4 batteries twelve hours, WTF!!!!

[Shotline]

I have had four batteries stop working in the last twelve hours. Three different suppliers, 2 of the 4 batteries have the same symptom.

One Ego XL from Tasty Vapor (about 2 months old), won't take a charge and when I press the button it just flashes. When put on the charger, the button doesn't flash and the charge light stays green.

1 Ego from Good Prophets (about 3 months old), when the button is pushed the light comes on like normal but nothing at the atty.

two Riva's from Eastmall (about 2 months old (one of them had not been used until today though)), all with the same symptom. The light does not come on when I press the button but when I attach an atty the atty starts burning like the button is pressed but still no light on the button. When they are attached to the charger the charge light turns red but the button does not flash like normal.

All were using a LR atty at the time they went belly up. Does anyone have any idea what the problem may be or if there is a way to get them working properly again? I realize that the first two could just be age (but I had the other eGo XL I got from Tasty Vapor stopped working about a month ago and that shouldn't have been an age problem).

The manufacturers (not necessarily the suppliers fault) had better stop putting out this kind of crap. As it is they have lost a customer for their batteries as this frustration has caused me to go order a mod so that at least I won't have to be paying $20.00 for a damn battery any more.

Since June I have only had one atty go out on me but I have had 7 batteries bite the dust.

I am down to one eGo battery and my two original 510's but the 510's only last about 15 minutes.

This is really starting to piss me off........HELP!!!!

 

[LowThudd]

Check the attys for debris. They can short out if there is debris in the batt connection. Also, are you using LR attys? That could be a problem also, they pull too much current for the eGo type batts.

 

[Shotline]

I have checked for debris, nothing. Yes I am using LR atty's, but everything I have read says they are ok for eGo types.

The Riva's seem to just be stuck on. I put a meter on them and am getting 3.6 and 3.9 volts.

 

[LowThudd]

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/madvapes/127262-about-low-resistance-specific-batteries.html That thread covers it. Not such a good idea on a mosfet batt.

 

[Shotline]

Well now I am ...... off! Now I shift the blame to the suppliers who all say "Only use low resistance atomizers on eGo batteries, not on regular 510's." We can't use them on eGo's either.

Well, I have one eGo battery still working and two 510 batteries. I have put away all my LR atty's and will pray that the batteries I have last until my MadVapes order comes in.

 

[tybin]

could it just be that the charger is bad???

 

[Shotline]

No, it charges the remaining battery fine. Also, with the two riva's going rogue on me I think it is the LR attys.

 

[Drozd]

it's more than that unfortunately...
any 18650 battery.....AW IMR 14500....AW IMR 16340....

in reality these are the ONLY batteries you should be using a LR atty on where the LR atty isn't going to kill the batteries capacity over time and kill the # of recharge cycles of the battery...
as a bonus those batteries are the only ones that WILL push the LR atty at the capability it has..

it's all about the amp draw of the atty versus the max drain rate of the battery....

for example lets look at a 1.5Ω LR atty at 3.7V... it has an amp draw of 2.47A....

now lets take the ultrafire 1200 mAh 18350 battery...
it's an ultrafire so it has a C rating of 1.5C...
so it's mAh times c rating and then divide by 1000 to get the max drain rate... 1200 * 1.5 /1000 = 1.8A (ut oh)

so the battery can at max deliver 1.8A to something that's asking for 2.47A...
obviously it cant give more than it's max...and since in figuring the amp draw the resistance of the atty is fixed the only way the amp draw can drop is by the voltage "sagging"
and the battery is still running full open which overstresses it...which causes a build up of "rock" material in the battery...the more that material builds the more the capacity drops til it wont take a charge...

now the AW IMR 16340...although a smaller battery and a lower mAh rating have a much higher C rating and therefore a much higher max drain rating (like 4A)
550mAh * 8C /1000 = 4.4A (quite a bit higher than the 2.47A needed)
so no overstessed battery and no voltage sag...

 

[LowThudd]

it's more than that unfortunately...
any 18650 battery.....AW IMR 14500....AW IMR 16340....

in reality these are the ONLY batteries you should be using a LR atty on where the LR atty isn't going to kill the batteries capacity over time and kill the # of recharge cycles of the battery...
as a bonus those batteries are the only ones that WILL push the LR atty at the capability it has..

it's all about the amp draw of the atty versus the max drain rate of the battery....

for example lets look at a 1.5Ω LR atty at 3.7V... it has an amp draw of 2.47A....

now lets take the ultrafire 1200 mAh 18350 battery...
it's an ultrafire so it has a C rating of 1.5C...
so it's mAh times c rating and then divide by 1000 to get the max drain rate... 1200 * 1.5 /1000 = 1.8A (ut oh)

so the battery can at max deliver 1.8A to something that's asking for 2.47A...
obviously it cant give more than it's max...and since in figuring the amp draw the resistance of the atty is fixed the only way the amp draw can drop is by the voltage "sagging"
and the battery is still running full open which overstresses it...which causes a build up of "rock" material in the battery...the more that material builds the more the capacity drops til it wont take a charge...

now the AW IMR 16340...although a smaller battery and a lower mAh rating have a much higher C rating and therefore a much higher max drain rating (like 4A)
550mAh * 8C /1000 = 4.4A (quite a bit higher than the 2.47A needed)
so no overstessed battery and no voltage sag...

Man, everytime I think I've learned alot from you in a previous post, you come back and top your previous info. TY!

 

[Drozd]

Man, everytime I think I've learned alot from you in a previous post, you come back and top your previous info. TY!

bah it's just the math...
Amp draw is just voltage divided by resistance...

and max drain...mAh (in amps) times C rating....

you always want the max drain to be higher than the amp draw....

* for simplicity since most manufacturers don't give the C rating
you can assume a c raing of 1 for generic Li-Ion
*fire has a C rating of 1.5C
*aw has a C rating of 2C (except for LiMN high drains)
AW 16340 high drain has a C rating of 8C
AW 14500 high drain also has a c rating of 8C
(compared to the BDL version which is 5C)
BDL makes a 10440 IMR but with it's capacity and 3C rating is almost pointless for our application (that's a 1.8A max drain... and a standard 2.3Ω 510 amp draw is 1.61A)

*granted as we go up in resistance some of the batteries become more acceptable for certain atties...but we're talking LR here

EDIT: it's also why I find certain mods that take 2 10440 batteries and then say they're VV as kind of laughable.... a cheaply made 10440 IMR can barely make the amp draw of a 510 atty at 3.7V.. the regular ones certainly can't (at little more than .53A) apiece... now you're telling me that 2 of them regulated down from 7.4 is going to be in any way capable? let's see a 510 at 6V is 2.61A, 5V is 2.17A, 3.7V is 1.61A, 3.1V is 1.35.... so even if you can double the max drain so they're running wide open in dozens of said mod the world over 10440 batteries are crying

 

[LowThudd]

I'm just glad I don't care for LR attys. lol What do you think of the 1300mAh ego batts? Mega Ego Kits : Arctic Vapor, Personal Vaporizers & Handmade E-liquids Think they are capable of using LR attys safely?

 

[Drozd]

I'm just glad I don't care for LR attys. lol What do you think of the 1300mAh ego batts? Mega Ego Kits : Arctic Vapor, Personal Vaporizers & Handmade E-liquids Think they are capable of using LR attys safely?

nope...not only doesn't the max drain rate not cut it... but the ego type batteries and the cheap mosfet ....they're on borrowed time from the get go

see previous post about 3 specific batteries...well technically one size and 2 specific batteries in other sizes...