Vaping vs Smoking

[Exchaner]

If you believe everything in this article is true, than you need to do what is best for you.

You are putting words in my mouth. What I said was, I am not ready to dismiss the article like you seem to...
And BTW, it's not "than", it's "then" - a big difference. Grammar school might help !!!

As to the comment from Robert, I have no problem with what he said. He just repeated what I had said earlier .... duh.

 

[puffon]

You are putting words in my mouth. What I said was, I am not ready to dismiss the article like you seem to...
And BTW, it's not "than", it's "then" - a big difference. Grammar school might help !!!

I'm not ready to dismiss the article.
I've read about it in the other thread.
I like to keep an open mind, especially when bogus studies seem to be the norm lately.
I make decisions for myself.
Sorry about the grammar slip. I see you have just gotten out of "school", and are up on the big differences.

 

[Vaslovik]

A single study is not fact. A press release of a preliminary study, even less so.

These days any "study" is far more likely to be propaganda in support of an unspoken agenda than anything else.

 

[Robert Cromwell]

According to one study birth is the root cause of death.

 

[Exchaner]

Whether one is less harmful than the other is a minor point.

I have to disagree with this statement.

You may be right. I should have said one of them is the lesser of two evils. Still an evil none the less.

Here is the major difference in how people approach the question:

To some people vaping is safe unless proven otherwise.
Others consider vaping as unsafe unless proven otherwise.

To stay on the conservative side, I choose the second approach. You are free to do otherwise. It's a free country.

 

[Robert Cromwell]

You may be right. I should have said one of them is the lesser of two evils. Still an evil none the less.

Here is the major difference in how to approach the question:

To some people vaping is safe unless proven otherwise.
Others consider vaping as unsafe unless proven otherwise.

To stay on the conservative side, I choose the second approach. You are free to do otherwise. It's a free country.

Then stop vaping. simple problem solved.

 

[Steamix]

Where are the reports of doctors treating illnesses caused by using ecigs? Could vaping have contributed to someone's illness? Sure. But those instance, if they have occured, are so rare the public health people aren't able to detect any trend in the population. There are 10's of millions of vapers in the world, a grand experiment as we speak. So far that ultimate experiment seems to be going in favor of vaping.

.

Aye, there's the rub.
Unlike smoking, vaping is under very close scrutiny from day one.
First, because it's the new kid on the block.
Second, because a lot of interested parties stand to loose a lot due to vaping ( i.e. disruptive technology ) and tried - and are still trying - very hard to 'hang' something onto vaping.

No need for tinfoil hats, but it does strike me as odd that all these 'studies' use - compared to the number of vapers available - miniscule samples.

And all too often, the many accounts of the vapers themselves are dismissed as 'anecdotal'. These 'anecdotal tales' could fill a library by now ...

What's stopping the FDA, the CDC or any other institution to invest really MAJOR funds for broad, thorough, and most important, unbiased research into vaping? Considering all the boondoggles that get funding, that would be money well spent for a change.

 

[YoursTruli]

I am not saying research like this should be dismissed, but, when reports like this come out I wait to see what the study actually says, subsequent studies and the peer reviews related to it before I jump on that bandwagon. This one may turn out to have some merit, depending, given the multitude of nicotine studies that prove nicotine has a profound effect of the immune system.

Presently the FDA and NIH, in conjunction with one another, are throwing hundreds of millions towards studies/research like this (and requesting specific studies to be done related to ecigs) and every researcher/college is clamoring for a piece of the action and also to be the first to put something, anything, out there to the public, some, are going so far as paying to have their findings published themselves...
Most so far are just preliminary findings, think about it, how can they not be given the short time span, while others are anecdotal surveys, not actual "studies" at all although some are calling them that, skewed one way or another depending on which way, pro or anti, the survey takers lean.

I say take it in if it is important to you, keep on top of it to see subsequent findings and make up your mind after all the facts are in.

 

[Lessifer]

You may be right. I should have said one of them is the lesser of two evils. Still an evil none the less.

Here is the major difference in how to approach the safety of vaping:

To some people vaping is safe unless proven otherwise.
Others say vaping is unsafe unless proven otherwise.

To stay on the conservative side, I choose the second approach. You are free to do otherwise.

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say.

Most people, including many in Public Health, believe vaping to be safer than smoking.

No one claims vaping to be harmless.

I believe vaping to be relatively harmless, by which I mean I believe it to be about as harmful as walking through an urban area, possibly even less harmful than that. I have not seen any definitive evidence to contradict that.

 

[Exchaner]

Then stop vaping. simple problem solved.

Thanks for the advice, but I really can do without it. If you're trying to prove your wit, you are doing a poor job !!! School yard stuff .....

 

[sofarsogood]

Aye, there's the rub.
Unlike smoking, vaping is under very close scrutiny from day one.
First, because it's the new kid on the block.
Second, because a lot of interested parties stand to loose a lot due to vaping ( i.e. disruptive technology ) and tried - and are still trying - very hard to 'hang' something onto vaping.

No need for tinfoil hats, but it does strike me as odd that all these 'studies' use - compared to the number of vapers available - miniscule samples.

And all too often, the many accounts of the vapers themselves are dismissed as 'anecdotal'. These 'anecdotal tales' could fill a library by now ...

What's stopping the FDA, the CDC or any other institution to invest really MAJOR funds for broad, thorough, and most important, unbiased research into vaping? Considering all the boondoggles that get funding, that would be money well spent for a change.

The kind of science you suggest would certainly not produce the foregone conclusions they want. World wide tobacco sales, $800 billion, the $800 billion gorilla in the room. That value doesn't disappear. It's not lost. It stays in the private economy instead of going for taxes. A lot of useless corrupt things vanish. The end of the Tobacco Age is a super humongous, ultra gigantic--tax cut. It's right up there with two black holes colliding. (I told the boss last week I wasn't late for work because of the snow storm. I got hit by a gravitational wave.)

 

[YoursTruli]

What's stopping the FDA, the CDC or any other institution to invest really MAJOR funds for broad, thorough, and most important, unbiased research into vaping? Considering all the boondoggles that get funding, that would be money well spent for a change.

The FDA (along with NIH) has dedicated hundreds of millions toward vaping related research, the FDA is also requesting specific vaping research to be done, apply within

 

[Exchaner]

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say.

Most people, including many in Public Health, believe vaping to be safer than smoking.

No one claims vaping to be harmless.

I believe vaping to be relatively harmless, by which I mean I believe it to be about as harmful as walking through an urban area, possibly even less harmful than that. I have not seen any definitive evidence to contradict that.

Who is "Most People", and where is their evidence? We have only been vaping for 6 years max - not enough to study its long term effects. It took decades to realize the harmful effects of smoking - close to 50 years. We need to wait equally as long for vaping - not possible in our generation.

You may be right that vaping is the safer alternative, but I need to see scientific proof - currently unavailable.

 

[Exchaner]

Most so far are just preliminary findings, think about it, how can they not be given the short time span, while others are anecdotal surveys, not actual "studies" at all although some are calling them that, skewed one way or another depending on which way, pro or anti, the survey takers lean.

My point exactly !!

 

[Lessifer]

Who is "Most People", and where is their evidence? We have only been vaping for 6 years max - not enough to study its long term effects. It took decades to realize the harmful effects of smoking - close to 50 years. We need to wait equally as long for vaping - not possible for our generation.

You may be right that vaping is the safer alternative, but I need to see scientific proof - currently unavailable.

You can start here:
E-cigarettes around 95% less harmful than tobacco estimates landmark review - Press releases - GOV.UK

Every published study that I have seen that compares the two, shows significantly lower levels of whatever harmful component they are looking for in vapor products, except for the ones where they burned the wicks. If you have something that says otherwise, please share.

 

[YoursTruli]

My point exactly !!

well, not really given your opening statement:

I am always looking for an excuse that vaping is safer than smoking. It's articles like this that won't let me.

New Study Shows How People Who Vape May Be Making Themselves Sick

which indicates a lean toward adopting this press release (because we do not know if it is an actual study as of yet) as fact versus the idea:

Most so far are just preliminary findings, think about it, how can they not be given the short time span, while others are anecdotal surveys, not actual "studies" at all although some are calling them that, skewed one way or another depending on which way, pro or anti, the survey takers lean.

 

[YoursTruli]

...as I said I will not be surprised if they find vaping has an effect on the immune system given the multitude of nicotine related studies that prove nicotine has a profound effect on the immune system, but, the unknown is still vaping a non-nicotine eliquid and it's effect on the immune system.

 

[ShowerHead]

Don't feed the troll folks.
Either they are a weak minded individual, or they have fun arguing silly points.
Doesn't matter which, don't feed them.

 

[Exchaner]

which indicates a lean toward adopting this press release

I didn't really lean towards adopting it, nor would I dismiss the evidence either. Are you dismissing the evidence as a press release?

 

[Lessifer]

...as I said I will not be surprised if they find vaping has an effect on the immune system given the multitude of nicotine related studies that prove nicotine has a profound effect on the immune system, but, the unknown is still vaping a non-nicotine eliquid and it's effect on the immune system.

There is that, and also, WHAT the effect on the immune system means if there is one. There are negative effects, positive effects, inconsequential effects, and any combination of those. Then there is the magnitude of the effect to consider.