Why Vaping Might Fail... (Manufacturers, Distributors please note)

[ElProximo]

That is the reason I believe in choices. If (by any chance) a monopoly did take over.. prices would skyrocket. Not only could we potentially be paying the dreaded T A X on our vaping supplies, but they could be higher in general. That's why I prefer having as many choices as possible. It keeps our costs down, even at the expense of losing a favorite along the way.

I always think of the Microsoft comparison here. Hate them all we want (remember movies where they were the 'evil corporation') and despise them for 'eating' up anything that got in their way,
BUT,
The fact is that (another poster mentions it) computers were very expensive, propitiatory, required near constant ongoing never-ending tweaking, parts hunting, mentors, and don't get started on what software may or may not work with what.
Gates' PC and standard mass-marketed OS (which put a priority on backwards compatibility) changed the world.
I heard it all from the computer nerds including the common refrains "Well.. if people are too lazy to do the research.."
I remember the same 'Its not rocket science' comments too.
However,
The reality is that mass market appeal, standard OS, backwards compatibility was what got the masses converting,
and,
consequently dramatically reducing the cost, increasing the research, making parts and accessories standard and easily available.

I don't love 'The Man' companies and they can go wrong too but with E-Cigs we really are at a place where a 'Microsoft' (for the same reasons) could bring the masses of smokers (or not) into vaping. Then we get to that point where E-Cigs are all 'USB'.
The 'USB' of E-Cigs is available at Walmart for 9.99 and is the same standard 1300 'Ego' type everyone has. (making up a standard one).

What I'd say is this - in the same way I can build my own custom PC Linux OS the Vape-Geeks can still build insano mods,
but,
When the 'Microsoft Compliant USB-Vape is in Walmart for 9.99 its going to make my mod or 'Linux E-Cig' a lot cheaper too.

Anyways, long rant there but I seriously think E-Cigs are entering a danger zone where this propitiatory vendor-specific 'parts and accessories maximizing' of a small segment of the market could end up cannibalizing itself into nothing but specialty niche.

I bet you have a pile of chargers!

No pile. The Ego kits (all that I have anyways) come with the USB/Wall charger. This is a good example of compatibility and interchanging parts.
2 are on wall charging a battery.
2 are using the USB only [happen to have 2 household computers]
2 left-over wall portion of chargers.

There is another benefit here and it is to do with 'troubleshooting'. If I need to find out what failed (battery or charger or?) I can test them against another identical battery or charger.

Chargers often seem to outlast anything we own but strangely enough I have had one USB charger fail and one wall charger fail.

Have you tried the ego carto? Or the ego tank? (I love the ego carto)

I haven't yet. I did think I might like to order a few and see how they go. A lot of people here seem to tout the 'Boge' brand?

 

[DC2]

Because it seems to me that it would make the difference between success and failure for some people, it's worth considering - but it needs a bunch of experienced people who will take on the job, and someone to co-ordinate it by being a central point of contact. I don't think it is something ECF should set up and run - but if there were people who wanted to do it / run it, we would certainly provide resources.

I don't want to hijack this thread too much, so if this goes much further maybe I'll start a new thread in General Discussion, but...

I'm not sure this needs a central point of contact, nor any kind of "program" really.
I was thinking along the lines of a subforum for mentoring.

--There could be a large disclaimer that ECF is not responsible for any advice given by mentors
--There could be a sticky explaining how the subforum works
--People would post a thread asking for a mentor, and explaning their current smoking situation using a template of required information
--People would post in that thread to "claim" that "newbie" for mentoring purposes

I can see where it might be a good idea to "qualify" people to be mentors, but I'm not convinced that is necessary.

If a mentor feels they are in over their head, or that a different mentor might be better, they can make a post to indicate withdrawal.
Such a post could further explain what issues came about that caused them to feel a different mentor might be more appropriate.

But my main concern is too many people needing mentoring and not enough mentors.
If this moves forward I might post a poll to see how many people would be interested in mentoring.

 

[rolygate]

Yes. It might be a good idea use an informal structure. Go for it

 

[swedishfish]

Everyone is not looking for the perfect vape, but I often wonder what percentage of us are.

For example, I have been vaping for 22 months.
I started with a 510 but now have two Chucks, and one Bartleby.

Are they the perfect vape?
No, they are not.

The perfect vape would have to be a variable voltage mod like the ProVari.
And if I ever by anything else, it will be a variable voltage mod.

But I'm satisfied with what I have, and the key for me is to be satisfied.
Chasing perfection is not something that I want to deal with.

Not that there is anything wrong with wanting to do that.

Maybe perfect isn't the right word. Maybe hassle free would be more like it. My ego is pretty perfect for me at this early point in my vaping. It got me off analogs so I have no complaints! Love the battery life, love everything about it. Filling and cartos can be a little tedious (and I fill for two people). It's nothing I can't live with but perfection to me would be not having to fill/top cartos. The tanks seemed to solve that but I had atty issues so I'm back to the cartos.

I don't even know what a variable volt mod is but I'm sure if I read about it, I'll think I need it.

 

[DC2]

Yes. It might be a good idea use an informal structure. Go for it

For anyone following this conversation, I've made a new thread...
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...t-mentoring-program-subforum.html#post2898515

 

[DC2]

I don't even know what a variable volt mod is but I'm sure if I read about it, I'll think I need it.

I've seen you posting around here for awhile now, and I'm shocked that you don't know what a variable voltage mod is.
And yes, you do need one, or perhaps I should say that you definitely do WANT one.

 

[swedishfish]

This place is very very expensive!

My nephew's girlfriend smokes and he said she was interested in vaping so I told him to bring her over to see what they're like. I have the kits I bought for my Mom (KR808's- Smoke Tip & V4L) and my ego.

I was able to show her what they were like, explain all about them, etc. etc. she tried them. She's a waitress and two days later she asked if she could bring two people she worked with over. It's great if you can actually see and try some good pvs and not the 7-ll or overpriced mall stuff. Unfortunately most of us see an ad, or get roped into some junk before we end up here. I'm so fortunate that I happen to find this place.

 

[ElProximo]

I don't want to hijack this thread too much, so if this goes much further maybe I'll start a new thread in General Discussion, but...

......I was thinking along the lines of a subforum for mentoring.

--There could be a large disclaimer that ECF is not responsible for any advice given by mentors
--There could be a sticky explaining how the subforum works
--People would post a thread asking for a mentor, and explaning their current smoking situation using a template of required information
--People would post in that thread to "claim" that "newbie" for mentoring purposes

I can see where it might be a good idea to "qualify" people to be mentors, but I'm not convinced that is necessary.

This is very relevant to the discussion. Just think about what we are discussing here. Mentors. Now we are even considering training programs and 'Certifications' required to teach Vaping Hardware!

Now put yourself in the place of the average-joe who has been a long time smoker and is considering switching to Vaping. We say to them:
No problem, you can study online with certified trainers who will assign some homework for you. After some study you will learn how to use the device and can get continual ongoing training on which parts, accessories etc.

Now honestly? I think you just ended it for the average Joe. Keep in mind there are still plenty of people who are not internet junkies like the rest of us.
They don't buy things online or really know all the searching stuff or how forums work.

We really want to get to a place where nearly anyone can easily do this with nothing more than the basic instructions coming in box and ordering parts and accessories so straight-forward and 'common' that nearly anyone can 'point and click' with just a few minutes of clear compatibility.

BTW - I just noticed Liberty Flights has fairly clear 'Compatibility' alerts beside their parts and accessories now. This is a very good idea and definitely the right direction.
See:
They 'could' be like a lot of sites and NOT have any helpful charts like that. I suspect this leads to more short-term gain when far too many people are ordering far too many unnecessary incompatible things not worth returning (only a certain % returns certain $ amounts).
However,
L.F. has the right idea for long-term customer satisfaction. Heck - I KNOW exactly what part I need and I actually got 'blurry eyes syndrome' scanning the small print and almost accidentally ordered the wrong accessory just by sheer 'misclicking' and their chart alerted me!
Good!
Now they will get more of my money than the other site without compatibility charts. Distributors take note.

 

[DC2]

This is very relevant to the discussion. Just think about what we are discussing here. Mentors. Now we are even considering training programs and 'Certifications' required to teach Vaping Hardware!

I very much understand the point you have been trying to make.
And I don't disagree with you at all, but I also disagree with you a little bit.


If everyone needed and wanted the same thing from an electronic cigarette, that would simplify things a lot.
But it just isn't the case, and never will be.

People are always going to have different requirements for what they need in an electronic cigarette.
Just as people have different reasons for smoking, and get very different things out of the smoking experience.

Variety is here to stay, however standardizing on one threading (510) would be a huge step in the right direction.

But yeah, there are a lot of companies out there trying to make a quick buck.
And really, there isn't a way to stop that as far as I can see.

 

[FantWriter]

I was able to show her what they were like, explain all about them, etc. etc. she tried them. She's a waitress and two days later she asked if she could bring two people she worked with over.

You've hit it!

What vaping really needs is an MLM program ala' Tupperware or Amway -- you host a party for smokers where you can show them a variety of products, take their orders, and can mentor them as needed (like telling them the LR atomizer they want to order won't work well with their slim batteries, etc.). You get a commission on everything you sell, a commission on cartos/juice they order from the MLM's parent website, and a cut of the commission on what they sell when they start hosting parties.

It will give prospective vapers some hands-on as well as a local source at reasonable prices.

Too bad I just missed out on winning the LegaMillions lottery or I could have funded this.

 

[FantWriter]

People are always going to have different requirements for what they need in an electronic cigarette.
Just as people have different reasons for smoking, and get very different things out of the smoking experience.

Variety is here to stay, however standardizing on one threading (510) would be a huge step in the right direction.

I agree, except that the 510 is a terrible thread design. The male has to be on the larger/heavier part for ergonomics, safety, and strength. It's okay for minis where the battery can't be expected to last very long, but larger and more durable designs need it done correctly.

 

[leannebug]

You've hit it!

What vaping really needs is an MLM program ala' Tupperware or Amway -- you host a party for smokers where you can show them a variety of products, take their orders, and can mentor them as needed (like telling them the LR atomizer they want to order won't work well with their slim batteries, etc.). You get a commission on everything you sell, a commission on cartos/juice they order from the MLM's parent website, and a cut of the commission on what they sell when they start hosting parties.

It will give prospective vapers some hands-on as well as a local source at reasonable prices.

Too bad I just missed out on winning the LegaMillions lottery or I could have funded this.

I've been thinking this for a while. This would be a fantastic idea, and really expose the vaping world to a whole new range of people. Not only that, but there's no worries of 'what to do if the FDA comes down on my state?' I know that holds some people back from opening a storefront, or business. With an avon type business, you wouldn't have overhead, if you had to stop. And: You could be available for help, questions, addtional input and 'mentoring'.. plus, think how nice it would be to have all the different models and varieties to show everyone. I would do it in a heartbeat.

 

[ElProximo]

At this moment in the 'arc' I could see a multi-level marketing type of system being effective for all the right political and evangelical reasons.
What worries me is that such a system only rewards more propitiatory, vendor-specific, specialized brands and models and only encourages more 'tech turnover'?

Right now I could see the value in terms of converts. One thing about Vaping I think most here already know is that you only need to vape for a few minutes outside the coffee shop (or anywhere) and within minutes you can be in a full scale 'demonstration' for a half dozen smokers (and non-smokers).

So some kind of 'Tupperware' type of idea might be a great way to earn mass converts or just dispense realistic information into the masses.

 

[LastoftheBreed]

You've hit it!

What vaping really needs is an MLM program ala' Tupperware or Amway -- you host a party for smokers where you can show them a variety of products, take their orders, and can mentor them as needed (like telling them the LR atomizer they want to order won't work well with their slim batteries, etc.). You get a commission on everything you sell, a commission on cartos/juice they order from the MLM's parent website, and a cut of the commission on what they sell when they start hosting parties.

It will give prospective vapers some hands-on as well as a local source at reasonable prices.

Too bad I just missed out on winning the LegaMillions lottery or I could have funded this.

Hmmmmmm.....

 

[tko]

Hah. The OP described my experience perfectly. I've got a couple boxes full of atomizers, chargers, cartridges, juice, polyfill, pyrimid tea bags, syringes - in DSE 801, DSE 901, K808, a little cigarette copy, red dragon, and more. I always went back to the analogs because its easier.

To me its not about the cost, its the health factor and being able to vape anywhere, and as they say, "Hope springs eternal" so now I'm trying blucig and volcano equipment. Now I've got to start trying to find a juice I really like. I liked the red dragon tobacco flavor but not their equipment. Any tips on where that flavor might be found?

 

[Bawn]

i think the main reason for all of us to push through the confusion is the simple fact that we dont want to die young. i am only 27 years old. my grandfather died of lung cancer because he smoked pretty much his whole life. he died at 67 which is relatively young. on the other hand my other grandfather just recentky died at 84 but he died of other issues he had. he also smoked for 55 years. smoking had no effect on him and was not the cause of hisd death (he had hep c that he contracted through the italian military decades ago). so its pretty much a toss up whether i would be diagnosed with cancer or not, heck i still might be down the road in my 50's 60's. but if i can lessen that chance to a small precentage, i will do whatever it takes. stopping everything would be the smart choice. does this vaper we inhale cause long term side effects? who knows. the point is, i will spend the $300 to lessen my chances of getting cancer or other health issues. i know e-cigs work for me. i havent touched a analog since i started vaping. i am willing to spend the money to learn and see which product works best for me. i was very happy with my joye 510-t. it worked just fine and kept me off analogs, but like all other things, i like to tinker and mess around with electronic toys. so if a person likes the idea and finds vaping works for them they spend the $49 for a 510 kit and get juice and never touch a analog again. its when the obsession hits, is when you start blowing cash on things we probably dont need. also, if one person does his/her research before buying anything whether its a ecig or a tv or a car, the chances of you making the right buy the first time is greater. so most failure stories i see are because the person didnt do the home work first. i admit, i jumped into a 510-t pretty quick. i should have done MORE research but i felt the 510-t was perfect for me with the research i did. long story short, do your research before you buy anything so you dont buy 6 things to get the perfect 1. "measure twice cut once".

 

[swedishfish]

No offense, but this thread is from March. Why not start a new thread instead of digging up zombie threads.