Cloud9vaping pulls Five Pawns and other liquids from the shelf after testing.

[Pinggolfer]

Interesting thoughts can be found here: Confused about Diacetyl? You should be - read now | Page 6 | E-Cigarette Forum

Please read the post above mine in that thread also.

Can you put that in layman's terms?

 

[Pinggolfer]

Not particularly. vape as much DA/AP as you want but I won't be joining you.

If your ejuice has not been tested with a standardized test... You may very well be... Joining me.

Cheers, Jim

Hmm silence is golden.

 

[kates]

Interesting thoughts can be found here: Confused about Diacetyl? You should be - read now | Page 6 | E-Cigarette Forum

Please read the post above mine in that thread also.

This is really interesting and certainly worthy of further investigation but doesn’t make sense in terms of the 5P situation. If 5P believe this:

Why didn’t they publish their 2014 results when they got them, explain this is what they believe and go on to do tests on unsteeped liquid/ liquids which have been steeped for a very long time? (I believe they do a ‘reserve’ range)

If they have spent the last 8/9 months investigating it which is why they haven’t released anything/ commented before - why didn’t they take the opportunity to explain this in relation to Cloud 9’s results, say what their investigations have been and what any conclusions are to date (with any relevant test results to support it). How can they believe this and also issue a C&D letter to a company whose tests may well support it?

 

[SeniorBoy]

It doesn't bother me at all if people decide to vape liquids that contain high levels of diketones. You own your body, do as you please with it. What bothers me is when people continue to patronize companies who've engaged in deceptive business practices and used intimidation in an attempt to suppress the info when those deceptive practiced were exposed.

Ditto! Well said! My hope is that 5P will seize an opportunity to help the industry and their own image/brand by making a clear and unambiguous (NO SPIN) statement/pledge to reformulate their juices, provide lab reports on each and every sell page, and change their labeling. Then do it! IF you share this view or only want 5P to reformulate and state this, please send them your polite, civil, and respectful thoughts via their Contact Us page. A few thousand submissions might convince them.

 

[Rossum]

Ditto! Well said! My hope is that 5P will seize an opportunity to help the industry and their own image/brand by making a clear and unambiguous (NO SPIN) statement/pledge to reformulate their juices, provide lab reports on each and every sell page, and change their labeling. Then do it! IF you share this view or only want 5P to reformulate and state this, please send them your polite, civil, and respectful thoughts via their Contact Us page. A few thousand submissions might convince them.

My hopes are much more radical than that. Ideally, the free market would kill off companies who conduct themselves in such a manner. I don't care whether they reformulate their juices or not. The level of diketones in the products they sell is not the issue here. I don't have a problem with anyone selling juice with a high level of diketones if that's what customers want to buy. To me the issue is product misrepresentation and then attempting to silence and intimidate someone who called them on it by publishing independent test results. I find that unacceptable and believe it should have serious consequences.

 

[skoony]

specificly who lie

Except inhaling dyketones is worse than standing on a street corner and we have conclusive data to corroborate.
Some juices show dyketone levels higher than cigarettes and higher than found in the air in the factories that began the whole dyketone revelation. These companies know that their products contain high dyketone levels and are LYING to their customers!
STOP THE APOLOGETICS. This is unconscionable behavior!

Do not support "our e-juice makers" unless they are supporting US.

specifically,who lied to who and when?
this is what confuses me.the story lines of all these
supposed controversy's changes from thread to thread.
it really hard to get a grip on what is what.
regards
mike

 

[zoiDman]

specificly who lie

specifically,who lied to who and when?
this is what confuses me.the story lines of all these
supposed controversy's changes from thread to thread.
it really hard to get a grip on what is what.
regards
mike

Five Pawns Lied to their Retailers and Customers. Because up Until July 29th 2015, Five Pawns has Repeatedly stated that their e-Liquids contain NO Da/AP.

Heck, when Russ from Click Band called Five Pawns customer service After Five Pawns released their Labs reports showing High Levels of AP, by their Own Labs, Russ was told there was NO Ap in the e-Liquids he asked about.

 

[AstroTurf]

Russ... Is not a guy who represents me.

Nor is he suited for the job to represent anyone in the vape community.

Russ is a joke, not adult like at all!!!

Sensationalism suits his whiny lil voice and mentality though.

He is like a tabloid reporter. That is all!

Jim

 

[kates]

specifically,who lied to who and when?

FP published their 2014 test results for the first time at the end of June 2015 showing very high a/p levels in some of their juices.
Prior to this they had told customers and retailers there was no da/ap in their juices.
Therefore between Sept/Oct 2014 and end of June 2015 they misprepresented their products and lied to customers and retailers

 

[zoiDman]

Russ... Is not a guy who represents me.

Nor is he suited for the job to represent anyone in the vape community.

...

Russ Doesn't represent me Either. But that is Not Surprising. Because No One Represents me but Myself.

I won't go So Far as to call Russ a Joke. Because the Topics he brings up are Many Times Very Valid. And he has the Power to Reach Many People.

What I Don't like though is the Way he Presents these Topics sometimes.

And I think his Message would be Heard by More People and Taken More Seriously if he took a More Professional Approach. Isn't of Relying on "F This" and "F That" whenever he is Upset over something.

 

[AstroTurf]

FP published their 2014 test results for the first time at the end of June 2015 showing very high a/p levels in some of their juices.
Prior to this they had told customers and retailers there was no da/ap in their juices.
Therefore between Sept/Oct 2014 and end of June 2015 they misprepresented their products and lied to customers and retailers

Like this is the first vendor in your life who lied?!?

Too Funny...

If only the whole truth were known about everybody and everything.

Time to move on to the next pile of crap some Tabloid Reporter talks about.

Stay off the Stinkies. Thats whats important!!! (PERIOD)

 

[kates]

Like this is the first vendor in your life who lied?!?

Too Funny...

If only the whole truth were known about everybody and everything.

Time to move on to the next pile of crap some Tabloid Reporter talks about.

This hasn't come from some tabloid reporter - this has come from 5P themselves. So are you saying you think this is acceptable?

 

[LouisLeBeau]

Not particularly. Vape as much DA/AP as you want but I won't be joining you.

If your ejuice has not been tested with a standardized test... You may very well be... Joining me.

Cheers, Jim

Hmm silence is golden.

I think you meant that "the silence is deafening"? Unless you are talking about a certain golden "Reserve" juice that no information on AP/DA is available for? Anyways, I gave the comment a like. It's one helluva valid point. And about time something is done about it.

 

[AstroTurf]

This hasn't come from some tabloid reporter - this has come from 5P themselves. So are you saying you think this is acceptable?

All of the facts are not yet known about Vaping.

Until they are, all of this is mere speculation.

Jim

 

[440BB]

The more information we gather, the less speculation we we will be forced to attempt. Cloud 9 took action that led Five Pawns to share information that that they appear to have withheld. It's a good thing.

 

[kates]

FP published their 2014 test results for the first time at the end of June 2015 showing very high a/p levels in some of their juices.
Prior to this they had told customers and retailers there was no da/ap in their juices.
Therefore between Sept/Oct 2014 and end of June 2015 they misprepresented their products and lied to customers and retailers

Well I would call the above more than speculation. Anyway I have posted 2 comments on 5P 'info' page - it does say they are welcome, although there are currently 0 comments and mine have been 'awaiting moderation' for a number of days. I have asked them:
Can you confirm that the tests linked to are your most recent ones? (i.e. Sept/ Oct 2014)? &
You say Five Pawns does not feel there is any concern with diacetyl or AP in our e-liquids at current levels.’ Could you tell me what levels you would consider unacceptable?
I will post when I get a response (I am expecting it to take some time)

 

[zoiDman]

The more information we gather, the less speculation we we will be forced to attempt. Cloud 9 took action that led Five Pawns to share information that that they appear to have withheld. It's a good thing.

That's the way I see it.

If Cloud9 had not brought this to the Forefront, wouldn't Five Pawns have continued to Publically State that their e-Liquids were Da and AP Free?

When by the Own Lab Reports show that they are Cleary Not.

 

[LouisLeBeau]

Well I would call the above more than speculation. Anyway I have posted 2 comments on 5P 'info' page - it does say they are welcome, although there are currently 0 comments and mine have been 'awaiting moderation' for a number of days. I have asked them:
Can you confirm that the tests linked to are your most recent ones? (i.e. Sept/ Oct 2014)? &
You say Five Pawns does not feel there is any concern with diacetyl or AP in our e-liquids at current levels.’ Could you tell me what levels you would consider unacceptable?
I will post when I get a response (I am expecting it to take some time)

Alas, Poor Kate. I know them well. My gorge rises at it.
This, the same company that was deleting the copious number of questions and criticisms from their facebook page?
I suspect that no such questions will have been asked of them when they post comments.
I suspect only supportive comments and questions have been posted, by all appearances.
Can you imagine if they actually DID post those kinds of questions and comments? Huh... Katy Bar the Door!

 

[SeniorBoy]

While I also found Russ's Click Bang "rant" over the top as others have noted, the totality of his work via YouTube and Podcasts with respect to activism is outstanding.

Frankly, I would love to see prominent YouTube reviewers take 5P to task on this issue with a dedicated video. Perhaps they have and I missed it? I'm of course referring to "reach" and "influence". Like 50K views in a week or two or 300K views over a longer period of time. Additionally, you memorialize the event so others can look back in six months or a year and see what happened. That's "social media" on steroids!

 

[BigEgo]

All of the facts are not yet known about Vaping.

Until they are, all of this is mere speculation.

Jim

It's true that we don't know all the facts about vaping, but this doesn't mean we don't know some things about it. The fact that DA/AP are linked to serious lung diseases is not speculation.