Vaping waaaay too much! But does it matter?

[robertpri]

I was watching a video on filling some new kind of carto, and the guy said it held about 1 ML, or the equivalent of one pack of analogs.

I about choked on that! One pack...! I have a 1 ML syringe, and every morning I fill or top off about five or six cartos or clearos, because I only want to do this once.

Then I sort of vap away doing this and that all day long. Since there is no horrible tobacco throat burn or other horrors, I pay little attention to how much juice I vap a day.

I did realize some time back that I was using too much, so lowered my juice levels from 18 to 12 and now to 6. But if that math is correct, I am smoking the equivalent of several packs a day.

But it's not tobacco, soooooooooo, should I worry?

 

[Iffy]

I don't!

 

[studio52]

LOL...well one thing to remember, that over half of the nicotine is burned off before it enters your lungs, so your not getting as much nic as you think...

 

[ericdjobs]

Those sayings.. like "1 cart is equal to 1-2 packs of cigarettes" are totally off-base.

You aren't getting near the nicotine absorbed in the same volume of vapor as analogue smoke. A smoked cigarette is much *much* more effective at delivering nicotine to your system... this is for a couple of reasons... first of all the nicotine that is absorbed in analogue is what's known as free-nicotine or freebase nicotine.. free nicotine is able to enter the system much easier than non-free nicotine... this is why you notice cigarettes having a very quick head-rush and why they are very VERY addictive.

Here is a good article on free-base nicotine Freebase nicotine

The tobacco industry has spent a long, long time perfecting cigarettes into a very effective nicotine delivery system.. one that delivers it almost instantaneously to the brain which in turn increase the addictiveness ten-fold.

Using a PV on the other hand.. we really don't know how much nicotine is actually absorbed. There has been maybe one actual study, and that study didn't bode well (It showed little, if any nicotine being absorbed) but this study is highly contested on this forum, and for good reason. The study used people who probably have no idea how to actually use an e-cig, and they also used a very poor brand of e-cig at low wattage. There has been other small scale tests which give much better results, using people who know how to vape... but one this is for sure;

The nicotine delivery from a PV is NOTHING like a cigarette.

One theory that I think is on the right track is that the majority of absorbing goes on in the moucous membranes, not the actual lungs (as particle size using a PV is quite big) I tend to heavily favor this theory because when I first quite analogues I noticed when I would hold the vapor in my mouth longer/exhale through my nose, I would get more 'satisfaction' from the vape.

One thing that I think is highly overlooked with e-cigs as a way of quitting is that you effectively stop the delivery of freebase nicotine instantly to your brain switching to e-cigs.. this goes a LONG WAY in stopping the behavior patterns that causes addiction. You see, when the nicotine hits you instantly like that, the reward system in your brain gets really confused. Dopamine is released when we do something beneficial (To make sure we keep doing beneficial things) like eating, have sex, etc.. The instant delivery of freebase nicotine from an analogue cigarette effectively short-circuits this system. It causes the brain to equate smoking to a 'beneficial thing' (Because of the release of dopamine instantly after we take a drag) and encourages more and more of it. When you switch to e-cigs, this is no longer the case. You still get the feeling of satisfaction because most of that 'feeling' is hard-wired to the actual ACT of smoking, that's the short-circuit. The minor nicotine withdrawal is taken care of by the low-dose of nicotine delivered by the e-juice. Almost everyone who quits e-cigs after quitting analogues will tell you; It's a thousand times easier.

tl;dr? Don't worry! If you are having negative side-effects from over-vaping, then calm down. If you're experiencing nicotine overdose symptoms, calm down. If not? You're fine! There are people who I'm sure vape much much more juice a day than you and have for a much longer time.

 

[Olef]

One mil = one pack of analogues? Rubbish. Maybe equivalent to 5 or 6 cigarettes.

I vape around 3ml a day. Looking around here lots use more than that. If it isn't making you ill and you are enjoying it why worry

 

[CES]

Vaping 6 mls of 6mg/ml totals 36 mg/day. IF the nicotine in ecigs and combustible cigs was ~ equivalent (and it's not) that would be closer to 1 1/2 PAD ....minus carcinogens and 4000+ chemicals caused by burning plant matter.

I vape 2-3 ml/day of 14-16 mg/ml which is 24-48 mg/day....which is about half the nicotine I used when i started vaping

 

[unsure]

I vape more than I ever smoked and I don't care!

 

[APD99]

I remember reading somewhere here on ECF that the tar acts as a binder for the nic and it sticks to the lung tissue and gives more of a time-release effect, but the lack of any "binder" in the e-liquid means that in order to maintain your nic level you tend to vape a lot more than you used to smoke.

 

[ericdjobs]

I remember reading somewhere here on ECF that the tar acts as a binder for the nic and it sticks to the lung tissue and gives more of a time-release effect, but the lack of any "binder" in the e-liquid means that in order to maintain your nic level you tend to vape a lot more than you used to smoke.

This actually isn't quite true. The tar might bind some nicotine that is released over time, yes. But the nicotine delivered from a cigarette hits the brain almost instantaneously (Cigarettes have been engineered to make this happen, mind you)

This is why there's such a big difference between smoking an analogue and vaping (which we can all agree on) With the analogue all that nicotine is hitting your CNS instantly, WHILE you are smoking.. thus creating the reinforced behavior of smoking.. because your brain links the dopamine release from the nicotine to the actual act of smoking so STRONGLY.

This happens when you vape, of course, just not to the degree it does with cigarettes. When you vape, the nicotine is actually absorbed much more slowly, so your brain doesn't link the actual act of vaping with the effects of nicotine so strongly like it does with cigs (And this is why you'll notice that people report that it's easier to quit vaping.. and why some report after switching to using a PV that there's much less 'cravings' associated with vapeing.

 

[APD99]

This actually isn't quite true. The tar might bind some nicotine that is released over time, yes. But the nicotine delivered from a cigarette hits the brain almost instantaneously (Cigarettes have been engineered to make this happen, mind you)

This is why there's such a big difference between smoking an analogue and vaping (which we can all agree on) With the analogue all that nicotine is hitting your CNS instantly, WHILE you are smoking.. thus creating the reinforced behavior of smoking.. because your brain links the dopamine release from the nicotine to the actual act of smoking so STRONGLY.

This happens when you vape, of course, just not to the degree it does with cigarettes. When you vape, the nicotine is actually absorbed much more slowly, so your brain doesn't link the actual act of vaping with the effects of nicotine so strongly like it does with cigs (And this is why you'll notice that people report that it's easier to quit vaping.. and why some report after switching to using a PV that there's much less 'cravings' associated with vapeing.

And people wonder why I'm so paranoid about BT becoming a supplier for e-juice

 

[bassthumper]

YES it might CONTAIN the equivalent in nicotine as a pack, but YOU DO NOT ABSORB THAT MUCH. Ecigs are actually VERY WEAK at delivering nic. You are fine.
Let's put it this way. WHen you can titrate your nic intake as well as we do, you will get sick before you "poison" yourself. If you get sick, stop vaping. Simple as that. I can pretty much vape 36mg niquid ALL DAY LONG and not get sick. I also take nasal snuff and don't get sick even with both at the same time!
I have quite a tolerance but I know plenty of others that do the same thing (incuding my fiance Ashlee) and they don't get sick either.
MAKE SURE YOU STAY HYDRATED. I'd be more worried about that than anything else at first!

 

[markfm]

The thing that makes cig effects last "longer" is that cigs also contain MAOIs. Nicotine, in part, increases dopamine. The MAOIs slow the breakdown of dopamine by MAOs (MAOI = MAO Inhibiter). Nicotine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Best I can tell the MAOIs and other chemicals are the things that really hook you -- I absolutely like my nicotine (still tend to use 20 mg, 5 - 6 ml/day, probably drop to 16 next time I mix). Being off cigs for a decent time I no longer have those "gotta vape" urges. When I first switched to vaping I remember those hard-core craving times where I had to really vape hard and bump to a 30 or 36 mg strength for short periods.

Since I DIY, even 20 mg of good liquid runs all of $4/30 ml. I feel much better than I did smoking, so am not about to sweat that I vape near 6 ml a day. The plus side is that I've cut my coffee intake without trying -- I now get the relatively minor nicotine stimulant by vaping instead of caffeine from coffee.

 

[Cronus6]

It's like comparing apples to oranges in a LOT of ways.

Watch this : YouTube - ‪What's in a Cigarette?‬‏ and pay special attention to "recon" or reconstituted tobacco, and what they have to say about the ammonia added to the recon. And how that ammonia (and ammonia compounds) interact with the nicotine and your body.

 

[wdave]

I was watching a video on filling some new kind of carto, and the guy said it held about 1 ML, or the equivalent of one pack of analogs.

I about choked on that! One pack...! I have a 1 ML syringe, and every morning I fill or top off about five or six cartos or clearos, because I only want to do this once.

Then I sort of vap away doing this and that all day long. Since there is no horrible tobacco throat burn or other horrors, I pay little attention to how much juice I vap a day.

I did realize some time back that I was using too much, so lowered my juice levels from 18 to 12 and now to 6. But if that math is correct, I am smoking the equivalent of several packs a day.

But it's not tobacco, soooooooooo, should I worry?

The lower the nicotine, the more you will vape. It seems to me you are going in the wrong direction with the nic concentration. Go to 24 mg. If you still vape all the time, go to 36 mg.

HTH,
Dave

 

[Valsacar]

Using a PV on the other hand.. we really don't know how much nicotine is actually absorbed. There has been maybe one actual study, and that study didn't bode well (It showed little, if any nicotine being absorbed) but this study is highly contested on this forum, and for good reason. The study used people who probably have no idea how to actually use an e-cig, and they also used a very poor brand of e-cig at low wattage. There has been other small scale tests which give much better results, using people who know how to vape... but one this is for sure;

It should be noted that the doctor that ran that test is an ECF member (became one to discuss the topic) and admitted the possible flaws in his method. The method he used did show that it can be a safe study to perform, and he has since done a second study (or is still in the process of). In the follow-up study he asked for experienced vapers, using their own devices. He repeatedly stated that he has a true interest in the subject and is not looking to prove anything for either side, and I believe him.

 

[PoSSoM]

Great question, very interesting replies. I started vaping 3 weeks ago, and also have been vaping much more than i smoked. I've commented to friends that "I am taking more nicotine than i ever did". I just assumed it was so, but I do not feel like that is true and never get a buzz. Glad to know that probably isn't the case.

Great information, thank you.

 

[hairball]

The way you absorb vape nicotine is different than cig nicotine. I'm not exactly sure what but let your body tell you if it's too much vape nic. Me?...I don't care how much I vape. Beats the hell out of 4 PAD. I think I average 6-7ml a day by how fast I go through a 30ml bottle. Like I said, I don't care. I'm enjoying it and having fun at the same time looking for new interesting flavors.

 

[lildevil8200]

this question got a lot of great responses and thanks for all the info! i vape probably 1-2ml a day but i started around 4-5ml last month when i first started. now i seem to be vaping a lot again but that's just of the great flavours i got lol

i agree...if you feel sick stop...if you don't go for it but thanks for asking this question because the responses are really helpful!

 

[rolygate]

There aren't that many parallels between cigarette smoking and e-smoking / using a PV, once you get into the chemical side of things. Cigarette addiction is a complex thing and differs from person to person. There are at least three different chemical bases for cigarette addiction, apart from the other possible addictive components (oral, routine, etc): nicotine, the synergens, the WTAs. Some may be addicted to all, some mainly just one of those components.

As for the often-seen marketing that says a cart is equivalent to a pack of cigarettes or a regular carto is equivalent to a pack and a half, or similar numbers, it's just hokum. A 510 cart holds 0.6ml or ~12 drops. Assuming you could vape about 8 drops and about 4 drops stayed in the filler, you must then decide how many drops = a cigarette. Four to five perhaps; so a 510 cart has the usable equivalent of two, maybe three cigarettes. You might be able to double that for a regular carto. These numbers might depend on the filler type used.

Of course, if you take two puffs off a cigarette then stub it out, a cart might equal 40 cigarettes or whatever you like.

 

[Bdbodger]

The packs of analogs here write on the side the nic level . They use two tests one with normal puffing with the micro vents on the analog open the other a heavier puff with the vents closed . The analogs I use to smoke where 1.1mg to over 2mg per analog cig . So at the low end 1ml of eliquid at 24mg of nic would be about 12 analog cigs if 1/2 of the nic was destroyed in the vaping process ( I think it is more ) . Now it takes me about 2 hours to vape 1ml at least ( probably longer) . That would be 6 analogs per hour . I use to smoke that when I smoked analogs but analogs as said are more efficient at nic delivery so I doubt I am getting 6 analogs worth out of it . Not to mention the nic that was suspended in the air around me in the second hand smoke from the burning end of the analog cig .