Bummer, I was doing so well.....

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Ponygirl

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Jun 24, 2010
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but being a stress smoker (which means I smoked all the time), I had more analogs today than intended.
I don't feel guilty, per se, but my question is should I bump up the nicotine. I am currently at 30 from MS. T's, but when I think I need that extra, is it wise to jump to 38?
One more question, is it possible to be addicted to not only nicotine, but any one of the toxic chemicals that are found in analogs?
Just asking :oops:
 

Automaton

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Jun 23, 2010
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Hey Ponygirl,

Yes, it is entirely possible that you're addicted to one of the many other chemicals in cigarettes. The most likely is MAOI's, which block the re-absorbtion of dopamine. Nicotine also makes more dopamine, so in combination, you wind up with a ton of feel-good dopamine in your brain without it being reabsorbed as quickly.

So when you take away the MAOI's in cigs, that e-cigs don't have, your dopamine level drops as your brain starts to re-absorb it.

A lot of people struggle with this aspect of cig addiction. But something that some people have found really helpful is supplementing e-cigs with Swedish snus. The combination of the two has gotten a lot of people completely off cigarettes.

Maybe something to look into? I haven't tried it, so I can't comment on its efficacy.
 

NCC

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Jan 14, 2010
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I smoked 1-2 packs a day. But, my cigarettes weren't really all that stout (More Reds). Still, I found that, especially in the beginning, higher nic levels helped me with cravings. I'm not being very successful in bringing the nic down over time, but I'm pleased as punch to not be smoking. So I'm not too concerned with nicotine cessation, not now anyway.

There are other substances in cigarettes which some people miss more than others. MAOIs, various alkaloids. Some people suppliment their vaping with smokeless tobacco products such as snus if they have a real problem with this.

No need to feel guilty (glad you're not) or failure. Keep it up. Even a reduction in smoke is worthy! :)
 

drillbit

Full Member
Jul 12, 2010
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Great information someone pointed me to. The whole read is good.
I switched of the tobacco a couple days ago, it is a change but this change is wayyyyy easier than any other time i tried to get off the cigarettes.

Mister said:
From the ECF Library

Disclaimer: I am not a medical professional. The symptoms described below and attributed to either to under or over dose of nicotine are from various sites and reports. References are listed at the end of the article. I can not promise that they are absolute indications. Above all in your process of switching to vaping, listen to your body. If you can work out what it is telling you then that's the best advice of all. If symptoms are severe or prolonged please see a doctor.

Although many new vapers quickly adapt without problems, others find themselves struggling with their symptoms and/or with finding a nicotine strength which satisfies them.

If you are struggling to find satisfaction with vaping after a few days, weeks, or even months (some people have found that vaping works at first but a craving for something else develops over time) then I hope that this note will be helpful.

The first thing to recognize is that some symptoms of switching from smoking to vaping are not related to your chemical needs:

1. There is no quick satisfaction (rush) from vaping. Nicotine reaches the brain very quickly from smoking. Nicotine absorbed by vaping has a slower smoother effect.1 This changes the feel a bit and it may take a while to get used to the different delivery speed. It also can make it hard to tell when you are getting too little vs. too much.

2. Smoking delivers carbon monoxide, vaping does not. This is of course a good thing. But if you feel a lack of "rush" effect from vaping this could be the cause. You will adapt to this, carbon monoxide isn't something you are addicted to.

3. You may feel a sore throat, dry mouth, and/or cold-like symptoms. For most people this passes after about a week. Drinking more liquids may help. Note that these are common symptoms of quitting smoking2,3,4 related to tar. For a particular person they may or may not be aggravated by vaping.

4. Some people have reported allergy symptoms when switching to vaping. If cold-like symptoms persist beyond a week, or you have other allergy symptoms (e.g. itching, runny nose, hives), you may be reacting to something in the e-liquid. You might try switching to a different flavor and/or to a different kind of e-liquid (Most e-liquids use either PG or VG as a base, you might react to one but not the other.) And it could be that there is some other cause - if symptoms are severe you should consider seeing a doctor.

5. You may start producing more phlegm for a month or so and have associated coughing2,3,4. If you've quit smoking in the past you'll recognize this symptom. Your lungs are clearing some of the tar from the past at a faster rate than they could while you were smoking.

6. Hiccups. As a new vaper you may find yourself swallowing some juice when you overfill cartridges, flood your atomizer, and then suck it in by mistake. Swallowing nicotine can trigger hiccups. (This effect has been widely observed with nicotine gums.) You'll learn how to avoid flooding the atty with practice.

Now let's talk about the nicotine strength to use. Your body doesn't feel right but you don't know whether to reduce or increase the level of nicotine you are vaping. Or you've increased the nicotine strength a few times and it isn't helping.

Many symptoms of over-dosing on nicotine and of cigarette withdrawal are similar so it can be hard to tell which of these is happening.

The symptoms of nicotine overdose are clearer indicators of what is happening in your body than the symptoms of withdrawal. This is because nicotine overdose has been studied a fair bit. Nicotine withdrawal has not been studied nearly as much. What has been studied a lot is cigarette withdrawal which is a different thing - it includes no longer inhaling a few thousand chemicals, not just nicotine.

Symptoms of nicotine overdose:
confusion5,6,7,8
racing pulse, palpitations6,7,8
salivation, drooling6,7,8
agitation6,7,8
physical fatigue, weakness6,7,8
muscle twitching5,8
vomiting5,6,7,8
hearing or vision problems5
Symptoms of cigarette withdrawal which I think are primarily associated with nicotine withdrawal:
increased appetite2,4,9
constipation2,4
Symptoms of cigarette withdrawal which may be due to nicotine withdrawal but may also be due to withdrawal from something else:
cravings2,3,4,9
difficulty concentrating2,3,4,9
irritability, frustration, anger2,3,4,9
drowsiness, mental fatigue2,4
insomnia, sleep disturbances2,3,4,9
anxiety, panic3,4,9
Symptoms which have been associated both with nicotine overdose and with cigarette withdrawal. These are symptoms which can make it hard to tell what's going on:
headaches3,4,5,6,8
nausea3,4,5,6
dizziness2,4,5,6
depression3,4,7,8,9
diarrhea4,5,6
breathing difficulties2,4,5,7,8
sweating3,5,6
With luck you'll be able to match up a few things you are feeling with symptoms which indicate that you are overdosing or underdosing, then adjust your nicotine level accordingly and start feeling right.

But what if you have symptoms on both lists? I.e. you think you've found your nicotine level (e.g. because you went past it and had some signs of overdose) but you are still badly craving "something."

Some people have found themselves increasing their nicotine level further and further without satisfaction, doing what I call "chasing the X-Factor." If you find yourself clearly experiencing symptoms of nicotine overdose and still strongly feeling withdrawal symptoms (particularly cravings) then you are probably in this group. This group of people appear to be addicted to something else in cigarettes as well as to nicotine.10,11

If you are chasing the X-Factor I recommend you start by reducing your nicotine level until the overdose symptoms disappear. More nicotine is not going to help you. You have a few choices on how to deal with the problem:

1) Tough it out. With luck by vaping you will eventually kick the addictions other than the one to nicotine. No one knows how long this will take, nor even whether they might be permanent. (Though as with nicotine addiction it does seem likely that many people can eventually kick it.)

2) Start smoking a few cigarettes again, just the minimum required to avoid the withdrawal symptoms.

3) The approach I recommend: Supplement your vaping with some "Swedish snus" or another smokeless tobacco to get the chemicals you're missing. Many people on this forum who found vaping alone to be inadequate have succeeded by using some Swedish snus per day in addition to vaping. It may not even take many to make a big difference - I currently use 2 to 3 snus per day and it makes all the difference for me.
 

SuZamme

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ECF Veteran
Verified Member
I still use 36mg from time to time. 24mg most of the time now.

When I first started vaping I used 36mg all the time.
Also try other juices. I found that tobacco with menthol suited me much better in the beginning than the other flavors.

Now I like menthol, some tobacco, and then other flavors as the mood strikes.

This is a process and is different for everyone. There is no right or wrong way...just whatever ends up working for you and makes you feel a great accomplishment and victory over every analog you don't smoke.

There are many articles on ECF and threads about the journeys of many, many members of ECF. Troll the forum and you will find all kinds of information and support for all the stages.

Vape On!!!! You have started your journey!!!!
 
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