesting, but I don't understand what you'd gain. Maybe a bit of efficiency? Let us know if you discover a new PWM trick or two.
 

twgbonehead

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Hi, all!

AttyPops does have a very valid point; the PTN0405c is a great package, and since it can boost the voltage it makes some very nice 1-battery solutions. The PWM circuit can only cut the power, so it would be primarily for multi-batt units. Since they've included the inductor in the 405c module, it makes for a much simpler build than just using a switching-regulator IC. (Wish they had thrown the I/O caps in there too!). And I'd love to figure out how BreakTru came up with adding the extra resistor (between pins 3-4) to get it to go down below 5V!

The only drawback I see to the PTN0405c is the cost (particularly since I'd have to buy 3, since I'm certain to blow a couple while trying to get it all into a working unit ;-). (Also, the fact that the on-off switch still carries the whole carto current, and I keep frying the smaller switches I've been using). The PWM on the other hand, can be made very inexpensively, the switch only carries the power to the 555 circuit, and might be more attractive for the tinkerer. I wasn't looking at using an MCU; just the simple circuit I posted the link to.

But now the gauntlet has been thrown down about getting a constant-power unit, so I guess I've got some more work to do (sigh).. I'm looking at the possibility of using one of the trenchplus mosfets from NXP; and maybe using the sense transistor to drive current into the timing cap of the 555 during the ON cycle. This wouldn't compensate for variations in the battery voltage, but ought to at least "flatten" the curve for different carto resistances. Need to figure out how to keep the frequency constant, though.....
 

breaktru

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Hi, all!
(Also, the fact that the on-off switch still carries the whole carto current, and I keep frying the smaller switches I've been using)

Note:
A Mosfet can be added to any circuit including the 04050c for a low current switch or even a touch switch. I chose to keep it small due to tight space
 
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