20 Drops Isn't a ML!!

[zoiDman]

That's Cool. I love to hear people Argue. Especially if they are Passionate about it.

But let me ask you Two Questions…

What level of Accuracy do you think is Acceptable when you DIY?

When does a Level of Accuracy for you Exceed the Ability to Taste the Difference?

 

[FogHawg]

I'm never gonna make juice to sell & I don't think I'm that particular really, so drops seem accurate enough for me so far for the small quantities I make. Especially now that I know the actual ml count. I'm useing mostly ECX premixed base 50/50 @ 18mg & ECX flavorings. I'm a DIY noob tho & may change my technique as I go, but this seems to be gettin'er done for me right now.

 

[Rin13]

Don't throw them away :*( I keep them around for potent flavorings. Like the caramel cappuccino, tobacco absolute, menthol, etc.

Use one mill syringes for measuring flavorings.

10, 20 or 30 mill syringes for nic, pg , vg.

I throw away the free pipettes, and never count drops.

 

[FogHawg]

I keep seeing mention of tobacco absolute. Is it anything like ECX tobacco additive?

 

[Rocketpunk]

40 to 45 drops, plus or minus a few, has been sufficient to properly prime a carto, regardless of viscosity (100% VG could take significantly longer to soak). Basically, just drip until the top of the carto is no longer absorbing the juice and your polyfill looks like crushed ice. Check the airway-path to make sure it's not flooded. That should be enough.

Anything less than 40-45 drops, regardless of PG/VG ratio, and I still got burnt cartos. XL replacement cartos hold a LOT more juice than you'd think.

EDIT: I've learned the Ocelot method works just fine for priming a flanged replacement carto in a hurry. Fill a carto condom with juice, push the carto into the condom top-down, flip it right-side up, flick it a few times, remove the condom, wipe the top off, blow the excess juice from the carto, and bam, primed carto within less than 30 seconds. Messy, but it works.

EDIT: Thanks to the Ocelot. She'll always be mentioned whenever I suggest this method. ***Klingon fist-chest bump***

 

[tenshi]

For us who work in a lab, the chemical "rule of thumb" for low viscosity liquids like water and other solvents, it is 20 drops per ml from a pipette. However, because vapers work with higher viscosity liquids like VG, then that general rule will not work. Also, many droppers we get from different vaping sites are not standard size droppers... So use whatever dropper you're going to use and a graduated cylinder and count how many drops it takes to get to 1 ml. The bottom of the meniscus should be on the 1 ml line.

 

[zoiDman]

I'm never gonna make juice to sell & I don't think I'm that particular really, so drops seem accurate enough for me so far for the small quantities I make. Especially now that I know the actual ml count. I'm useing mostly ECX premixed base 50/50 @ 18mg & ECX flavorings. I'm a DIY noob tho & may change my technique as I go, but this seems to be gettin'er done for me right now.

Ok…

Here you go. Bavarian Caramel/Maple Twist ™

8.5ml 20.5mg 50|50 Unflavored Nicotine Base
6 Drops Caramel
5 Drops Maple
3 Drops Bavarian Cream
2 Drops Pralines & Cream
2 Drops Butterscotch
2 Drops Milk Chocolate
2 Drops Waffle
1 Drop Vanilla
5 Drops Sucralose
2 Drops Water
(Note: All Favors are FlavorArt)


Make 8.5ml of 20.5mg 50/50 Unflavored. I don’t really care how you make it and it really doesn’t matter. Use a Syringe, Pipette, Graduated Cylinder (My Method), Analytical Balance. Lines on a Test Tube, whatever.

Now add drops Directly out of the FlavorArt Bottles. Or if you are like me and have transferred All DIY Ingredients to Glass Dropper Bottles, directly from the Dropper Bottles

Shake well and steep in a Cool, Dark Place for 5 Days.

Vape with a New Carto/Clearo to enjoy all the Sweet-Complex Flavor.

------------

FAQ’s

So what’s the Concept?

The concept is that you are starting with a mg that is about 15% Higher than the desire Finished e-Liquid. But you are adding about 15% of Non-Nicotine Volume so the end result is about 18mg.

The Finish product might be 17.3 or 18.8mg. But I have found that Most people can’t tell the in these Small Variations in mg if they don’t know they are there. Also, Most retail Nicotine Base you buy has a +/- 10% mg anyway.

Why does it Work?

Using drops works because you don’t know what Bavarian Caramel/Maple Twist ™ should taste like. Just like you don’t know what ANY recipe should taste like Before you make it. And Just about Every DIY recipe needs to be Tweaked to personal taste.

So try it. If you like it but want more of a Chocolate Taste, no problem, add a drop of two of Chocolate to the Mix. Or Substitute some Chocolate for Caramel next time. Or add Marshmallow instead of Bavarian because that is what you have on hand. All but the Most Basic DIY Recipes need to be “Worked Up” and take 3 or 4 Iterations to fine tune to the Individuals Tastes anyway. Might as well do the Work Up using Drops.

Is the Recipe Accurate?

Sure, as long as you Write Down EXACTLY what you did and use the Same Droppers it as Accurate as using Syringes or Pipettes. The Volume of a Drop to another Drop using the Same Dropper is Remarkably Accurate. Want to make 30ml instead of 10ml? Just multiple everything by 3.

So Why Use Drops in the First Place?

Because it is SO MUCH SIMPLER and SO MUCH FASTER. Imagine making 200ml or so of 20.5mg 50/50 Unflavored “Pre-Mix”. Then when you want to mix a DIY Recipe, you just pour out 10ml (or 20ml or 30ml or whatever) of Pre-Mix and add Drops per your Recipe Card. No Sink full of Lab Ware to Wash and No Chance of Cross Contamination of Base Flavors using Syringes or Pipettes.

Also imagine how Cool it would be to have a Box full of Recipe Cards with Worked Up recipes, in drops, that involved no real Measuring. Just add Drops and Steep.

So what is the Downside?

Some people can Not Wrap their heads around the Concept that an e-Liquid isn’t Exactly 18mg. And that they could be vaping 18.6mg. That their 50|50 Ratio is Actually 53|47. Even though their Retail e-Liquid varies Numerically quite a bit from Batch to Batch. Or that they feel they can’t give someone else the Recipe. When actually, the recipient most likely is going to Tweak the recipe for their taste.

--------------------------------------------

So there you go. A Quick and Easy way to DIY involving Drops.

I’m sure there will be some Drop Haters out there who chime in saying This or That about how Terrible this method is. And that’s Cool. Do whatever technique makes you Happy. Nothing wrong with Using Syringes or Pipettes and measuring everything done to the .1ml Level.

Just know that DIY can be as Hard or as Easy as you want to make it. It All tastes about the Same either way.

 

[tc1]

Yet another reason to use percentages over drops. Also, a 3ml syringe works just fine for smaller batches (<30ml). Larger batches I generally use 5ml syringes (<60ml).

 

[zoiDman]

For us who work in a lab, the chemical "rule of thumb" for low viscosity liquids like water and other solvents, it is 20 drops per ml from a pipette. However, because vapers work with higher viscosity liquids like VG, then that general rule will not work. Also, many droppers we get from different vaping sites are not standard size droppers... So use whatever dropper you're going to use and a graduated cylinder and count how many drops it takes to get to 1 ml. The bottom of the meniscus should be on the 1 ml line.

The "Pre-Mix" I mentioned in Post #27 is something that I don't use Drops for. I use a Graduated Cylinder.

Not so much for the Accuracy, but because it takes Forever to Drop out 200ml.

But a DIY Recipe could be worked up Entirely using Drops. Some of my Earliest Recipes were done that way. Using a "Standard" eye Dropper.

 

[zoiDman]

Ok…

Here you go. Bavarian Caramel/Maple Twist ™

8.5ml 20.5mg 50|50 Unflavored Nicotine Base
6 Drops Caramel
5 Drops Maple
3 Drops Bavarian Cream
2 Drops Pralines & Cream
2 Drops Butterscotch
2 Drops Milk Chocolate
2 Drops Waffle
1 Drop Vanilla
5 Drops Sucralose
2 Drops Water
(Note: All Favors are FlavorArt)

...

BTW - Who cares what the Percentages are for the Flavorings in the above Recipe? Seems like the Taste is what matters.

 

[Hiding]

What if you want to make 100ml of Bavarian Caramel/Maple Twist at some point. Now you need to count 60 drops of caramel, 50 drops of maple, etc.
PITA, and in no way faster.

If you start off with 0.6ml caramel, 0.5ml maple, it is far easier and faster to make a bigger batch when you want to.

 

[tc1]

Ok…

Here you go. Bavarian Caramel/Maple Twist ™

8.5ml 20.5mg 50|50 Unflavored Nicotine Base
6 Drops Caramel
5 Drops Maple
3 Drops Bavarian Cream
2 Drops Pralines & Cream
2 Drops Butterscotch
2 Drops Milk Chocolate
2 Drops Waffle
1 Drop Vanilla
5 Drops Sucralose
2 Drops Water
(Note: All Favors are FlavorArt)

...

BTW - Who cares what the Percentages are for the Flavorings in the above Recipe? Seems like the Taste is what matters.

Because not all drops are created equal. So if someone with a larger/smaller dropper tries to replicate that recipe ... the finish product could very well taste much different and not what the recipe maker intended.

Some people might think "yeah but if you use the same size dropper for the entire recipe the flavors should balance out and taste just like the original." Unfortunately that is not always the case.

Some flavors will taste completely different at a higher volume, regardless if you increase the volume of the other flavors in the mix. Coffee flavors for instance can be VERY sensitive to slight imperfections in volume.

Now having said that ... people are free to make and post recipes however they desire. I'm just stating the potential errors this can cause when others try to replicate a recipe using "loose" measurements.

 

[Tepid]

I was going to argue the same thing as tc1.
And if you use the dropper topped bottles, I make the hole bigger so yours may not equal mine.

We will all have to state what dropper, syringe, blunt needle etc.
And yes, some flavors can make a difference by the drop. Otherwise some juices would not need tweaking by the drops ever, so that would make that whole argument moot.

Now i am not saying using drops is useless. But for following a from scratch recipe they are.


Try to recreate a good food recipe using a pinch of this and a dash of that only

It might be close but won't be the same.

Close only counts in horseshoes gernades and nuclear war

 

[Litcube]

So when you dudes measure with syringes, how do you take into account the amount in the needle? Or the tapered bit? What about the conical plunger capacity? Does any of this matter?

 

[Tepid]

The conical is moot as long as there is no air at the plunger
what is left in the needle only matters a little. But this is why u use short needles and graduated tubes

 

[Litcube]

What gauge of needle do you have to use to get that VG out of there!?

 

[tc1]

I could be wrong ...but doesn't a syringe already account for any volume in the needle? This is why you see nurses and doctors purge medication through the needle before injection. As far as leaving trace liquid inside, that's going to happen no matter what you are using.

 

[RollandOfGilead]

So when you dudes measure with syringes, how do you take into account the amount in the needle? Or the tapered bit? What about the conical plunger capacity? Does any of this matter?

You can over draw if the amount in the needle worries you.. for .2 mls draw the syringe to .5 and dispense to .3.

And if I can chime in here on the drop vs percentage/measuring thing. I have a DIY mix that I started with measuring drops.. was fantastic every time until I bumped up the batch volume... once you are changing the volume the inconsistent measuring by drops matters alot... and is a biotch to math out correctly after the fact.

Sent from my SGH-I747M

 

[FogHawg]

and is a biotch to math out correctly after the fact

If you checked & know your drop/ml ratio I don't see the problem. What am I missing here?

 

[Litcube]

Yeah I don't get it either. If you made 10 perfect batches in a row with drops, are you saying they aren't the same if you dump all 10 batches into one bottle?