It's official. E cigs to be registered as a medicine in the UK.

[AttyPops]

Why would you want nicotine is the ?

Fair enough question.

There's about 20% of the population that just gravitates toward smoking and nicotine. Probably a whole grab-bag of reasons...so there's no one single answer.

I suppose that if you were to try and outlaw tobacco, and then make the NRTs and e-cigs available by prescription, you'd have an argument for the regulation (not that it would work....the "black market" would have a field-day with that one. Look at prohibition in the USA's history.)

But the fact of the matter is....TODAY....NOW....people gravitate toward smoking. Smaller #'s than previous generations sure, but they still do. So I don't know how to answer the question but the phenomenon exists now. Like gravity. We don't fully understand it, but it's there.

(Like how I worked "gravitates" into a gravity example? I crack myself up.)

 

[zoiDman]

From the BBC Article...

"Jeremy Mean of The Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) said the government had concluded that e-cigarettes currently on the market do not meet appropriate standards of safety, quality and efficacy."

Does anyone have a Link to the Standards that Mr. Mean is Referencing?

 

[e-pipeman]

From the BBC Article...

"Jeremy Mean of The Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) said the government had concluded that e-cigarettes currently on the market do not meet appropriate standards of safety, quality and efficacy."

Does anyone have a Link to the Standards that Mr. Mean is Referencing?

At least he has an appropriate surname

 

[Markh5682]

Exactly how? An outright ban with immediate effect was never really on the cards - not in the UK. A lot of us have seen this coming for a very long time, and, believe me, it doesn't get much worse than this. It may well be just the first nail in the coffin, but the lid's already on.

JJ

Whilst an outright immediate ban was unlikely, but options open to them was the removal of ecigs from the shelves, as was the option to place the same restrictions on use in public places as tobacco, plus many other restrictions they could have put in place.

Yes things will change, that was bound to happen, not everyone will like it, but things may not be as bad as the doom and gloom mongers predict.

 

[xyanide]

They didn't ban ecigs, and are allowing them to still be unregulated for a 3 year period, until they can figure out a way to have regulations on them which won't create a major impact on the ecig community is far from terrible.

The bottom line is they will attempt to regulate is as medication which it is clearly not and never has been. If anything they should regulate it as a luxury product not intended for minors. The only arguments that are brought to the table (if I read things correctly) is that a lot of smokers in their study seemed to 'think they can use it to quit' while it is merely an alternative as stated by every e-cig shop ever. This is too vague apparently, and people aren't being aware that they really can't quit with e-cigs.
The problem is politicians will start making certain statements based on these articles and announcements, and they very rarely take something back once they said it.

I do understand the good intentions of wanted to provide safety-regulated content of e-liquid, but the market is already regulating itself. If a liquid sucks, we don't buy it. If a product doesn't work as intended, we don't buy it.

 

[AttyPops]

From the article:

In some countries, such as New Zealand, e-cigarettes are regulated as medicines and can be purchased only in pharmacies.

So how's it working in New Zealand? Is this different than what the UK would do? What happens with under-age people....do they just start smoking 1st? Then buy e-cigs later? Do they find a way to get e-cigs? Do they avoid both? Same questions for snus or other tobacco.

 

[jSquared]

Whilst an outright immediate ban was unlikely, but options open to them was the removal of ecigs from the shelves, as was the option to place the same restrictions on use in public places as tobacco, plus many other restrictions they could have put in place.

Yes things will change, that was bound to happen, not everyone will like it, but things may not be as bad as the doom and gloom mongers predict.

You've completely missed the point. None of those restrictions would have had a long-lasting negative impact on the industry as a whole. In fact, a lot of us would, in theory, support a whole range of regulations and restrictions and welcome them with open arms.

To reclassify e-cigarettes as medicinal products, however, is a significant departure from the existing framework, which most vendors consider to be unethical and potentially illegal. Before this decision, the onus was on the EU to prove that e-cigarettes (and, therefore, traditional smoking products by proxy) were medicinal products as opposed to recreational products. The UK government has just done all the hard work for them, and handed the EU a major victory in the process. Over the next 3 years, the onus will now be on the community to prove that these products are purely intended for recreational use - a much much more difficult position for us to be in.

JJ

 

[AttyPops]

Britain to regulate e-cigarettes as medicine from 2016 | Reuters

Under the new British system, manufacturers will have to prove the quality of their products and demonstrate that they deliver the correct amount of nicotine. But they will not need to conduct clinical trials.

If it's "only" quality control....it may not be all that bad. Sounds like quality/chemical analysis. Still OTC. IDK what that fully means in the UK though.

Some juice vendors provide that occasionally now. Probably raises costs. I guess the "classification issue" is still a concern.

 

[acorn54]

i hate to say i told you so, but when there is money to be made for the giant corporations they will buy off the politicians and make it possible this includes e cigs a great untapped resource in their eyes.
personally i saw it as a race against the clock to get off analogs with ecigs and then to get off ecigs totally before the powers that be step in and make the costs prohibitive just like analogs. plus the fact i saw using a ecig as another monkey on my back

 

[house mouse]

The bottom line is they will attempt to regulate is as medication which it is clearly not and never has been.

It strikes me as pretty ironic that this will place e-cigs from tobacco companies in pharmacies to be sold as medicines.

 

[zoiDman]

Britain to regulate e-cigarettes as medicine from 2016 | Reuters


If it's "only" quality control....it may not be all that bad. Sounds like quality/chemical analysis. Still OTC. IDK what that fully means in the UK though.

Some juice vendors provide that occasionally now. Probably raises costs. I guess the "classification issue" is still a concern.

Exactly...

From the Reuters Article you posted...

The Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) said on Wednesday that existing e-cigarettes on the market were not good enough, with contaminants found in some products and nicotine levels often varying widely.

However, manufacturers will have time to raise their game and apply for a license, allowing them to sell regulated devices as over-the-counter products in a wide range of retail outlets from 2016.

This is what prompted me to post this.

From the BBC Article...

"Jeremy Mean of The Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) said the government had concluded that e-cigarettes currently on the market do not meet appropriate standards of safety, quality and efficacy."

Does anyone have a Link to the Standards that Mr. Mean is Referencing?

 

[AttyPops]

I guess it amounts to...types of regulation.

Food is a "drug" too. It has effects. Some even contain small amounts of nicotine. If you had 200 small "cookie shops" or 1000 "fish and chips" shops...and all of a sudden require licensing...what would happen to them? OTOH...."pubs" have to be licensed, yes? Food is subject to certain restrictions when sold, yes?

So does this turn the existing e-juice vendors into e-juice licensed "pubs" (B&M or internet based)? Or is it nastier? Leaving only a few "top" vendors in the field.

What about licensing only the nic base...that all other juice-vendors use? What about sanitary conditions? What about "Joe's Juice" made on the kitchen table?

I guess we have the same concerns in the USA. Only we're trying to keep it an open market and allow free enterprise to operate. Not much chance of that lasting, IMHO, but at least we're still open to it.

Regulating the devices, OTOH, is a different kettle of fish. Hmmmmm.....

 

[Vocalek]

Guess that the MHRA could not be bothered to read the 2007 report published by the Royal College of Physicians in the UK.

"It appears increasingly probable that some smokers may experience very long-term, perhaps lifelong, disruption of brain function, mood and/or cognitive ability following smoking cessation. Such individuals may require similarly long-term treatment support or nicotine maintenance, and this may account for the sustained use of nicotine medications by some ex-smokers, many of whom report that their use is to enable them to maintain abstinence."

Royal College of Physicians, Harm Reduction in Nicotine Addiction: Helping People Who Can't Quit.

 

[Markh5682]

You've completely missed the point. None of those restrictions would have had a long-lasting negative impact on the industry as a whole. In fact, a lot of us would, in theory, support a whole range of regulations and restrictions and welcome them with open arms.

To reclassify e-cigarettes as medicinal products, however, is a significant departure from the existing framework, which most vendors consider to be unethical and potentially illegal. Before this decision, the onus was on the EU to prove that e-cigarettes (and, therefore, traditional smoking products by proxy) were medicinal products as opposed to recreational products. The UK government has just done all the hard work for them, and handed the EU a major victory in the process. Over the next 3 years, the onus will now be on the community to prove that these products are purely intended for recreational use - a much much more difficult position for us to be in.

JJ

I can go to my local supermarket and buy practically any medicine I want cheaply and just as easily as a loaf of bread (with the exception of prescription meds that is) there is a whole aisle just for medical products, in fact the supermarket already stocks its cigalikes in the medicine aisle, so I don't think it will be any harder to buy ecig products as it is to buy a pack of aspirins, it does mean that ejuice will have to conform to whatever standards are set which might not be a bad thing.

I think it is still a little to early for us to start running round in circles shouting "we're all doomed" just yet.

 

[AttyPops]

I can go to my local supermarket and buy practically any medicine I want cheaply and just as easily as a loaf of bread (with the exception of prescription meds that is) there is a whole aisle just for medical products, in fact the supermarket already stocks its cigalikes in the medicine aisle, so I don't think it will be any harder to buy ecig products as it is to buy a pack of aspirins, it does mean that ejuice will have to conform to whatever standards are set which might not be a bad thing.

I think it is still a little to early for us to start running round in circles shouting "we're all doomed" just yet.

I think the concern is valid though. Today in the USA there are a lot of e-juice companies. If this type of regulation came about...there would be fewer. It that all bad if the quality goes up and is checked occasionally?

Kind of reminds me of all the complaining about the environmental regulations businesses have. On the one hand, they can be very onerous and excessive and raise all our costs. On the other hand, the number of poisonings and mercury in the environment has gone way down. Business always worships the dollar over safety. That's my concern with BT's juice quality too, for that matter.

I think it depends as much on HOW they do this as it does IF they do it.

 

[zoiDman]

Isn't this the Double Edged Sword of Quality and or Purity.

Take this Study that was done...

New Study: No Evidence E-Cigs Cause Cell Damage or Death | Ecig Advanced News

Say that a Substitute Coffee Flavoring was used in the One Offending e-Liquid and now it is shown to be Free of Cytotoxicity? Wouldn't that be a Good Thing?

Or if Diacetyl was by Law, was Prohibited from being add to e-Liquids? This type of Regulation seems Very Reasonable and Helpful.

Or BPA Free Plastic Bottles must be Used for Packaging e-Liquids?

It's where is the Lines are Drawn and how much Money is Needed to Comply with some of the Coming Regulations that seems to be the Concern.

 

[Bill Godshall]

The MHRA announcement is at
Nicotine containing products : MHRA

The MHRA press release is at
Media Centre : MHRA


Clive Bates has just weighed in the MHRA announcement
10 reasons not to regulate e-cigarettes as medicines
10 reasons not to regulate e-cigarettes as medicines « The counterfactual

ECITA denounces MHRA proposals condemning smokers to quit or die as bad news for public health
ECITA denounces MHRA proposals condemning smokers to quit or die as bad news for public health | ECITA Blog

 

[Bill Godshall]

The MHRA announcement is at
Nicotine containing products : MHRA

The MHRA press release is at
Media Centre : MHRA


Clive Bates has critiqued the MHRA announcement
10 reasons not to regulate e-cigarettes as medicines
10 reasons not to regulate e-cigarettes as medicines « The counterfactual

ECITA denounces MHRA proposals condemning smokers to quit or die as bad news for public health
ECITA denounces MHRA proposals condemning smokers to quit or die as bad news for public health | ECITA Blog

 

[Petrodus]

E-smoking is here to stay !!

 

[tommy2bad]

I can go to my local supermarket and buy practically any medicine I want cheaply and just as easily as a loaf of bread (with the exception of prescription meds that is) there is a whole aisle just for medical products, in fact the supermarket already stocks its cigalikes in the medicine aisle, so I don't think it will be any harder to buy ecig products as it is to buy a pack of aspirins, it does mean that ejuice will have to conform to whatever standards are set which might not be a bad thing.

I think it is still a little to early for us to start running round in circles shouting "we're all doomed" just yet.

I however can't because NRT isn't allowed as an over the counter produce, generic aspirin is not available nor non brand paracetamol. I live in Ireland and whatever regs the UK implement we will copy with the restrictions that the pharmacies add.
I think once declared medicinal then a can of worms is opened as to what else is medicinal.
I think this is based on the disposable pre filled carto model as how will they apply these regs to eliquid sold over the Internet, eliquid in general for that matter, will their be restrictions on the volume or quantity that can be purchased at any one time like other medicines?
The whole thing reads like it was badly thought out and just a 'meet the deadline' effort hoping that the EU's TPD will do the work for them.