Battery marriage...needed or not? Testing starts soon.

[KS_Referee]

Mooch I'm not sure if this has been discussed much, probably has, but I have noticed something which is very common that I think would cause much more mismatched harm than whether or not a battery set was married. I've noticed on both of my chargers AND on all of my mods that the voltages show more discrepancy than I believe them to have. It bugged me enough that I tried spinning each cell in their socket just to make sure the contact was clean both on the cell and on each end of each socket. On my Efest Luc V4 and V6 chargers I get instant feedback when there is a voltage change when I spin the battery in the socket... and I can say from experience that I can see a noticeable change in voltage at times.

All that is from is the surface contact between the contacts. I've cleaned the contacts with several different DeoxIT and other electrical contact cleaners. I've even attempted using extremely light coats of dielectric grease (which I later cleaned off and flat out discontinued using to prevent the grease from attracting other contaminants) yet I still have the occasional voltage discrepancy that is invariably resolved with a simple light "spin" rotation of the cell in the socket.

I guess my question is do you and others regularly spin/rotate cells in their sockets as you put them in to insure proper contact? I find myself doing it almost all the time now, just in case.

Thanks in advance for the response.

 

[Mooch]

Mooch I'm not sure if this has been discussed much, probably has, but I have noticed something which is very common that I think would cause much more mismatched harm than whether or not a battery set was married. I've noticed on both of my chargers AND on all of my mods that the voltages show more discrepancy than I believe them to have. It bugged me enough that I tried spinning each cell in their socket just to make sure the contact was clean both on the cell and on each end of each socket. On my Efest Luc V4 and V6 chargers I get instant feedback when there is a voltage change when I spin the battery in the socket... and I can say from experience that I can see a noticeable change in voltage at times.

All that is from is the surface contact between the contacts. I've cleaned the contacts with several different DeoxIT and other electrical contact cleaners. I've even attempted using extremely light coats of dielectric grease (which I later cleaned off and flat out discontinued using to prevent the grease from attracting other contaminants) yet I still have the occasional voltage discrepancy that is invariably resolved with a simple light "spin" rotation of the cell in the socket.

I guess my question is do you and others regularly spin/rotate cells in their sockets as you put them in to insure proper contact? I find myself doing it almost all the time now, just in case.

Thanks in advance for the response.

Yes, just out of habit I reseat or spin every cell I put into a charger. I don't even notice myself doing it anymore.

 

[KS_Referee]

Yes, just out of habit I reseat or spin every cell I put into a charger. I don't even notice myself doing it anymore.

Cool... I was wondering if I was being overly OCD. Thanks again!

 

[Jim_ MDP]

Cool... I was wondering if I was being overly OCD. Thanks again!

Not at all... you've noticed it makes a difference getting it seated properly.
Next up... water is wet, film at eleven.

j/k

We do operate them in close contact to an aerosolized non-conductive liquid.
And I vape in the room with my chargers.
Does that make a difference?
Don't know, but I do the same with every mod that I can as well (watch those wrappers though).

 

[r77r7r]

Mooch I'm not sure if this has been discussed much, probably has, but I have noticed something which is very common that I think would cause much more mismatched harm than whether or not a battery set was married. I've noticed on both of my chargers AND on all of my mods that the voltages show more discrepancy than I believe them to have. It bugged me enough that I tried spinning each cell in their socket just to make sure the contact was clean both on the cell and on each end of each socket. On my Efest Luc V4 and V6 chargers I get instant feedback when there is a voltage change when I spin the battery in the socket... and I can say from experience that I can see a noticeable change in voltage at times.

All that is from is the surface contact between the contacts. I've cleaned the contacts with several different DeoxIT and other electrical contact cleaners. I've even attempted using extremely light coats of dielectric grease (which I later cleaned off and flat out discontinued using to prevent the grease from attracting other contaminants) yet I still have the occasional voltage discrepancy that is invariably resolved with a simple light "spin" rotation of the cell in the socket.

I guess my question is do you and others regularly spin/rotate cells in their sockets as you put them in to insure proper contact? I find myself doing it almost all the time now, just in case.

Thanks in advance for the response.

I've almost quit using the e-grease around the house, I am trying the red liquid Deoxit. Try that maybe? Although if Mooch spins his batts perhaps that's the best way.

 

[DaveP]

I see the same voltage drop thing on the two chargers I use side by side (Efest LUC4 and Xtar VCT4). 2 of my three matched pair batts will hit cutoff and the third will still be charging. A quick spin in the socket and it registers charged.

I clean my contacts periodically. It must be a dissimilar metal issue. That, or outgassing from lithium batteries. The vents are on the positive end.

 

[KS_Referee]

The reason I mentioned reseating or spinning the the cell when the voltage seemed hinky was because I am of the opinion a 3.7v 20a 3000mah cell that has been married with other cells I suspect the actual voltage drain should be within .1v or .2v, if not equal just about every charge or discharge. I realize I'm certainly not a battery (cell) guru but I do understand the flow of electricity. So assuming the married cells are manufactured the same with very consistent manufacturing control processes, have not been damaged and do not have a manufacturing flaw, I am pretty certain they should charge and discharge at the same rate. Again, just my opinion, a vape cell that has been married shouldn't be off in voltage by .3v to .5v or more as that would be a very good indicator that one or more of the cells is experiencing a failure of some sort.

I see this as an opportunity to detect potential cell failure before it happens. I am of the opinion that reseating (spinning) the cells if their voltages seem a little out of sorts either in the charger or in a mod that shows individual cell voltages should bring the voltages pretty much back into equilibrium unless there is some sort of a problem in the cell.

Maybe I'm just overthinking the whole thing but I think it might be something worth mentioning to folks who don't understand electricity as well because it could give them a heads up to a potential oncoming battery failure. I was just wondering if the battery gurus and people with solid electrical backgrounds did the same, and if it was for the same reasons. I'm really not trying to step in as a newbie to the forum and act like some kind of a know it all.

BTW... I appreciate the positive responses to my question.

 

[Mooch]

I see the same voltage drop thing on the two chargers I use side by side (Efest LUC4 and Xtar VCT4). 2 of my three matched pair batts will hit cutoff and the third will still be charging. A quick spin in the socket and it registers charged.

I clean my contacts periodically. It must be a dissimilar metal issue. That, or outgassing from lithium batteries. The vents are on the positive end.

Even the tiniest bit of outgassing means complete cell failure, it's ruined.

 

[KS_Referee]

Even the tiniest bit of outgassing means complete cell failure, it's ruined.

Wow... I liked DaveP's post and somehow missed the outgassing part of it. Yea... that wouldn't be a good thing.

Anyway Mooch... I apologize, I did not mean to hijack your thread. I'm looking forward to see your test results on married vs unmarried cells. I have married my cells for years with camera equipment, just because I always read to do that but never based on any stated electrical theory that I can recall. Never once did I question it but when I think about any cell set, either parallel or series, the lowest voltage cell always sets the bar in that all the other cells push more current, dropping their voltages at a higher rate until the voltage stabilizes across the cells. I think your results will make for a good read.

On a lighter note... I have a lot of cells married in groups of 3. Does that make them polyamorous cells?

 

[DaveP]

Even the tiniest bit of outgassing means complete cell failure, it's ruined.

I always wondered whether battery warmth sometimes caused a tiny release of something at the molecular level through the vent holes visible around the positive terminal. Kind of like how you begin to smell the steak as it warms up on the grill.

 

[Mooch]

I always wondered whether battery warmth sometimes caused a release of something at the molecular stage through the vent holes visible around the positive terminal.

The venting holes at the top let out any gas and fluid if the cell vents. But that only happens if the battery reaches a very high temperature and pressure. The prescored metal venting disk under the top contact will then split open and release the pressure/gas.

Otherwise, the battery is completely sealed. Gastight and watertight.

 

[DaveP]

The venting holes at the top let out any gas and fluid if the cell vents. But that only happens if the battery reaches a very high temperature and pressure. The prescored metal venting disk under the top contact will then split open and release the pressure/gas.

Otherwise, the battery is completely sealed. Gastight and watertight.

That explains the process. I always wondered if there was a free path through the vents for heat/air expansion with temperature that let things equalize with temp. I've never really searched out a good source for how the vents were constructed. Scoring would by design make the cell expand and vent at the weakest point in the case.

Thanks for that. I learned something new once again!

 

[Jim_ MDP]

On a lighter note... I have a lot of cells married in groups of 3. Does that make them polyamorous cells?

Since getting an RX over a year ago, I've always called them the "Utah" sets... if that answers your question.

(and I think the word you wanted was "polygamous"... many could tell you, marriage doesn't necessarily mean amorous )

 

[srg2692]

Any news on this front Cap'n Mooch?

 

[r055co]

subscribe

 

[Mooch]

Any news on this front Cap'n Mooch?

About 5,000 cycles total done, less than a thousand to go.

 

[SteveS45]

Any preliminary data to report @Mooch? Maybe some indications on which way the testing is leaning?

 

[juicynoos]

Thanks @Mooch , very interested to see your results shortly. Are you exclusively using the 3 cell sled for testing?
My rx200 battery rotation, if followed strictly, always results in the same cell being in the middle position. Not sure how I feel or want to deal with that one!!!!

 

[Cheallaigh]

i got an alien 220 on boxing day, only got a brand new set of batteries for it yesterday(30Q), as i had to wait till someone restocked... i was using an unmarried set of hg2s, i can say i tried to match them as best i could for age and use. after using them for the last few weeks, one battery was definitely not doing as well as the other, the gap between the A and B battery was getting wider, despite mainly charging them in a xtar. i found i couldn't put them in one of my other dual battery mods(DB 160w) and connect them to charge via usb, it had an ! warning me of an issue. rather glad i finally got the new ones via the mail finally.

 

[Mooch]

Any preliminary data to report @Mooch? Maybe some indications on which way the testing is leaning?

Nothing has exploded.