Australian ban; Egar illegal

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Lithium1330

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Nov 22, 2008
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Painting any white cigs you have with heat-resistent paint, ór taking off the white paint leaving stainless-steel look, will allready go a long way for that probably... just avoid white for e-vapers. That's a good start anyhow, I think.

What about using a silicone catheter attached to the atomizer on one end and a mouth piece on the other end? then we could put the electronic device in a pocket and inhaling trough this catheter (watchout not overheating it :S), looks like low key to me, what do you think?

Many months ago I posted suggesting "e-vaping" needed to be separated from smoking for the political risk it posed (http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...rum/567-important-notice-all-suppliers-2.html).

I work with politicians and didn't make my original post lightly. It's one of those occasions when I wish I was wrong but in this case of Victoria/Australia things have either been badly reported or got completely out of hand. If it's the latter - I expect Aussies will soon remind their politicians of whose interests they're paid to represent.

And you was so right, maybe we must to learn to read carefuly what people with experience are saying.
 
Some amazing rational posts appearing here!!!
with regard to the "Legislature " concerning the possession ad use etc etc of our units I am still awaiting clarification/confirmation from both the Age newspaper and the Minister, none of which is forthcoming at this stage.
I note that the article is simply quoting the media release from the Minister , it is entirely possible this is purely spin on behalf of the Govt , and may not in fact have been passed as law??
In my original letter to the Minister I have asked that he provide the research and reports undertaken that brought him to this decision, I think this is the telling factor.
Did the department do any research other than legal opinion that led them to their decision?
It is only by providing evidence to the various governments around the world that our pastime will survive, which is why I am asking you all , to start thinking about this , start pressuring the retailers/suppliers/manufacturers to start collating evidence and reproducible scientific research to ensure the future of e-smoking, electronic vapourising, or whatever we call it.
I have had confirmation that the manufacturers in China are well aware of what has happened here.
Quote from my retailer in China

Dear Simon,

Thanks for your information. We've already known such bad news. It's really a bad news. We already informed the manufacturers about it as well. Maybe the manufacturers together with the Australian distributors will do something to negotiate with the Australian government, I am not sure. But I don't think it's usuful.

All our customers consider e-smoking is better than tobacco smoking. But as e-smoking business is competing with tobacco business, it's predeterminate that it can not avoide troubles.

Anyway, It's lucky your package passed customs before the ban.

The ball is rolling, but it will need pressure from countries who's market is bigger than ours, and who still have the freedoms to purchase and use the products.
You guys have something we dont have, the ability to lobby and research BEFORE a ban, we had our chance and wasted it I guess, something we would not have done had there been rumblings before the decision... it was that more than anything that led us here, the outright secrecy and devious implementation by our authorities, which may have well overstepped the mark , but as we all know its far easier to prevent a change rather than try and undo one....
 
For the US peeps... here is my reply from Dr Neal Benowitz perhaps the worlds most repected researcher on nicotine

Simon,



I am sorry to hear about your problem using the nicotine inhaler. I am certainly sympathetic to your plight. I suspect the Australian authorites, like the US authorities, want evidence that the nicotine devices do what they say, that they are safe (ie no contaminants), etc. Cigarettes certainly do not meet the safety criteria but they are exempt from product regulation. I suspect that you will have to wait until the evidence is presented to your authorities.



NB



Neal L Benowitz MD

Professor of Medicine, Psychiatry and Biopharmaceutical Sciences

University of California San Francisco Box 1220

San Francisco, CA 94143-1220

tel 415-206-xxxx

fax 415-206-xxxx

( I didnt feel right posting his phone numbers lol )

I think it is important for US people to note the correlation between the US/AU authorities mentioned above?
 

Soot

Super Member
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Oct 11, 2008
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No contaminates? Does the state have this right? Does the state exercise this right?

No! It doesn't have this right!

A new car with lower emissions is congratulated and given tax breaks by the state. Is it contaminate free?

A new e-cig is condemned and banned so that vapers return to being smokers paying for a health service that will then discriminate against them.

Some Orwellian quotes come to mind!
 

TropicalBob

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Jan 13, 2008
5,623
65
Port Charlotte, FL USA
Dr. Benowitz is on target.

And this is not about forcing vapers to return to cigarettes. That's not the choice. It's about forcing vapers to use approved NRT methods to quit cigarettes. There's a big difference and the government will play that trump card if someone officially whines that it's either e-cigs or regular cigs. It's not.

Our devices are not approved by any government agency, and the present unregulated state of Chinese nicotine sold over the Internet for inhalation is simply intolerable. What agency would approve such a scenario? Our situation virtually demands regulation and government oversight. We will have to compromise if our devices are to have any future at all.

Work with authorities on the compromises necessary to make these legal products for personal vaporizing.
 

lucisac

Senior Member
ECF Veteran
Sep 15, 2008
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Lucisac, make the points Dr. Laugesen makes in his letter. I consider it a tragic mistake to in any way compare our inhalers with a tobacco cigarette. That will trigger a form response: Your government is commited to eliminating tobacco use within a decade. Period. End of their comment. You need to push all the points made by Dr. Laugesen. Your "rights" aren't an issue, either. There is no right to purchase and use addictive drugs. That should be obvious. Don't deviate from what Dr. Laugesen wrote. And we are not NRT, unless you want to wait years for tests and certification. Leave real cigarettes out of this discussion.

The likelihood of anyone saying, "Oh, we made a mistake, Sorry. We'll just take back the ban", is about the same as a comet impacting Australia today. But the case needs to be made so that this doesn't become a precedent for other governments to follow. It won't be easy. It will require reasoned argument on the highest level.

Overnight, I did adjust my own thinking about the term "electric nicotine inhaler." I agree that that doesn't cover our devices. There is a possibility of our devices being used for real inhalation therapy, as well as supplying addicts their nicotine. That being the case, I return to favoring "personal vaporizer" instead of "electric nicotine inhaler."

Unfortunately, as we've noted as long as a year ago, the label e-cigarette is now in popular use (even the very name of this forum), so we likely cannot change this. We can only refuse to refer to our devices that way in official correspondence.

From reading comments on the Australian social forum ... you guys are thinking rationally and planning well. Keep it up.

Hi TropicalBob, thanks for your comments, can you please point me in the right direction to where the points by Dr. Laugesento are made cause I must of missed them, I'd like to read them please.
 

trog100

Moved On
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May 23, 2008
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There's a big difference and the government will play that trump card if someone officially whines that it's either e-cigs or regular cigs. It's not.

it is for me bob.. and i suspect thousands like me.. our lot already banned the tea bags long ago..

sorry dude but most of these experts we are seeking the help of are either on the wrong side or talking cover their own tracks nonsense..

prove its safe really is utter rubbish.. it cannot be done..

i think the gandhi approach is best.. quietly get on with your e smoking.. force them to stop u.. then if the world is still here in six months time have a rethink..

china is very near to australia and the customs dont have the manpower to check every micky mouse parcel that arrives..

stop kidding your selves that in todays world u have any rights.. u dont..

trog
 

deewal

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Aug 30, 2008
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In a house.
I agree with Soot. I think it is Victoria State that has acted illegally.

Maybe if you Aussie e-vapers agree to wearing some sort of symbol on your clothes(a yellow star would be allright) and all agree to live in a designated area (a ghetto i think is the correct name) until they can resettle you somewhere "in the East" they would allow you to carry on ?

Hitler made a Race of People called Jews illegal overnight (Kristalnacht)
He also was an Anti Smoker and believed that a persons body belonged to The State.
He got very close to World Domination.

Having said that i think most Governments and States on the planet are acting illegally and are totally corrupt and no longer care about the Welfare of People only the Control of them.
 
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riddle80

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Nov 25, 2008
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I'm not only thinking of myself, but the millions that could improve their quality of life with these by replacing traditional smoking w/vaping. I think these are the logical next step to analogs and when I see them being banned for no good reason except not being able to tax them it makes me want to do something about it and not just sit back and wait for it to happen to me. Grrrr...
 
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