All Mechanical- a flaw in thinking.

[Grammie]

Nothing in a GG switch that can fail, unless dirt acculates. Simple (a couple minutes at most) weekly cleaning eliminates the "fail" with the GG.

Before anyone gets started on the "Fan Boy" route, don't go there. I am simply stating facts about my mechanical device.

 

[Firefly13]

Nothing in a GG switch that can fail, unless dirt acculates. Simple (a couple minutes at most) weekly cleaning eliminates the "fail" with the GG.

Before anyone gets started on the "Fan Boy" route, don't go there. I am simply stating facts about my mechanical device.

I am a GG fanboy, there's no denying that, and i do own other mods too, but none of them are as robust as my GGTS, i've even replaced the bottom cap spring with the fuse protection upgrade so the whole mod doesn't even have any springs in it whatsoever. The only thing i had to replace which was my own fault was a 69 cent o-ring for the firing pin. Took 2 seconds to put another one on.

And if anyone wants to throw up the variable voltage debate, thanks to Buzzkill and the Terminator adapter i can use any voltage on my GG mods without messing with them internally.

 

[Liv2Ski]

Nothing in a GG switch that can fail, unless dirt acculates. Simple (a couple minutes at most) weekly cleaning eliminates the "fail" with the GG.

Before anyone gets started on the "Fan Boy" route, don't go there. I am simply stating facts about my mechanical device.

As I stated in my earlier post no issues. Either way there are great PV's out there and one for all types (mechanical, electronic). I believe the OP was just stating that purely mechanical is not the end all be all of PV's. I have seen many posts were somone will reference a Provape or something similar and people start with "it is not all mechanical so it can break". This in fact is not true and the provape has a LIFETIME warranty. For me I am overjoyed that my shipping notice for the ProVari just came through and I will be vaping huge clouds while I push my electronic button and test atty resisitances, change voltages and enjoy a nice LED display. To each their own and there is no right or wrong, just personal preference. Happy Holidays

 

[Grammie]

Please, no one be offended by my comments. I just did not want it to turn into a "fanboy" argument.

I spent a lot of $$'s on e-cigs, my findings have led me to mechanical device, simply because it's easy to fix (should anything ever go wrong). I can leave home with just one device and rest assured that it will work everytime.

OP, I think it was a very good topic to bring up. Should be very helpful to the newcomers.

 

[Goldenkobold]

Thanks everyone,
I have enjoyed reading the resulting posts....In my original post I was not advocating for or against any particular mod, nor mechanical mods on the whole, just the idea that mechanical= hassle free. I think mechanical means that you can do the upkeep yourself...and that means a lot to many people. I am not stating that mechanical= worse than a hybrid (of mechanical and electrical elements) pv either...just that they all, at this point, have some faults...whether its doing weekly cleaning on your mechanical..praying your switch doesn't break on your electrical switch device...or hoping that your new vv can handle your strange atty/volt combination.

Someone did mention the GLV which would not be a mechanical mod...at least I don't see how the 5v version could be...though from everything I have heard they are solid units.

 

[oldsoldier]

Having read through this thread I'm seeing both "sides" of the debate. But my two cents is there is no thing as a mechanical mod just "wireless" and what some people erroneously label "switchless".

You cant have an all mechanical mod unless you are vaporizing the juice by friction! I know its nitpicky but I bring this up to make a point of the silliness of arguing over mech versus electronic. A good mod should last a very long time without needing reapirs or adjustment. In the end ALL mods wear out or need adjustment/repair.

IMHO a high quality mod made from high quality parts with superior craftsmanship is going to be reliable. In my experience as a helo crewchief over 20 years, the simple rugged designs are the most reliable both electronically and mechanically. As was stated before more parts = more possible points of failure. I think that's where the mechanical guys can claim an edge since every solder joint is another possible point of failure.

 

[Grammie]

Having read through this thread I'm seeing both "sides" of the debate. But my two cents is there is no thing as a mechanical mod just "wireless" and what some people erroneously label "switchless".

You cant have an all mechanical mod unless you are vaporizing the juice by friction! I know its nitpicky but I bring this up to make a point of the silliness of arguing over mech versus electronic. A good mod should last a very long time without needing reapirs or adjustment. In the end ALL mods wear out or need adjustment/repair.

IMHO a high quality mod made from high quality parts with superior craftsmanship is going to be reliable. In my experience as a helo crewchief over 20 years, the simple rugged designs are the most reliable both electronically and mechanically. As was stated before more parts = more possible points of failure. I think that's where the mechanical guys can claim an edge since every solder joint is another possible point of failure.

a technicality, the device is all mechanical. You have to add stuff with it to make it vapable/usable. That's not part of the mod! I'm just pullin' your chain! I'm offically on my vacation until the New Year.

Everyone have a safe and happy holiday season!

It's like a description on taking pills/medication, take one pill three times a day.....how on earth are you going to take one pill 3 different times of the day? It is impossible to accomplish with only one pill. I said that many many moons ago (about 7 years old, 56 now) to a doctor. My mom abruptly started to yell at me you don't say things like that to a doctor at which time he told her I was correct, you can not take the one pill multiple times.

 

[Knowone]

Wouldn't a mod with electronic components such as voltage regulators, LCD displays, and time-based circuit cut-offs be the same as a mechanical mod, but with more components to fail? If they have an integrated battery, therefore eliminating the need for access to the battery, that's one less point of failure. But, I can't think of any other differences. Maybe I'm missing something else here, though...

 

[Grammie]

I wouldn't see those type as being wholely mechanical. Definitely more parts to fail, and not user friendly to fix.

Mechanical, as I see it, is being able to fix it on your own. I surely couldn't fix one like you are describing, and for me it would definitely be more expensive to have it fixed. Plus, I would be without my mod while it is in transit to and from the vendor (if the vendor could fix it). Chances are the vendor/reseller couldn't fix one like you describe, unless it's a locally made mod.

 

[floridamale]

Wouldn't a mod with electronic components such as voltage regulators, LCD displays, and time-based circuit cut-offs be the same as a mechanical mod, but with more components to fail? If they have an integrated battery, therefore eliminating the need for access to the battery, that's one less point of failure. But, I can't think of any other differences. Maybe I'm missing something else here, though...

I don't view any PV with any type of circuitry as being mechanical or designed for long term usage

 

[sosolidgold]

Wouldn't a mod with electronic components such as voltage regulators, LCD displays, and time-based circuit cut-offs be the same as a mechanical mod, but with more components to fail? If they have an integrated battery, therefore eliminating the need for access to the battery, that's one less point of failure. But, I can't think of any other differences. Maybe I'm missing something else here, though...

i don't have a pro vari but it looks like an awesome toy lol i would get one if i had the cash to throw around aside from having a vv and the 18650 voltage booster thingamajig. the lifetime warranty is a huge plus. i haven't read what is included on it but LIFETIME! if that covers switches, failures, then sending it back and using another mod imo is not a hassle.

 

[BuzzKill]

I don't view any PV with any type of circuitry as being mechanical or designed for long term usage

so your cell phone is NOT a long term usage device ??? hummm you better order a new one soon LOL

What amazed me is the tendency to go Caveman with a PV , Sure the Chinese made and make some CRAP , BUT that does not mean that any PV that has electronics is CRAP just because it has electronics inside .

As this market and the mods mature they will be more reliable , Not to say that they are not now but any product gets more reliable with market time and upgrades .

If you have never tried a PV with control you will not understand the enhanced performance that can be gained by control , now it just has to be easy to use ! ( trust me I know , ours uses a screwdriver to adjust it , our new ones will not ! )

 

[Liv2Ski]

so your cell phone is NOT a long term usage device ??? hummm you better order a new one soon LOL

What amazed me is the tendency to go Caveman with a PV , Sure the Chinese made and make some CRAP , BUT that does not mean that any PV that has electronics is CRAP just because it has electronics inside .

As this market and the mods mature they will be more reliable , Not to say that they are not now but any product gets more reliable with market time and upgrades .

If you have never tried a PV with control you will not understand the enhanced performance that can be gained by control , now it just has to be easy to use ! ( trust me I know , ours uses a screwdriver to adjust it , our new ones will not ! )

And when you notify me that the infinity is ready to order I will put that beauty in my arsenal also.

 

[hifistud]

You have to laugh. Let me just point at your televisions, the ECU in your cars - even the keyfob that opens the central locking. If it's built properly, an electronic device with circuits will just work... and probably not need noaloxing every half hour, or cleaning with emery boards to maintain contacts...

 

[Firefly13]

You have to laugh. Let me just point at your televisions, the ECU in your cars - even the keyfob that opens the central locking. If it's built properly, an electronic device with circuits will just work... and probably not need noaloxing every half hour, or cleaning with emery boards to maintain contacts...

I've never had to do any of that stuff with my GG mods, i've got no idea what you're talking about.

I do own all mechanical mods, but i will add the Infinity to my collection because it's only 80 bux and i want to support Buzzkill's business so he can continue to make next level variable voltage devices, after all, he started it all with the Buzz. His Terminator adapter is great.

 

[rolygate]

I think there's a place for both mechanical and electronic mods. It's like anything - vehicles, boats, guns - you choose it for the job it'll do and/or how you feel about it. A farm tractor and a Ferrari are both useful, depending; a simple sailboat or a carbon kevlar raceboat both do the job but you know which one will still be around and in good working order in 20 years; most revolvers beat any auto ever made if the test is dropping onto concrete and dragging it through muddy water then expecting it to fire when needed.

I used to work in a gun workshop back in the 70s, we only made captive bolt guns (for abattoirs) and 20mm cannons, kind of a strange mixture. The bolt guns took the worst beating of any equipment I have ever seen in a lifetime of engineering: they'd come back for servicing in an unbelievable state. Some had a half-inch coating of matted blood and hair and were part-jammed although they still sorta worked; some had big score marks where they'd been dragged along the concrete floor with a lot of weight on them, and were bent to hell...

You put them in a bucket of disinfectant and detergent overnight... Then attacked them with a Mole wrench in the morning. Scrub up the bronze and stainless steel, maybe ream some distorted internal diameters out, fit some new parts - and they were good to go, ready for another few months of massive abuse. Only stainless steel and bronze can take that punishment, ali would be finished in 24 hours. There is always a place for a mechanical device made from stainless, bronze and cupronickel, and it will last for ever. Your lifetime, for sure.

The other approach is to make it with all the bells and whistles, with an electronics package. But the devil is in the details with these - some last, some don't. Until e-cigs come with a fully-encapsulated, plug-in, no servicing required, user replaceable electronics package, they can't be considered as (ultimately) reliable as an agriculturally-built mechanical ecig.

I like electronics as much as the next guy but there are still a bunch of myths about this stuff. Take solid state drives for example: they look like a really good replacement for server hard drives, on paper. This is the service requirement for a server hard drive:
- server disks have the toughest life in computers, they are hammered 24/7 - so they must be reliable
- must have fast data retrieval, therefore 15,000 rpm disks are best (disks come in 7,200, 10,000, or 15,000 rpm)
- should have a long, problem-free service life
- should be easily-replaceable, plug-in changeout
- should have large capacity
- ideally as cheap as possible

So, large 15,000 rpm disks are what most dedicated servers use as they are the best option: fast, big, easy changeout, and they last longer than you might think.

Along came solid state disks: all-electronic, no moving parts, the fastest data retrieval of all. Good choice for servers then?

No - they break down faster than even the fastest hard drives. After a few months the fault levels on an SS are so high it has to be scrapped. Large-scale hosts with a lot of data on disk life will tell you that, contrary to all logic, SS disks are the least reliable of all. They don't recommend them unless you need ultimate speed, don't mind the small capacity, and are willing to pay a premium price for a new one every six months. You can't beat the old mechanical ones, at this moment in time anyway.

If you want peace of mind, you just can't beat stainless steel / bronze / cupronickel. If you want all the whizzo tricks then electronics is the kiddy. But unless you're very lucky you'll need a spare. And stay away from water or anything that can zap them, static being the best example - the big, fat spark you sometimes see in a static electricity discharge has 20,000 volts behind it, and a lot less than that will kill electronics. Also anything with an amplifier chip in it, and switched on, can get zapped by a mobile phone.

 

[Knowone]

I think some of you misunderstood my post. What I meant was that it seems to me that PVs with electronic parts are susceptible to the same failures that fully mechanical PVs are. But, in addition, they have electronic parts which can fail.

Don't get me wrong. I'm a gadget junkie, and an IT professional. I love electronics. But, PVs that include extra gadgetry still have threading that must be unscrewed to access the batteries, threads to connect the atty, a button that can fail, springs to hold the batteries in place, etc...

So, how is it that they are not susceptible to the same mechanical shortcomings that fully mechanical PVs possess?

EDIT: rolygate is 100% correct regarding SSDs. They are not as reliable as disk-style hard drives.

 

[BuzzKill]

If you want peace of mind, you just can't beat stainless steel / bronze / cupronickel. If you want all the whizzo tricks then electronics is the kiddy. But unless you're very lucky you'll need a spare. And stay away from water or anything that can zap them, static being the best example - the big, fat spark you sometimes see in a static electricity discharge has 20,000 volts behind it, and a lot less than that will kill electronics. Also anything with an amplifier chip in it, and switched on, can get zapped by a mobile phone.

Roly gotta argue with you on this point , at least what we use is not effected by ESD ( electrostatic discharge ) in circuit , some others like buck or boost types may have be more sensitive but they really are pretty well protected . hell if a cell phone being turned on could kill an amp then how do the amps in the CELL PHONE stay alive ??

also an amp near a cell phone will only work IF it is designed for that frequency so an audio amp will not even SEE the cell phone freq.
Just saying ,

I would like to make sure that the proper info is out there !

 

[BuzzKill]

I've never had to do any of that stuff with my GG mods, i've got no idea what you're talking about.

I do own all mechanical mods, but i will add the Infinity to my collection because it's only 80 bux and i want to support Buzzkill's business so he can continue to make next level variable voltage devices, after all, he started it all with the Buzz. His Terminator adapter is great.

Thanks for the Kudos Firefly ! I appreciate it !

 

[oldsoldier]

I am kind of partial to simple solid engineering, which BTW does not preclude adding bells and whistles.
I'm thinking about building a mod for personal use and have put some thought into what would make it durable and dependable.

So far my design parameters include a juice feeder, sheet copper for busses, minimal to no wires and ideally a simple mechanical connection as the switch. LEDs are cool but in my vision you need to socket them, not solder then to leads and epoxy them in a hole in a case.

I think the reason people "go caveman" is that a poorly soldered mod crammed into a cheap project box is way more likely to fail. It really isn't a matter if hi tech versus low tech, its a matter of careful consideration in design, followed by proper construction.

Hi tech is cool, especially when you can swap out black boxes if one fries. But ideally you should be able to bypass the feature (say a voltmeter imbedded in the case- or flashlight/radiation detecor/GPS unit atty connector LOL) and continue to vape since its really just a cool option.