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Yeah the setting on the SXK is 40 - the TCR is actually 0.0035, but on the Reliant it's 40 not 35. Ditto 70 not 60 for Ni200, and around 12-13 not 10 for Stainless Steel. Always slightly higher, but in increasing amounts as it goes up the scale.
Actually I just realised it's not offset as such, it's perfectly understandable. It's simply not 1 = 0.0001 as I assumed.
So all the TCR numbers can be calculated.
Let's imagine the TCR scale to be from 100 to 1000, that being 0.001 to 0.01, which is how Dicodes describe it.
The Reliant/SXK scale is 10 - 100, but using 1 = 8.75, not 1 = 10 as would have seemed logical.
Therefore the Reliant/SXK scale is 0.000875 to 0.00875, not 0.001 to 0.01.
To convert the TCR to the Reliant scale, we simply divide the TCR scale number by 8.75:
So all the TCR numbers can be calculated.
Let's imagine the TCR scale to be from 100 to 1000, that being 0.001 to 0.01, which is how Dicodes describe it.
The Reliant/SXK scale is 10 - 100, but using 1 = 8.75, not 1 = 10 as would have seemed logical.
Therefore the Reliant/SXK scale is 0.000875 to 0.00875, not 0.001 to 0.01.
To convert the TCR to the Reliant scale, we simply divide the TCR scale number by 8.75:
- Titanium: TCR 0.0035
- TCR scale number: 350
- Calculation: 350 / 8.75 = 40
- Reliant/SXK setting: 40
- matching my temperature testing
- Ni200, general: TCR 0.006
- TCR scale number: 600
- Calculation: 600 / 8.75 = 68.5
- Reliant/SXK setting: 69
- matching the number that Reliant recommends in their manual
- Ni200, curve accurate: TCR @ 230°C 0.0054
- TCR scale number: 540
- Calculation: 540 / 8.75 = 61.7
- Reliant/SXK setting: 62
- Ni200 is a curve, 0.006 is only an approximation across a wider range than we commonly vape
- At 230°C/450°F, the numbers would suggest 62 is most accurate.
- Unverified.
- Stainless Steel 304: TCR @ 230°C: 0.00105
- TCR scale number: 105
- Calculation: 105 / 8.75 = 12
- Reliant/SXK setting: 12
- I'm vaping SS 304 right now, and my subjective feeling was 13 was a better vape than 12. But I'm going to temp test it properly tonight.
- I've switched to 12 now and it's fine, just maybe reducing the power slightly earlier than I might have expected - but there could be several reasons for that. I will verify it properly.
- Stainless Steel 316: TCR @ 230°C 0.000913
- TCR scale number: 91
- Calculation: 91 / 8.75 = 10.4
- Reliant/SXK setting: 10
- Unverified.
- Resistherm NiFe30: TCR 0.0032
- TCR scale number: 320
- Calculation: 320 / 8.75 = 36.5
- Reliant/SXK setting: 37
- Unverified.
- Kanthal NiFe70: TCR 0.0052
- TCR scale number: 520
- Calculation: 520 / 8.75 = 59.4
- Reliant/SXK setting: 59
- Unverified.
- Kanthal NiFe52: TCR 0.004
- TCR scale number: 400
- Calculation: 400 / 8.75 = 45.7
- Reliant/SXK setting: 46
- Unverified.
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Which means the Reliant and SXK mods have the honour of the lowest setting on any TCR-setting mod! 0.000875 vs 0.001 on the Dicodes, Smok, and the DNA 200's single-TCR figure. (Though lower numbers are possible via DNA 200 curves.)
Yeah kind of - I divided 350/40 and got 8.75 and then 600/70 and got 8.5, so at first I thought it was an approximation not exact, or that it was changing as the scale went up. Then when I tried 600/8.75 and got 68.5 I remembered Apollo's recommendation.
I can't believe it took me that long to just work that out. Stupid assumptions!
But also, silly Apollo for not mentioning this in the manual. In fact they give no help for TCR at all except to say that 69 is for Ni200 - odd considering they market the mod as supporting Stainless Steel, but then don't tell you how to use it.
Yeah kind of - I divided 350/40 and got 8.75 and then 600/70 and got 8.5, so at first I thought it was an approximation not exact, or that it was changing as the scale went up. Then when I tried 600/8.75 and got 68.5 I remembered Apollo's recommendation.
I can't believe it took me that long to just work that out. Stupid assumptions!
But also, silly Apollo for not mentioning this in the manual. In fact they give no help for TCR at all except to say that 69 is for Ni200 - odd considering they market the mod as supporting Stainless Steel, but then don't tell you how to use it.
I was under the assumption it was a 1:1 setting as well, now we know the real scale.
It would be helpful to be in the manual, perhaps when they sell this batch they could have it added to the manual for the next batch. Along with more specifics, the TCR for Ti and common SS variations.
It would be helpful to be in the manual, perhaps when they sell this batch they could have it added to the manual for the next batch. Along with more specifics, the TCR for Ti and common SS variations.
Just updated my post with a bunch more numbers - including, in theory, a much better number for Ni200. The general number used for Ni200, 0.006, is only an average across the whole possible vaping range up to 300°C.
In fact at more normal vaping temperatures, such as 230°C/450°F, the TCR is quite a bit lower - 0.0054 at that temperature.
So I've added a second one for Ni200, theoretically more accurate for vaping at 230°C/450°F - a setting of 62, not 69.
All numbers are unverified by real temperature testing except the Titanium result. I will verify some of the others to be sure of the scale.
In fact at more normal vaping temperatures, such as 230°C/450°F, the TCR is quite a bit lower - 0.0054 at that temperature.
So I've added a second one for Ni200, theoretically more accurate for vaping at 230°C/450°F - a setting of 62, not 69.
All numbers are unverified by real temperature testing except the Titanium result. I will verify some of the others to be sure of the scale.
Yes I do, this one Rigol DS1104Z 4 Channel Digital Oscilloscope 100MHz Bandwidth 1GSa/s
(Actually I bought the cheaper 1054Z but it can be software hacked to upgrade it to the bandwidth and features of the 1104)
(Actually I bought the cheaper 1054Z but it can be software hacked to upgrade it to the bandwidth and features of the 1104)
Could you use that oscilloscope to measure the refresh rate with which resistance is measured by the mod?
Yeah I definitely will be doing so soon. It's probably around once a second, that's typical. Question is how long it continues - the DNA 40 only does it when the screen is off, then continues for an hour afterwards, then goes into deep sleep. These SXK-based mods turn themselves off after an hour or so, but it'll be interesting to see if they continue monitoring resistance up until then.
My button was butter smooth from the get go [emoji14]
Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping
Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping
I'm not sure we are talking about the same thing (we might, just checking). Here I see Koopor Mini measuring resistance 4,000 times a second. You are saying Reliant might do that just once per second? It seems much too coarse a measurement, but I'm not saying you are wrong, mind.
One of you is talking about standby resistance reading, and one while firing
Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping
Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping
Oh @gorman no, I can't measure that! I thought you wanted to know about the standby measurement eg for battery life / refinement questions.
We can measure the standby resistance measurement because it requires the mod to send a pulse of power to the coil. We can therefore see that pulse during periods where it's otherwise quiet, and see the magnitude and frequency of it.
We can't directly measure the firing resistance readings - these happen when the mod is sending power to the coil, and the mod then analyses the power it sends. Nothing shows up different on the scope when it does or doesn't read resistance from the power it sends. Measuring that would be analogous to detecting when someone is listening to radio.
We only know the Koopor Mini does that because Smok told us - we would need Apollo/SXK to tell us to know the same figure for this mod.
What I can do is measure a) how accurate the temperature control is, which is a factor of the resistance accuracy, the resistance frequency, and their power management algorithm, and b) see what the power curve looks like, eg how frequently it is being adjusted. We could assume that any change in the power curve - when it increases or decreases power output - is the result of it deciding more or less power is required, and therefore is a result of taking a new resistance reading. However we don't expect to see one power change per resistance reading, because it should only change power when it needs to, and it won't always need to.
But the temperature accuracy is the prime thing we care about, and the ultimate measurement of all other factors, so those graphs will be most interesting. I've already done some temperature testing and found the Reliant to be very accurate, including with Stainless Steel. Much more so than the original SXK I monitored. I will post graphs soon.
We can measure the standby resistance measurement because it requires the mod to send a pulse of power to the coil. We can therefore see that pulse during periods where it's otherwise quiet, and see the magnitude and frequency of it.
We can't directly measure the firing resistance readings - these happen when the mod is sending power to the coil, and the mod then analyses the power it sends. Nothing shows up different on the scope when it does or doesn't read resistance from the power it sends. Measuring that would be analogous to detecting when someone is listening to radio.
We only know the Koopor Mini does that because Smok told us - we would need Apollo/SXK to tell us to know the same figure for this mod.
What I can do is measure a) how accurate the temperature control is, which is a factor of the resistance accuracy, the resistance frequency, and their power management algorithm, and b) see what the power curve looks like, eg how frequently it is being adjusted. We could assume that any change in the power curve - when it increases or decreases power output - is the result of it deciding more or less power is required, and therefore is a result of taking a new resistance reading. However we don't expect to see one power change per resistance reading, because it should only change power when it needs to, and it won't always need to.
But the temperature accuracy is the prime thing we care about, and the ultimate measurement of all other factors, so those graphs will be most interesting. I've already done some temperature testing and found the Reliant to be very accurate, including with Stainless Steel. Much more so than the original SXK I monitored. I will post graphs soon.
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