what is going on in Idiana?

[house mouse]

So we could still DIY as long as we put the juice in child resistant containers. Maybe.

But this section seems to cast a pretty wide net, and it can easily be read as applying to everybody, not just sellers since it specifically mentions giving it away:

"Except as otherwise permitted by this article, a person may not purchase, receive, manufacture, import, or transport, or cause to be imported or transported from another state, territory, or country into Indiana, or transport, ship, barter, give away, exchange, furnish, or otherwise handle or dispose of e-liquid, or to possess e-liquid for purpose of sale."

I think it will take a while before the meaning becomes clear. The language is rather obscure.

Obscure is right. Reading this I could think that it would be perfectly fine to bring in 100mg nic liquid. It's not vapeable in that form so it's not an "e-liquid." It could theoretically be an e-liquid at some time but it also could be mixed with water poured in a spray bottle and spritzed on your garden plants to keep the pests away.

 

[Harbinger82]

So we could still DIY as long as we put the juice in child resistant containers. Maybe.

But this section seems to cast a pretty wide net, and it can easily be read as applying to everybody, not just sellers since it specifically mentions giving it away:

"Except as otherwise permitted by this article, a person may not purchase, receive, manufacture, import, or transport, or cause to be imported or transported from another state, territory, or country into Indiana, or transport, ship, barter, give away, exchange, furnish, or otherwise handle or dispose of e-liquid, or to possess e-liquid for purpose of sale."

I think it will take a while before the meaning becomes clear. The language is rather obscure.

I'm pretty sure that DIY would fall under the "manufacture" part of that statement.

 

[James Wilson]

I hate how things are going here in Indiana. God I want to move.

 

[Amy87]

The bill does not look bad

?!?!?!????
Have you read the entire thing? Not only have they made it financially impossible for small local shops to comply, they are telling us we can't even order e-liquid from out of state vendors, unless they also comply with these draconian rules. I buy 99% of my e-liquid from my local shop, but when they close down because they can't afford to comply with the law, I won't even be able to order e-juice online. Tell me again how thats "not bad"??
I'm all for common sense regulation like childproof caps, etc, but things like mandating that a shop pay for 24 hour security monitoring by a state approved security firm is just outright ridiculous. How many shops can afford that?

 

[skoony]

where can i find the whole bill as it stand now?
mike

 

[pennysmalls]

skoony click on latest version at the top on the left...

Indiana General Assembly, 2015 Session

 

[skoony]

skoony click on latest version at the top on the left...

Indiana General Assembly, 2015 Session

thanks
mike

 

[catlady60]

Obscure is right. Reading this I could think that it would be perfectly fine to bring in 100mg nic liquid. It's not vapeable in that form so it's not an "e-liquid." It could theoretically be an e-liquid at some time but it also could be mixed with water poured in a spray bottle and spritzed on your garden plants to keep the pests away.

What does Indiana plan on doing? Going through everyone's packages to check for vapor products and DIY ingredients?

 

[skoony]

What does Indiana plan on doing? Going through everyone's packages to check for vapor products and DIY ingredients?

in minnesota one can turn in tax evaders
and other not paying the state its due and get a cut of whats ever collected.
mike

 

[catlady60]

?!?!?!????
Have you read the entire thing? Not only have they made it financially impossible for small local shops to comply, they are telling us we can't even order e-liquid from out of state vendors, unless they also comply with these draconian rules. I buy 99% of my e-liquid from my local shop, but when they close down because they can't afford to comply with the law, I won't even be able to order e-juice online. Tell me again how thats "not bad"??
I'm all for common sense regulation like childproof caps, etc, but things like mandating that a shop pay for 24 hour security monitoring by a state approved security firm is just outright ridiculous. How many shops can afford that?

That clause that bans ordering e-juice from out-of-state vendors puts a blatantly unconstitutional burden on interstate commerce, which only Congress has the authority to regulate. It's only a matter of time before someone in IA sues for that reason.
What on God's green earth makes Indiana think it can tell other states how to conduct their business, even to the point of imposing taxes and other burdens on out-of-state vendoes?

 

[Amy87]

Catlady, that is exactly what we are hoping to hang them with, the out of state commerce thing. I stopped in our local shop today, and they tell me the lawsuits are already being planned.

And for the other poster above that wondered how anyone would know what is in our mail packages, that is not the issue. I dont think people are understanding, out of states shops would not be allowed to even sell to an Indiana address.
it's basically prohibition, and it's totally ridiculous.

 

[four2109]

"What on God's green earth makes Indiana think it can tell other states how to conduct their business, even to the point of imposing taxes and other burdens on out-of-state vendoes?"

It's a Red State. They have gerrymandered it so that the citizen's votes don't matter, and they don't care. Or maybe they are just {Moderated} idiots. Same thing.

I don't know why that didn't show up as a quote....

 

[four2109]

BTW!!!
Did I mention how excited I am that ECF has resumed posting "Joined Date" and "Location" under our avatar????
YES!!
That's really important in threads like this!
Thank you ECF!!!!

 

[four2109]

Moved to Indiana from Texas about a year ago..and now I'm just sad I did.

Me too, for family. I'm done. Looking for a friendly island.

1) They have included NO tax gain????? Seriously????? just saying
2) They may see increased unemployment statewide from these Restrictions.
3) They will see Decreased State Revenues from the Restrictions.
4) They are promoting a Need for increased illegal activities from otherwise - Good citizens if the state.
5) They have created an increase in state expenses to oversee compliance with the new Regulations with little return to cover that increase.

YEP! It really is that stupid!
They have to win even when there is nothing to gain..... wrap your brain around that!
It's a Red State.
But really, the TAX bills are coming, they just wanted the vendor's investment first.

I would love it if someone who was a lawyer and understands legalspeak from CASSA could get hold of the people who wrote this and then post an easy to understand list of the rules we now have to live by (at least for now)

I really think we need to write our Legislators and demand that clarification from them!!
They are the ones passing the legislation!!
WASHBURNE is mine and never responded to me.
Tomes voted against AND responded to my letter. Washburne did not, here's his FB page,
Tom Washburne for State Rep Indiana 64 | Facebook

This was written so broadly that providing unflavored water for vaporizing could be considered a violation.

Exactly. If I vape straight PG, or Aloe Vera juice, it's a violation. I'm a sinner!! Tax me!

There's a separate bill that addresses taxation. I'm not sure what is happening with that one.

They are waiting to get the vendors registered with 1432. That's the purpose of 1432.

BTW!!!
Did I mention how excited I am that ECF has resumed posting "Joined Date" and "Location" under our avatar????
YES!!
That's really important in threads like this!
Thank you ECF!!!!

I'll probably have to edit to clean this up, but that's ok, I like other things in the new forum!!

 

[pamdis]

So, no WTA will be allowed to be bought in Indiana?

Chapter 5. Manufacturing and Safety Requirements Sec.
1. (a) E-liquid distributed and sold within Indiana may be comprised of any of the following ingredients:
(1) Vegetable glycerol or vegetable glycerin.
(2) Propylene glycol.
(3) Nicotine.
(4) Flavorings.
(5) Water.
(6) Other ingredients approved by the department under section 2 of this chapter or any ingredient specifically approved for inclusion in e-liquid by the federal Food and Drug Administration.

(b) A person may not purchase, sell, use, or possess any substance intended to be vaporized and inhaled in a vapor pen that contains any ingredient other than an ingredient allowed under subsection (a).

 

[skoony]

That clause that bans ordering e-juice from out-of-state vendors puts a blatantly unconstitutional burden on interstate commerce, which only Congress has the authority to regulate. It's only a matter of time before someone in IA sues for that reason.
What on God's green earth makes Indiana think it can tell other states how to conduct their business, even to the point of imposing taxes and other burdens on out-of-state vendoes?

requiring licensing for businesses in any state is
not unconstitutional. many states do it for many reasons.
the question is does undue burden trump Indiana's right
to protect the health and welfare of its residents.
they are not banning the sale just imposing standards
and licensing requirements.
can a case be made in court? i don't know.
i hope something can be done. if this stands
we all are in for a ride.
mike

 

[four2109]

I don't know why out of state vendors would bother knowing that this is just the beginning. The states just want to claim their money before the FDA acts.
I don't see Indiana getting any money from me.

 

[Cool_Breeze]

So, no WTA will be allowed to be bought in Indiana?

...
(6) Other ingredients approved by the department under section 2 of this chapter or any ingredient specifically approved for inclusion in e-liquid by the federal Food and Drug Administration.

(b) A person may not purchase, sell, use, or possess any substance intended to be vaporized and inhaled in a vapor pen that contains any ingredient other than an ingredient allowed under subsection (a).

The matter of WTA has been mentioned. Not yet mentioned is Tobacco Absolute...

 

[Bob Chill]

I doubt that IN will be the last State to impose ridiculous regulations. Even my local County in MD is trying to pass a 30% wholesale tax on ecigs. States and Counties are every bit the enemy as the Fed and FDA. One of my fears is a rash of State regulation far in front of the FDA's regs. Looks like that is coming true much faster than I thought.

What a jacked up situation we're in. Way too many enemies and far too few advocates.

 

[Cool_Breeze]

I doubt that IN will be the last State to impose ridiculous regulations. Even my local County in MD is trying to pass a 30% wholesale tax on ecigs. States and Counties are every bit the enemy as the Fed and FDA. One of my fears is a rash of State regulation far in front of the FDA's regs. Looks like that is coming true much faster than I thought.

What a jacked up situation we're in. Way too many enemies and far too few advocates.

What is the reason / justification (offered?) for States / Localities to apply taxes other than perhaps Sales Tax? Is it purely punitive / revenue source?