Batteries, Chargers and Safety...OH MY!

[DoctorJ]

I recently purchased a VAMO https://ivape.net/index.php/VAMO-APV.html along with https://ivape.net/index.php/18650-TrustFire-Li-ion-3.7V-2-pack.html and https://ivape.net/index.php/Trustfire-Tr-001-Multicharger.html

I've been reading the threads on batteries and safety. What are trusted, safe batteries and chargers and what to avoid. I'm looking at recomendations other VAMO owners have made and wondering if my purchase is a good one or should I get something different such as what seems to be more highly recommended such as Amazon.com: 4pcs Panasonic CGR18650CH 3.6 Volt Li-ion shipping free 18650 Battery 2250 mAh: Everything Else and http://www.amazon.com/JETBeam-Intel...F8&qid=1364023466&sr=8-5&keywords=nitecore+i4

I read the threads on batteries and got lost very quickly. I'm am by no means techy or have much knowledge when it comes to modern electronics, although I can repair a Fender amp circa 1980's. I'm getting totally lost when it comes to the modern Li-ion batteries and how they work. I get the basics, but the more advanced functionality of these products is beyond my comprehension.

Would appreciate any input IN LAYMAN'S TERMS PLEASE..so that a total nooob understands.

When I received my initial order, the batteries didn't come with the order, so I think this might be a good thing so I might be able to return the batteries and charger I have in case it isn't a good purchase on my part. I've waited another week for the batteries to come in, so waiting another week won't kill me if I need to make a "better" purchase.

Also I've noticed "battery ratings" such as a "C" rated battery. What does this mean and how can I tell what the rating is?

Thanks for any input/advice in advance!

 

[Cheechako]

Tag for info

 

[Balders]

Good choice with the Nitecore I4

In very simple terms:
The mAh rating of a battery is how many milli-amps it can chuck out in an hour, so 2000mAh is 2A for 1 Hr (1,000 mA = 1A), 4A for 1/2hr, 0.5A for 4 Hrs etc
The C rating is a peak value, what I can chuck out for a little while. A value of 20C (for example) means it can push out 20 times its rated continuous for a limited time

So a 2000mAh with a 20C rating can dump 40A for an short time

 

[Kaywalsk]

Those batteries and that charger are pretty much exactly what you need, my friend. Wise choices.

 

[Davenkay]

Take good care of those Pannie's. They are the best battery you can get.

 

[patkin]

They may have changed the page but, if not, that's not the battery a Vamo needs. It only works properly with IMR batteries. The a protected li-on may work for seconds and then quit... mine did. There are threads about it here... one is mine... by people asking why their Vamo wasn't working right and the advice is always... IMR batteries only. It seems the protection in the Vamo and the one in protected batteries don't work together.

 

[garyd]

They may have changed the page but, if not, that's not the battery a Vamo needs. It only works properly with IMR batteries. The a protected li-on may work for seconds and then quit... mine did. There are threads about it here... one is mine... by people asking why their Vamo wasn't working right and the advice is always... IMR batteries only. It seems the protection in the Vamo and the one in protected batteries don't work together.

I've used protected in the Vamo without issues, not all devices may be the same.

 

[jcal]

Good choice on the Panasonic and Nitecore charger .that's what I finally got after wasting my money on other junk.congrats
Oh and I don't know anything about the Vamo. but I use on my segelei zmax and they are great

 

[Elantis]

I've been reading the threads on batteries and safety. What are trusted, safe batteries and chargers and what to avoid. I'm looking at recomendations other VAMO owners have made and wondering if my purchase is a good one or should I get something different such as what seems to be more highly recommended such as Amazon.com: 4pcs Panasonic CGR18650CH 3.6 Volt Li-ion shipping free 18650 Battery 2250 mAh: Everything Else and http://www.amazon.com/JETBeam-Intel...F8&qid=1364023466&sr=8-5&keywords=nitecore+i4

DoctorJ...I have purchased a Vamo which hasn't arrived as of yet, and probably read all the same threads you did. According to my understanding it was the Panasonic Batteries along with the NitecoreI4 Charger that was the best fit, and these are what I ordered.

 

[patkin]

I've used protected in the Vamo without issues, not all devices may be the same.

In mine the 18650 works but not the 18350.... it only works hit and miss and then for a few seconds before shut off.

edit: you can find the reason here: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/vamo/376429-18350-bat-doesnt-work-my-vamo.html

 

[niczgreat]

The two most common upscale chargers in the industry are the
1. Pila Pila IBC Charger for 14500 / 17500 / 18500 / 18650 3.7 volt Lithium Battery Charger
2. xtar Wp2 XTAR WP2 II Charger Newest Model For 18650/18700 Batt. W/ Car Adapter U.S. SELLER! With Car Adapter! Fenix TK11, TK12, TK15 - Amazon.com

The Pila is pricier but has a super following. The Xtar WP2 is also well regarded.
I can recommend the Xtar because I've owned it for more than a year and have had batteries last forever using it, one glitch that cheaper or older chargers have is that they will overcharge IMR Batteries.
The Xtar and Pila won't do that.

I have absolutely no knowledge about the charger you chose. It's probably a good one.

As for protected verse unprotected. It all depends on how you vape. If you are using LR Attys/clearos/cartos than you might need a IMR Battery. Also for Dual Coils and extreme vaping. If you are moderate using a 2.3ohm or higher single coil up to around 5v than a regular protected is fine. Extreme vapors in the 6V range should be using protected batteries.

 

[DoctorJ]

OK, I"m not sure if I stated my OP well.

THESE are the batteries and charger I purchased

https://ivape.net/index.php/18650-TrustFire-Li-ion-3.7V-2-pack.html
https://ivape.net/index.php/Trustfire-Tr-001-Multicharger.html



I was wondering if these were a better choice to consider later down the line

Amazon.com: 4pcs Panasonic CGR18650CH 3.6 Volt Li-ion shipping free 18650 Battery 2250 mAh: Everything Else and http://www.amazon.com/JETBeam-Intel...F8&qid=1364023466&sr=8-5&keywords=nitecore+i4

And if the batteries don't work with the VAMO, it will of course be my fault and I'll be out $10. I should've looked at the return policy for iVape before ordering, but my excitement got it the way.

"We do not accept returns or replacements due to user error, for example reasons such as: I don't like it - I thought it was something else - I did not like the color - I didn't know what I was buying - It doesn't fit my current model, etc. - will not be accepted for return. We expect you to take responsibility for your own decisions in these types of matters. Please do not return anything without an RMA number - any non authorized merchandise returns will be returned to sender, or thrown away at your expense. We do not accept returns on physically damaged items."

Had I read this, I never would have ordered from them in the first place. NOT THEIR FAULT, TOTALLY MINE...and I'm not trashing their policy, however, for something like this you'd think they might make an exception. Also, IMHO this policy seems a bit draconian and not very "customer friendly." But, it's their policy, so I'll live with the consequences.

 

[garyd]

OK, I"m not sure if I stated my OP well.

THESE are the batteries and charger I purchased

https://ivape.net/index.php/18650-TrustFire-Li-ion-3.7V-2-pack.html
https://ivape.net/index.php/Trustfire-Tr-001-Multicharger.html



I was wondering if these were a better choice to consider later down the line

Amazon.com: 4pcs Panasonic CGR18650CH 3.6 Volt Li-ion shipping free 18650 Battery 2250 mAh: Everything Else and http://www.amazon.com/JETBeam-Intel...F8&qid=1364023466&sr=8-5&keywords=nitecore+i4

And if the batteries don't work with the VAMO, it will of course be my fault and I'll be out $10. I should've looked at the return policy for iVape before ordering, but my excitement got it the way.

"We do not accept returns or replacements due to user error, for example reasons such as: I don't like it - I thought it was something else - I did not like the color - I didn't know what I was buying - It doesn't fit my current model, etc. - will not be accepted for return. We expect you to take responsibility for your own decisions in these types of matters. Please do not return anything without an RMA number - any non authorized merchandise returns will be returned to sender, or thrown away at your expense. We do not accept returns on physically damaged items."

Had I read this, I never would have ordered from them in the first place. NOT THEIR FAULT, TOTALLY MINE...and I'm not trashing their policy, however, for something like this you'd think they might make an exception. Also, IMHO this policy seems a bit draconian and not very "customer friendly." But, it's their policy, so I'll live with the consequences.[/QUOTE

I have used the trustfire/ultrafire batteries before and never had a problem, their mah is overated though. I've always used a multimeter to check their charge before and after. Are the panasonics and the efest imr's a better choice, yes.

 

[Mudflap]

The charger you bought from iVape will work just fine, but it should never be left unattended while it's recharging batteries. A "smart charger" such as the Pila, XTAR, or Nitecore is a better choice for both safety and longevity of your batteries. Smart chargers shouldn't be left unattended either, but they're considerably less likely to overcharge a battery which could potentially cause a lot of damage. I'd advise you to pull the trigger on the Nitecore and keep the TR-001 as a backup.

The batteries you bought from iVape will work in your Vamo, but they're definitely not ideal. Higher voltage/wattage settings on your Vamo will demand more current than these batteries can safely provide. These batteries have a protective circuit board (PCB) which will act as a circuit breaker and cut the flow of current when the current being demanded of these batteries becomes greater than what they can safely provide. (just put them in your charger for a few seconds to reset the PCB) If you like standard resistance attys/cartos at 4.5 volts or less, I'd say use these batteries and don't worry about bad results. It's highly unlikely. The Panasonic batteries you're considering are very well suited for use in the Vamo. They offer safety, performance, and peace of mind.

I'm just parroting what previous posters have contributed, but I hope it's helpful.

 

[angryguy77]

The charger you bought from iVape will work just fine, but it should never be left unattended while it's recharging batteries. A "smart charger" such as the Pila, XTAR, or Nitecore is a better choice for both safety and longevity of your batteries. Smart chargers shouldn't be left unattended either, but they're considerably less likely to overcharge a battery which could potentially cause a lot of damage. I'd advise you to pull the trigger on the Nitecore and keep the TR-001 as a backup.

The batteries you bought from iVape will work in your Vamo, but they're definitely not ideal. Higher voltage/wattage settings on your Vamo will demand more current than these batteries can safely provide. These batteries have a protective circuit board (PCB) which will act as a circuit breaker and cut the flow of current when the current being demanded of these batteries becomes greater than what they can safely provide. (just put them in your charger for a few seconds to reset the PCB) If you like standard resistance attys/cartos at 4.5 volts or less, I'd say use these batteries and don't worry about bad results. It's highly unlikely. The Panasonic batteries you're considering are very well suited for use in the Vamo. They offer safety, performance, and peace of mind.

I'm just parroting what previous posters have contributed, but I hope it's helpful.

Why do these chargers help prolong battery life? I have trustfire charger, but now I'm considering upgrading to a nitecore or xtar if it will mean my batteries wil last longer.

 

[garyd]

Why do these chargers help prolong battery life? I have trustfire charger, but now I'm considering upgrading to a nitecore or xtar if it will mean my batteries wil last longer.

Safety is one concern, different chargers charge at different rates, also some use a trickle at end of charge and some don't.
Charging Lithium-Ion Batteries

 

[DaveP]

I've used a Trustfire TR-001 daily for more than two years with no problems, but I don't leave it charging unless I'm available to watch it. Mine has been a reliable charger for rotating 4 AW 18650 IMRs for my Provari and a couple of 14500s that I use in a Madvapes box mod.

I've been thinking about ordering a fancier, smarter charger but haven't gotten around to it yet. For a first purchase, the higher priced chargers make sense. Once you use a cheap one, the pressure is less to upgrade because the cheapo works just fine and you get complacent. Having it to do over again, I'd spring for a Pila.

Everyone needs a backup and you could do much worse than the TR-001.

 

[garyd]

I've used a Trustfire TR-001 daily for more than two years with no problems, but I don't leave it charging unless I'm available to watch it. Mine has been a reliable charger for rotating 4 AW 18650 IMRs for my Provari and a couple of 14500s that I use in a Madvapes box mod.

I've been thinking about ordering a fancier, smarter charger but haven't gotten around to it yet. For a first purchase, the higher priced chargers make sense. Once you use a cheap one, the pressure is less to upgrade because the cheapo works just fine and you get complacent. Having it to do over again, I'd spring for a Pila.

Everyone needs a backup and you could do much worse than the TR-001.

Yep, the key is to never leave unattended with any charger, get a multimeter/voltmeter to make sure your batteries are charging properly, if you have a battery that is getting hot or looks like it's ballooning dispose of it in a proper manner immediately.
Forgot to mention let batteries rest for at least 1 hour before charging after use and 1 hour after charge before use.

 

[niczgreat]

A trustfire will put the maximum voltage into the battery and than cut off. They are also cheap construction and stories of them overcharging batteries and failing is a known issue.

My familiarity is with the xtar Wp2, both the Pila and Xtar use algorithms to charge the battery.
The Xtar wp2 detect the voltage of the battery. If it's very low it will start out at a trickle charge to revive the battery. Than charges at full mode. In the final step it trickle charges the battery to it's maximum around 4.2V. The end charge is precise.

Both the Pila and the WP2 use Algorithms of charging that are designed to charge batteries in a way in which stress is not placed on the battery, with a result that your batteries last longer. In addition they both have a reputation for quality specifically not overcharging batteries or breaking down.

The rule of thumb is don't charge batteries at a voltage greater than there MAH. In addition the xtar has two settings 1amp and 500ma. So to extend life on the smaller batteries charge at the Lower 500 Mah level. So if you have a 14500 or a 18350 you set it manually to 500ma. The slower charge is easier on the battery and will extend the life.

Also if you have a trustfire and are charging 2 batteries at the same time it will 1/2 the voltage and take double the time to charge. The Xtar has independent charging channels. and will charge per the spec 2 X 1amp [two batteries simultaneous at 1 amp]

 

[Rader2146]

Yep, the key is to never leave unattended with any charger, get a multimeter/voltmeter to make sure your batteries are charging properly, if you have a battery that is getting hot or looks like it's ballooning dispose of it in a proper manner immediately.
Forgot to mention let batteries rest for at least 1 hour before charging after use and 1 hour after charge before use.

Why should I let the batteries rest before and after ?