Vapors need to STAND UP and claim their RIGHTS!

[wv2win]

...........and the one that says, don't be a donkey's rear and blow huge plumes of vapor in someone's face in public because "you can". Look, I agree with what you are saying. I just think like everything else; the low intelligence minority of the group will inevitably ruin it for everyone else. Not that it wouldn't happen anyway but one or a few of them is going to give the anti-vaping community the reason by being unsafe with their batteries or juice around their kids or being inconsiderate in public, etc, etc, etc........just like everything else.

Personally I do not think we should waste our time or effort on the "inconsiderate vaper". They are not and will not be the driving force behind bans and taxation. Before there was one vaper every 500 square miles in this country, Big Pharm, liberal politicians (Lautenberg from NJ), the ANTZ's and the current administration was trying to have vaping banned nationwide.

I have on several occasions politely spoken to an inconsiderate vaper locally about toning it down. But they are few and far between and can easily be dealt with on an individual basis.

We all need to ban together behind CASAA and fight every way possible to keep vaping from being regulated like smoking.

 

[skoony]

hi all,
first let me tell you i am 58 years old.smoked for 40 tears straight not counting my on again off
again,broke again teen age years.
i'll tell you what the war against smoking was like here in Minnesota.
"there wasn't any war"
long before all this second hand smoke drivel became all the rage Minnesota
banned smoking in restaurant only businesses under the guise it smelled,some people couldn't
tolerate it while eating,it was considered boorish,and then of course think of the chillin'.
most every one even smokers agreed it wasn't all that bad of an idea.
i personally know smokers who do not allow smoking at the dinner table.
then 5-10 years down the road the clean indoor act rears its ugly head.
within 2 years no smoking in any government building.
office buildings and work places were next.all those poor people in those high rises can't get away from the smoke "yaa knoe"
then the private retailers were told in three years total ban on smoking get used to it.
there was no debate.it wasn't allowed nor tolerated.any opposed position if heard at any public meetings though
allowed was tightly controlled and poo-poo'ed,if not met with complete scorn and indifference.
even the mighty BT was helpless.they would get fried later in the tobacco settlement.
in complete disregards if smokers private business and even the non-smoking public who couldn't understand
why one couldn't smoke in a bar it didn't bother them.they did it.they didn't allow a fight.
there was no war.it was a coupe.
wrecked the inner city economies of saint paul and minneapolis long before the housing crash.
there still hasn't been any recovery.
how ever,this time is different.this time we are better prepared.have a grasp on the issues
at hand."we have the internet"and the collective power it gives us.
this frightens them.we wont be bullied.lied to,nor run over.
as a side note we are a corollary of the fight going on about who is going to control the internet.
protect children from porn or pornographers?keep you financial info safe?
i think not.this is being allowed to happen so as to scare every one into giving up the only
total real freedom human kind has had,ever,and they are using the same tactics.
i will be the first juice bootlegger in saint paul if i have to.they are not getting another
single penny off me.

mike

 

[Virtual Life]

Smokers rights? I do remember smoking in grocery stores and airplanes, even elevators. But smoking is bad, always was. Bad for the user and those around them. Comparing vaping to that is not fair at all, not even a little.

I will fight against banning vaping, I will not fight for the right to vape in peoples faces. I currently stealth vape in many places where I would/could not smoke. I do not have a right to vape anywhere.

I am currently spending a lot of time around a fragile 91 year old who is convinced my vape could harm her, and is harming me. I respectfully avoid doing it in her face. Right to vape? No, I don't think so. No more of a right than to burp or fart around others.

 

[drummerskey]

Personally I do not think we should waste our time or effort on the "inconsiderate vaper". They are not and will not be the driving force behind bans and taxation. Before there was one vaper every 500 square miles in this country, Big Pharm, liberal politicians (Lautenberg from NJ), the ANTZ's and the current administration was trying to have vaping banned nationwide.

I have on several occasions politely spoken to an inconsiderate vaper locally about toning it down. But they are few and far between and can easily be dealt with on an individual basis.

We all need to ban together behind CASAA and fight every way possible to keep vaping from being regulated like smoking.

I don't think we should have to but that guy who put that thing in his shoe before boarding the airplane and now I have to take my shoes off every time I go through security. They did unsuccessfully try but give them a good reason and it will be a harder argument for those who aren't inconsiderate. Personally, I always found it funny that I had to smoke outside and then people complained that I was smoking outside..............those same people put me there.

People like you and I are rare. A lot of people cannot be bothered to join the fight or do anything at all...........making it harder to win. Personally, I have always thought that the only real way to win the argument is to educate those people in the general public who don't vape so that they really understand what we are doing and why instead of just assuming it is smoking and therefore, not care.

 

[distortoblotto]

I often wonder how many anti-vapors are tobacco lobbyists or smokers themselves.

I also wonder how many of these folks have ever smoked anything in their lives.

I myself, hold judgment on just about everything unless I have experienced it or have done extensive proven research on it.

My only question is, Has anyone ever heard of anyone dying of lung ailments form vaping?

From an ex anny smoker who will never turn back.

 

[Virtual Life]

Besides, it is not about rights, it is about money. Vaping is getting more popular, more money there. Of course government wants to tax it. They see it as your right to pay taxes.

 

[spartanstew]

Here is how I see the example you used. We don't need a LAW to control the very small minority of vapers that will be jerks. The property owner can deal with inconsiderate behavior whether it be from vaping, playing music, talking on a cell phone, etc. The problem you describe is "inconsiderate behavior" not vaping. Although I don't believe you are advocating a law. I agree with you that we all should be considerate and we should try to encourage others to be the same way.

Correct.......

 

[wv2win]

....................................

People like you and I are rare. A lot of people cannot be bothered to join the fight or do anything at all...........making it harder to win. Personally, I have always thought that the only real way to win the argument is to educate those people in the general public who don't vape so that they really understand what we are doing and why instead of just assuming it is smoking and therefore, not care.

I agree with you. That is why I advocate vaping openly in public BUT respectfully. If the only time a non-smoker sees someone vaping is with smokers in a designated area, the perception they will have, based on the information they are given, is: vaping = smoking. I have educated more non-smokers by carrying my PV with me most places, whether I use it or not, so people can see it and about half of them ask me what it is. That is all the opening I need.

 

[dhock50]

I am very concerned about my rights and it just seems that we hear so much more from the anti-vaping people then from pro-vaping advocates speaking out for our rights. It is sad that vaping is heading for being put in the same negative category as analogs. I guess I am not sure what to do, but I believe we need to do something big to be heard and really band together before we lose our rights again. In Missouri they are working on a bill to prohibit teenagers under 18 from buying ecigs, which I think is "ok", but leave the adults alone!!
To me giving up cigs and switching to vaping has been one of the best decisions of my life. I feel it has probably saved my life and health. I have written a letter that I plan to send to some politicians in Missouri, but beyond that, I'm not sure what to do as an individual to help change the attitudes of media, politicians and the general public. It all makes me furious!

 

[wv2win]

.........................I'm not sure what to do as an individual to help change the attitudes of media, politicians and the general public. It all makes me furious!

Join and Support CASAA. Add the CASAA banner to your posts so new people can learn. Order CASAA business cards to use locally. Write your representatives with the good information provided on the CASAA web site.

 

[Anjaffm]

Join and Support CASAA. Add the CASAA banner to your posts so new people can learn. Order CASAA business cards to use locally. Write your representatives with the good information provided on the CASAA web site.

Excellent advice, thank you
I thought the same, but you were quicker. You know, candy is dandy but liquor is quicker

(I am a member of CASAA and I fully support their aims. However, I do not wear the signature. Because my opinions expressed in this forum are my own, only my own and not associated - or standing for - any organization. I do make this clear every once in a while )

 

[drummerskey]

I am very concerned about my rights and it just seems that we hear so much more from the anti-vaping people then from pro-vaping advocates speaking out for our rights. It is sad that vaping is heading for being put in the same negative category as analogs. I guess I am not sure what to do, but I believe we need to do something big to be heard and really band together before we lose our rights again. In Missouri they are working on a bill to prohibit teenagers under 18 from buying ecigs, which I think is "ok", but leave the adults alone!!
To me giving up cigs and switching to vaping has been one of the best decisions of my life. I feel it has probably saved my life and health. I have written a letter that I plan to send to some politicians in Missouri, but beyond that, I'm not sure what to do as an individual to help change the attitudes of media, politicians and the general public. It all makes me furious!

Join and Support CASAA. Add the CASAA banner to your posts so new people can learn. Order CASAA business cards to use locally. Write your representatives with the good information provided on the CASAA web site.

Do that ^^ and prepare........

I am not stockpiling, I am planning a reduction within the next few months.... down far enough that I can quit vaping if it becomes too expensive, illegal, whatever.

 

[Anjaffm]

I am not stockpiling, I am planning a reduction within the next few months.... down far enough that I can quit vaping if it becomes too expensive, illegal, whatever.

Good for you
I have accumulated quite a good stock of nic base and vaping gear. I live in Europe, where the European Union and its mercenary bureaucrats will do its very best to ban all e-cigs except the cigalikes made by Big Tobacco. I have no intention of giving up nicotine - and giving up nicotine may, in fact, not be good for me. Yeah... sure... Big Pharma will have just the drugs for me, to mimic what vaping some nicotine does for me. Yeah sure... but I do not want to take their poison. And if I have to go to the Black Market to live a healthier life - without the poison of cigarette smoke and without the poison made by Big Pharma - so be it.

 

[skoony]

Smokers rights? I do remember smoking in grocery stores and airplanes, even elevators. But smoking is bad, always was. Bad for the user and those around them. Comparing vaping to that is not fair at all, not even a little.

I will fight against banning vaping, I will not fight for the right to vape in peoples faces. I currently stealth vape in many places where I would/could not smoke. I do not have a right to vape anywhere.

I am currently spending a lot of time around a fragile 91 year old who is convinced my vape could harm her, and is harming me. I respectfully avoid doing it in her face. Right to vape? No, I don't think so. No more of a right than to burp or fart around others.

i expect my right to vape to be any where outdoors with no restrictions and in any and all private establishments that allow it.
when in doubt i have the discretion and sense of decorum to determine if its appropriate with out government interference.
a persons right to not be offended does not trump my right not to give a (insert proper nomenclature here.).

mike

 

[Anjaffm]

a persons right to not be offended does not trump my right not to give a (insert proper nomenclature here.).

absolutely

 

[MD_Boater]

Smoking/vaping is NOT a right. It is a Choice.

I would beg to differ on this one point. America was create with the intention and spirit that American citizens get the right to be free in everything we do until exercising those right begins to infringe on the rights of others. Currently, there is no evidence at all that indicates vaping is harmful to anyone, including the vaper. As such, any limitation on our vaping is an unjustified infringement on our right to vape. IF it ever is proven that vaping is harmful to others, then the government has the responsibility to protect non vapers from it. Vapers do not have the right to inflict harm on others.

This really is a black and white issue. No harm -vapers have the right. Harm discovered - vapers do not have the right.

All we are asking is that science be given the chance to make an honest determination. We will live with the results as long as are the result of actual, good faith, research and testing.

Until then, WE DO HAVE THE RIGHT.

 

[CabinetGuyScott]

i expect my right to vape to be any where outdoors with no restrictions and in any and all private establishments that allow it.
when in doubt i have the discretion and sense of decorum to determine if its appropriate with out government interference.


a persons right to not be offended does not trump my right not to give a (insert proper nomenclature here.).

mike

There is NO such thing as a person's right to not be offended!

There are way too many people in the world today who believe in the fantasy of a right to not be offended.

And it is those ...... who scream the loudest against everything they perceive as offensive according to their values or perception of reality.

 

[coalyard]

I'm going to play devil's advocate. Threads like this get under my skin. I agree that vaping is less harmful than smoking but has yet to be proven in long term use studies. Studies show that second hand vaping is harmless but actual use of vapor might be. Plain and simple we don't know.

Smoking/vaping is NOT a right. It is a Choice. In this country ALL threats are treated equal from something as minor as vaping/smoking to things as major as terrorism. Every threat is dealt with until deemed safe or can be appropriately dealt with. It is the way of the world now.

Until the Constitution says I can vape anywhere I will not call it a right. Even driving is not a right. It is legally deemed a privilege.

It only takes one person to start a revolution.

Umm, yeah our (P)resident had it right when he said our Constitution was a document of negative rights; although not the way he was thinking about...

The 9th Amendment:

"The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."

The 10th Amendment:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

People seem to forget that the federal government was formed and permitted by the States and the people, not the other way around.