Would you trust an e-cig made by a tobacco company?
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no....hell no.....times 1000.....just so they can put them thousands of chemicals in it? no!!!
Oh I wish we could cuss in the threads.
No way. Like ninfreak said...just so they can put thousands of chemicals. I really wish they went
bankrupt for their drug dealing.
No way. Like ninfreak said...just so they can put thousands of chemicals. I really wish they went
bankrupt for their drug dealing.
As long as they stuck to the tried, true, and favorite formula of PG, VG, nicotine, and flavorings with minimal inert ingredients, sure. Why not?
I feel I've already got reason enough not to trust them, if i have to rely on reading tons of data just to be able to be assured they have no added chemicals, i wouldn't bother with it.
The juice and the device are two different things... If big tobacco but their resources into designing a high end mod... Yes, I would be all about it!
Their juice... probably not... At least not without a full list of ingredients.
Their juice... probably not... At least not without a full list of ingredients.
NO! I wouldn't give another dollar to BT if they paid me for their product and it was best on market. Just my opinion but I think they have made enough money off me.
We can't even get a full list of ingredients in a traditional cigarette. What makes you think we would get a list of ingredients in their juice? That is a major sticking point about the FDA for me. Foods are required to list ingredients and nutrition info but cigs are given a pass. Wonder why? Answer: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
BT gets no trust from me.
BT gets no trust from me.
That's my one hesitation when it comes to it. I'd be pretty on the fence about it.
On the one hand....there are MANY commercials, studies, etc that have shown that smoking is dangerous, causes cancer, etc. Still people smoke, and new people continue to try it. But I can't say BT has really outright LIED saying that cigs are safe to use and have no health dangers.
On the other hand...the point about the FDA, gov't and BT all working together in lots of ways, and the sheer power that BT has due to both money and influence, could spell bad things for the e-cig industry and perhaps be overall a detractor rather than an improver.
Once again it comes down to motivations, and they want to make money. They make money by you and me and everyone else continuing to buy product. Nothing wrong with that, every company has to do it. The only problem is the shadiness that BT and MANY big companies have used to sell faulty or dangerous products.
On the one hand....there are MANY commercials, studies, etc that have shown that smoking is dangerous, causes cancer, etc. Still people smoke, and new people continue to try it. But I can't say BT has really outright LIED saying that cigs are safe to use and have no health dangers.
On the other hand...the point about the FDA, gov't and BT all working together in lots of ways, and the sheer power that BT has due to both money and influence, could spell bad things for the e-cig industry and perhaps be overall a detractor rather than an improver.
Once again it comes down to motivations, and they want to make money. They make money by you and me and everyone else continuing to buy product. Nothing wrong with that, every company has to do it. The only problem is the shadiness that BT and MANY big companies have used to sell faulty or dangerous products.
On that note, it's already begun. RJR Phillips has purchased Blu for $135 million. I can't remember who bought NJoy or who runs it but I'm pretty sure it's one of BT that now owns it or at least majority shares.
They'll start with the cig-a-likes I'm sure, because that's where most people start. And one potential thing that could happen would be they would DESIGN them not to work well, or be satisfying....and people would fall back to analogs. Witness my experience with Blu. It was new tech at the time, and they weren't owned by BT yet. But they were a faulty product that was considered a novelty at the time. And I fell back to analogs myself for about a year or almost 2 years before I randomly got the itch and started looking into e-cigs again then ordered my Halo kit.
Given that most people (including me) get into the world of e-cigs via the types that look like a cig even though they don't perform well...that leaves potential for BT to cut off people that would have found their way here because they try a faulty or poor e-cig and don't know it's owned by BT, and then fall back to BT. This happens enough as it stands right now, but could be something that's exacerbated by these cig-a-likes being in the hands of BT instead of independently made.
Just consider how 'innovative' analog cigs have been over the last few decades as well. How much has really changed aside from packaging and research and what-not? Part of the reason there are so many different styles and methods and juices and such that are out there right now in just a few years...is because this has (so far) been a mostly unregulated industry. Deregulation = innovation.
Thinking about it some more, no. I wouldn't trust BT if they got their claws too deeply into the e-cig industry.
They'll start with the cig-a-likes I'm sure, because that's where most people start. And one potential thing that could happen would be they would DESIGN them not to work well, or be satisfying....and people would fall back to analogs. Witness my experience with Blu. It was new tech at the time, and they weren't owned by BT yet. But they were a faulty product that was considered a novelty at the time. And I fell back to analogs myself for about a year or almost 2 years before I randomly got the itch and started looking into e-cigs again then ordered my Halo kit.
Given that most people (including me) get into the world of e-cigs via the types that look like a cig even though they don't perform well...that leaves potential for BT to cut off people that would have found their way here because they try a faulty or poor e-cig and don't know it's owned by BT, and then fall back to BT. This happens enough as it stands right now, but could be something that's exacerbated by these cig-a-likes being in the hands of BT instead of independently made.
Just consider how 'innovative' analog cigs have been over the last few decades as well. How much has really changed aside from packaging and research and what-not? Part of the reason there are so many different styles and methods and juices and such that are out there right now in just a few years...is because this has (so far) been a mostly unregulated industry. Deregulation = innovation.
Thinking about it some more, no. I wouldn't trust BT if they got their claws too deeply into the e-cig industry.
They sure did as long as they could get away with it ...
I would go a lot out of my way and tolerate a lot to not give them any more of my money. Also, one of the things I really like about ECF is that there is a lot of respect for personal differences - some people are planning to phase out nic or quit vaping and they are encouraged just as much as those who figure they are going to be permanent vapers ... I don't think the atmosphere would be enhanced by BT's involvement, although one way or the other it is probably unavoidable.
I guess the good thing is that with BT an owner there is going to be some money behind ecig lobbying ... the bad news is they are likely to lobby for low nic maximums so that people tend to vape as well as smoke rather than quitting, and so that they can sell more cartridges.
Just my two cents ... I guess that having blissfully ignored it all my life I am now pretty enraged to realize the loobying power BT is accorded and how ludicrous it is that any government agency would serously consider limitting ecigs while tobacco is allowed.
See how easy it is to be biased? Now you know how the non smoker comes to feel the way they do about us.
Last time I checked Johnson Creek is still making the e-liquid for "that" e-cig sold by a tobacco company. Johnson Creek is one of the oldest and most trusted labs out there.
Last time I checked Johnson Creek is still making the e-liquid for "that" e-cig sold by a tobacco company. Johnson Creek is one of the oldest and most trusted labs out there.
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I try when possible not to be biased and try not to look at things through rose-colored glasses. I've always been a truthseeker, and often a truthspeaker.
It's resulted in me being punished many times over my life in very real ways, but unlike most people I can say that there are very few of my perspectives and decisions that I make that I can truly regret, or regret very little.
I'm a skeptic at heart, so I take a lot of what I see with a grain of salt. But I am open to things as long as it seems solid and passes the common sense litmus test. Common sense these days of course seems to be a misnomer, as it doesn't feel very common.
On a side note, that's been a refreshing occurrence on this forum especially as compared to others I've been a part of in the past. People have been polite, helpful, informative and very supportive. All pluses in my book, hats off to ECF and everyone who's contributed here with information, inspiration and support. Keep it up, I'm spending WAY more time here than I might have otherwise simply because it's such a breath of fresh air in terms of attitude.
It's resulted in me being punished many times over my life in very real ways, but unlike most people I can say that there are very few of my perspectives and decisions that I make that I can truly regret, or regret very little.
I'm a skeptic at heart, so I take a lot of what I see with a grain of salt. But I am open to things as long as it seems solid and passes the common sense litmus test. Common sense these days of course seems to be a misnomer, as it doesn't feel very common.
On a side note, that's been a refreshing occurrence on this forum especially as compared to others I've been a part of in the past. People have been polite, helpful, informative and very supportive. All pluses in my book, hats off to ECF and everyone who's contributed here with information, inspiration and support. Keep it up, I'm spending WAY more time here than I might have otherwise simply because it's such a breath of fresh air in terms of attitude.
I agree with much of what you said. I see Big Pharmaceutical as our worst enemy; they have the most to lose with the success of e-cigs, and instead of joining in with their own product they have chosen to try to convince the FDA to eliminate them. They have the big money and lobbyists to do that, too.
With two major cigarette manufacturer's having a stake in e-cig ownership, they are hoping to cash in being "pioneers" of the tobacco industry by adopting e-cigs as a product line. They may very well become our allies in our fight against Big Pharmaceutical as they also have big money and lobbyists to protect their self interests.
The FDA is in the middle, and being a government agency is likely only interested in how e-cigs can be regulated and taxed. As much as I would like for things to remain the same, the regulation/taxation would be the lesser evil. A total banning of e-cig products would be the worse case scenario. One thing is certain, we will never have it as good as it is right now.
I agree that the tobacco e-cig manufacturers and marketing decision makers will focus on the cigalike target base. That will be the most profitable and less expensive product line to produce; advanced mods are more expensive to design and manufacture and likely have a limited profit margin.
Big Tobacco certainly has the finances in R & D to make some truly revolutionary improvements, but from what I have seen so far the money has gone into marketing gadgetry like Blu's pocket charger pack which beeps and blinks a blue light when in close proximity of another Blu user. I guess this might appeal to the social network target audience of Facebook and Twitter members, but I could care less if another vapor is in the building, I just want to vape in peace.
I hope that I am wrong, but I could see regulations limiting nicotine-based liquids to being sold in limited strength and only in pre-filled cartridges. No bottled nicotine liquids for sale to the general public. This would suck big time and would lead to a lot of DIY juice making and underground sales of concentrated nicotine liquid. There may be some juice vendors that offer high quality, 0-nicotine flavors but I fear that most of todays juice vendors would fall to the wayside.
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