Volt/Watt/Amp???

[ckn71nm]

Not sure what that means. current is present in every part of the circuit. Power is dissipated across any resistive element.

Yes. Agreed, Current and power are "happening" everywhere in the circuit. Not sure if that makes it clearer. Power is the input, current the result depending on resistance, as is the heat. Current = Heat?

Current AND voltage determine power. P= V * I.

Yes. Agreed. I was talking about heat/energy as in Joules, not power. I know, Watt = Joules/second. But it's not Joules right?

Other way; voltage and resistance determine the current through a circuit. You apply a voltage to a resistor, and current is what results. You can change either of these two to increase current. If you are only changing voltage, then that is changing current as well.

With a FIXED resistance, higher voltage == higher current == higher power. But what you are adjusting is the voltage output. current and wattage are not the cause, they are the effect.

I'm honestly not sure how that is the other way from what I said. "higher voltage == higher current == higher power". Absolutely right. That doesn't explain though why it is power that's responsible for heat and not current.

 

[Mitey F]

Yes. Agreed, Current and power are "happening" everywhere in the circuit. Not sure if that makes it clearer. Power is the input, current the result depending on resistance, as is the heat. Current = Heat?

Maybe re-read my post on page 4... #38

 

[Stosh]

Yes. Agreed, Current and power are "happening" everywhere in the circuit. Not sure if that makes it clearer. Power is the input, current the result depending on resistance, as is the heat. Current = Heat?
.....

Voltage is the input, current the result depending on resistance, as is the wattage (power). Wattage = Heat

In a DC series circuit, current is exactly equal throughout the circuit, there are voltage drops across each individual resistance. This is why a battery's internal resistance will cause it to heat up, also a dirty switch contact will make the switch heat up. The current is always the same, the wattage is split between all the resistance points within the circuit causing heat proportional to the voltage drop / wattage at each resistor.

 

[Mitey F]

Voltage is the input, current the result depending on resistance, as is the wattage (power). Wattage = Heat

In a DC series circuit, current is exactly equal throughout the circuit, there are voltage drops across each individual resistance. This is why a battery's internal resistance will cause it to heat up, also a dirty switch contact will make the switch heat up. The current is always the same, the wattage is split between all the resistance points within the circuit causing heat proportional to the voltage drop / wattage at each resistor.

No.

In a series circuit, VOLTAGE is always the same. Amperage is always the same in a PARALLEL circuit.

 

[roadie]

No.

In a series circuit, VOLTAGE is always the same. Amperage is always the same in a PARALLEL circuit.

Um, no. This is incorrect. In a series circuit, CURRENT is always the same. This is why people use stacked batteries, voltage is cumulative in a series circuit.

 

[edyle]

I actually agree with that. I know that I'm beating a dead horse and we are going in circles again. I interpret what you are saying as: The two intrinsic properties of our setups are the resistance of the coil and the voltage of the battery. We can't change that (once the coil is mounted) and I 100% agree with that, I never disputed that and was saying that from the beginning.

Current and power are calculated from those intrinsic properties. Like someone before (forgot who) pointed out power is happening at the level of input into the coil. Current is happening at the level of the coil itself. That sounds to me like, on the coil level, what in the end determines the heat is the current. Obviously we can adjust the power in order to change the current. But that's all it is. Power is the means to adjust the current in order to produce heat.

Yes, theres the resistance; and you apply a voltage;

Then current and power are the two resulting things.
Now it's not really the power that we adjust; we turn a knob yes, but the electronics takes the power that we decide, and uses that to calculate what voltage to put based on what resistance the electronics detects on the coil; The manufacturers could just as easily made the electronics calculate what Voltage to put if we tell it what current we want; however, the useful quantity is the power to the coil, so thats what is used.

 

[Stosh]

No.

In a series circuit, VOLTAGE is always the same. Amperage is always the same in a PARALLEL circuit.

Quoted from the link below...

1) When numbers of electrical components are connected in series, same electric current flows through all the components of the circuit.
2) The applied voltage across a series circuit is equal to the sum total of voltage drops across each component.
3) The voltage drops across individual components is directly proportional to its resistance value.

Here's a simple basic explanation of DC circuits....and easy read.

Electrical DC Series and Parallel Circuit | Electrical Engineering

 

[Mitey F]

Um, no. This is incorrect. In a series circuit, CURRENT is always the same. This is why people use stacked batteries, voltage is cumulative in a series circuit.

You're right, I'm thinking backwards. It's been a few years since my engineering classes. My apologies!

 

[edyle]

Yes. Agreed, Current and power are "happening" everywhere in the circuit. Not sure if that makes it clearer. Power is the input, current the result depending on resistance, as is the heat. Current = Heat?





Yes. Agreed. I was talking about heat/energy as in Joules, not power. I know, Watt = Joules/second. But it's not Joules right?




I'm honestly not sure how that is the other way from what I said. "higher voltage == higher current == higher power". Absolutely right. That doesn't explain though why it is power that's responsible for heat and not current.

Power is not really an input; the inputs are really voltage and resistance.

Both power and current are results. Using a VM mod might make it feel like power is an input, but it is really just information you are inputing and the eletronics chooses the voltage based on the setting you told it you want as your end result.

Energy is measured in joules; can you put a megajoule in your coil??

Well you can push 1 watt through the coil for 1 million seconds; there's your megawatt; how hot will your coil get?
Well at only 1 watt, it ain't gonna get very hot plus we're talking a million seconds here, so even if the heat could build, it would be dissipating in the meantime.
How about instead put putting 1 watt throught the coil for 1 million we put 10 watts through the coil for 100,000 seconds; (1 watt = 1 joule per second)
Now with 10 joules per second pushing through the coil the coil is going to get warmer than with only 1 joule per second

 

[Stosh]

You're right, I'm thinking backwards. It's been a few years since my engineering classes. My apologies!

LOL -- can you remember when was the first time you ran into Ohm's law in a classroom setting? I know my memory of it is becoming fuzzy with age....

 

[ckn71nm]

Yes, theres the resistance; and you apply a voltage;

Then current and power are the two resulting things.
Now it's not really the power that we adjust; we turn a knob yes, but the electronics takes the power that we decide, and uses that to calculate what voltage to put based on what resistance the electronics detects on the coil; The manufacturers could just as easily made the electronics calculate what Voltage to put if we tell it what current we want; however, the useful quantity is the power to the coil, so thats what is used.

OK, I can get with that. No disagreement here except that I just don't seem to be able to understand why power is the useful quantity and not current.

I hope you see that I'm saying "I just don't seem to be able to understand". I can follow the logic, somewhat understand the physics behind it, and still in my mind I end up with a different conclusion. I guess that's why I'm doing my experiment.

 

[Mitey F]

LOL -- can you remember when was the first time you ran into Ohm's law in a classroom setting? I know my memory of it is becoming fuzzy with age....

Actually, I can but I only graduated 3ish years ago... I don't know if that's a good thing or bad thing in this case!

 

[edyle]

OK, I can get with that. No disagreement here except that I just don't seem to be able to understand why power is the useful quantity and not current.

I hope you see that I'm saying "I just don't seem to be able to understand". I can follow the logic, somewhat understand the physics behind it, and still in my mind I end up with a different conclusion. I guess that's why I'm doing my experiment.

Yes I know;

One way to look at it is like a water wheel? You know how that works? A flowing river/stream, and you have this big wheel over the river with paddles on it and you lower the wheel down so the paddles can dip in the water.

The flowing water hits on the paddles and turns the wheel.

Of course, the wheel is now obstructing the flow, so the flow of water decreases.

Now the real work is turning the wheel.

If the paddles are barely touching the water, there is high current, but the wheel doesn't spin very fast.

You lower the wheel more into the water, causing more resistance to flow, and the current reduces, but the wheel speeds up!

So more resistance gives you more power to the wheel, and you use this spinning wheel to drive a generator to power a village.

 

[eda123]

OK, I can get with that. No disagreement here except that I just don't seem to be able to understand why power is the useful quantity and not current.

I hope you see that I'm saying "I just don't seem to be able to understand". I can follow the logic, somewhat understand the physics behind it, and still in my mind I end up with a different conclusion. I guess that's why I'm doing my experiment.

gotcha. Your experiment will prove more how wraps affect consumption. For that I'm really interested to see how it turns out. I dont think it will tell you anything that hasn't already been stated about current.

 

[edyle]

gotcha. Your experiment will prove more how wraps affect consumption. For that I'm really interested to see how it turns out. I dont think it will tell you anything that hasn't already been stated about current.

I think for the experiment if possible to use a real small tank like a v-nano. Thin and long, and only holds about a ml of eliq; a relatively small time vaping could show a whole centimeter drop in level, because it is thin and long.

 

[ckn71nm]

Yes I know;

One way to look at it is like a water wheel? You know how that works? A flowing river/stream, and you have this big wheel over the river with paddles on it and you lower the wheel down so the paddles can dip in the water.

The flowing water hits on the paddles and turns the wheel.

Of course, the wheel is now obstructing the flow, so the flow of water decreases.

Now the real work is turning the wheel.

If the paddles are barely touching the water, there is high current, but the wheel doesn't spin very fast.

You lower the wheel more into the water, causing more resistance to flow, and the current reduces, but the wheel speeds up!

So more resistance gives you more power to the wheel, and you use this spinning wheel to drive a generator to power a village.

Well. Using an analogy from an earlier post, the speed at which the water flows is the current. Regardless how deep the water wheel is dipped into the river (especially since we can't change the resistance anyway), if the water flows faster, the wheel will turn faster. So higher current = faster wheel.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk

 

[edyle]

Well. Using an analogy from an earlier post, the speed at which the water flows is the current. Regardless how deep the water wheel is dipped into the river (especially since we can't change the resistance anyway), if the water flows faster, the wheel will turn faster. So higher current = faster wheel.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk

Regardless how deep the water wheel is dipped into the river?

Ok so let's say the water wheel is about 20 feet diameter, and the paddles are 2 foot long, so the paddles can go down as low as 2 feet.

Lower the wheel so the paddle bare touches the surface 1 inch. The wheel isn't going to turn much. Most of the water is just going to flow underneath, so the paddle isn't really blocking the water.

The paddles are 2 feet long, and also 2 feet wide, and you force the water to flow within a 2 foot wide channel into which you are lowering the paddles of the wheel. Totally lowering the wheel causes the paddles to completely block the channel.

 

[eda123]

Well. Using an analogy from an earlier post, the speed at which the water flows is the current. Regardless how deep the water wheel is dipped into the river (especially since we can't change the resistance anyway), if the water flows faster, the wheel will turn faster. So higher current = faster wheel.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk

current is one thing that certainly has a bearing on wattage. But resistance is the key other half. Having an apv with an amp setting is no more useful than a voltage setting.

Wattage is the meaningful target that captures "heat" with any given resistance. IMO that is the key metric apvs need to give us control over because it can be set no matter what the coil resistance is and provide the same power dissipation consistently.

 

[edyle]

You know something: the coil is not the only place the current flows, so if the current was what causes heat, then EVERY single point that the current is passing would have to produce heat.

 

[ckn71nm]

You know something: the coil is not the only place the current flows, so if the current was what causes heat, then EVERY single point that the current is passing would have to produce heat.

And it does. The battery is heating up and so is the rest of the circuitry. The coil most of all because the heat has only very little material to work on

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk