Charging internal battery mods via USB

[Islandswamp]

Hello all, quick question here.

This week I got the g150 mod and the v8 stick by smok. I love them both. I've been using the usb cords they came with plus a wall adapter for a cell phone charger to charge these things. Is that OK to use or should I plug them into my laptop or get a special type of wall adapter? I ask because the guy at the closest vape shop told me that USB charging removable batter mods was OK (which nobody else ever said and I find dubious) as long as you don't get your power from the wall (he said that the voltage in a wall socket varies too much.

If there IS a special wall adapter I should get, please let me know so I can get it. I want to get a long life out of these until I'm ready to buy the real alien kit.

Bonus points for anyone who can tell me if I should be charging these things a lot, or if I should wait until they just about die to charge them. I can't find a straight answer online.

 

[bwh79]

The little "dongle" chargers used with ego/evod/"pen-style" vapes tend to be cheap and unreliable, so it's recommended to only ever use those with a computer or 500mA (0.5 Amp) wall adapter since they may not limit the current flowing into the battery, and so you want an adapter that won't put out any more than what it can handle. Anything more modern, where you just plug one end of a standard micro-USB cord into the device, and the other end into a power source, for those, any old USB port will do. Lower output (computer ports and 500mA adapters) will charge the battery at a more moderate pace, increasing the time it takes to reach full charge. Higher output adapters (1A and 2A) will charge at a faster pace, although this generates heat and reduces the overall lifespan of the battery. Around 1 amp is generally considered best as it allows for decent charging rates without generating too much heat. The device might get noticeably warm if you charge it at 2A.

Charge the battery whenever it's convenient. Lithium-ion cells don't have the "memory" issues that rechargeable batteries of years past used to have. These ain't your granddad's Ni-Cad's. What you don't want is to let them get too low. At around 2.5 volts the battery starts to deteriorate. If you attempt to recharge it after that, bad things can happen (like, conductive copper becoming electro-plated onto the inner surface of the battery where it doesn't belong, which could lead to an internal short-circuit at any time and without warning.) If you're going to store them for long periods, discharge the battery to about 50% beforehand and keep them cool but dry (so like, in the cellar, not the fridge.)

Islandswamp...MTG player then? Seen you around on other forums, I think...

 

[IMFire3605]

Being both devices have internal LiPo (Lithium Polymer) battery packs charging them the way you are is absolutely fine, you really do not want to use a USB port off a computer incase the charging circuit in the devices have a voltage or amperage spike or fluxuation which could potentially ruin you computer USB port or damage the motherboard on the computer. For both devices your wall wart should minimum output 5Volts @ 500mah (1/2 amperes), but it would be advisable to get a decent wall wart that can output 1 to 2 amps, especially for that g150 with its 4200mah battery pack, @1/2 charge current it will take 4 upward of 8 hours of charge time at that charge current, having a 2 amp charge source the charging circuit in the mod will only pull what it is programmed as max input current, so if it charges at 1amp and you have a 2amp supply it will still only max out at 1amp. As far as frequency you need to charge them, they are Lithium based batteries, meaning unlike Nickel Cadmium or Nickel Metal Hidryde of old, the battery retains no charge memory, so you can recharge them whenever as you have a regulator circuit that will not pull the charge down below 2.5 to 3.0v which can damage a Lithium based battery or overcharge above 4.2v which again will damage a battery. Lithium batteries are rated life expectancy in full charge cycles, from about 3.0v lowest up to 4.2v highest (this is a full charge cycle), this rating is generally about 250 to 300 full cycles, half or partial cycle charge can double to triple this rating as it is less stress and damage to do so.

With regulated mods, which both are, another stresser is high power at lower voltages, the lower the charge on the battery, more amperes are pulled from the battery to achieve needed voltage/wattage set, so example with your g150, at max watts will pull the most amps, higher that consistent charge on the battery will equal less amps

150watts/6.4volts charge/90% control board efficiency = 26.0147amps needed

where

150/8.4v full charge/90%= 19.8413amps needed

 

[Islandswamp]

The little "dongle" chargers used with ego/evod/"pen-style" vapes tend to be cheap and unreliable, so it's recommended to only ever use those with a computer or 500mA (0.5 Amp) wall adapter since they may not limit the current flowing into the battery, and so you want an adapter that won't put out any more than what it can handle. Anything more modern, where you just plug one end of a standard micro-USB cord into the device, and the other end into a power source, for those, any old USB port will do. Lower output (computer ports and 500mA adapters) will charge the battery at a more moderate pace, increasing the time it takes to reach full charge. Higher output adapters (1A and 2A) will charge at a faster pace, although this generates heat and reduces the overall lifespan of the battery. Around 1 amp is generally considered best as it allows for decent charging rates without generating too much heat. The device might get noticeably warm if you charge it at 2A.

Charge the battery whenever it's convenient. Lithium-ion cells don't have the "memory" issues that rechargeable batteries of years past used to have. These ain't your granddad's Ni-Cad's.

Islandswamp...MTG player then? Seen you around on other forums, I think...

Thanks for the info! And yes, I am a Magic player. I also write about the Vintage format for a few places.

 

[Islandswamp]

Ok, that's why this was taking so long to charge. It drains slow even with heavy use, but it takes a long time to charge too. I really love it though. I'll do a google search for a nice wall wart for these things. I'm so used to my older devices with a smaller mah but quicker charge time it made me think I was doing something wrong!

 

[bwh79]

I also write about the Vintage format for a few places.

Oh yeah, I've seen your articles on MTG Goldfish! I have to admit I don't really read them though, as Vintage isn't really my bag. I used to follow Standard, but I don't play enough anymore to keep up. These days, I'm strictly into budget Modern.

I did take a quick look at your "Vintage on a budget" article. Then I looked at the "paper" prices and could not click the "back" button fast enough

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Hi there,

Here's my blog about batteries, which includes a section about charging.
Battery safety - 18650 | E-Cigarette Forum

As far as wall adapters go, just get one that is certified, a good brand, and so on, simply said, not a cheap piece of garbage. I've seen some decent power bar coming out lately (which provides that 10-50-100K warranty for devices plugged into them) that have USB ports for charging built-in, which could be another option.

You can use your computer just fine, but note that you should know what the Amp. rating for your device is and get an adapter that's build for it.

Note that the slower you charge a lithium battery the better as the battery stays cooler. This impacts the battery's overall lifespan.

Note that most devices will charge "normal" for a while until it reaches 90-95% and then switches to a trickle charge to top the rest off.

So even with devices that can charge at high Amp. it's better to stick to a 0.5A or 1A adapter.

 

[Smoke_too_much]

Hi Islandswamp & welcome
Generally I've read the recommendation that if you can independently charge your batteries outside your mod do so. It seems to be related to a question of the quality of charging circuits in the mod. This is recommended for all mods but especially for Multi cell ones as they raise further questions relating to balanced charging among the cells. That said I suspect we've all used the internal charging one or more times and I can't really comment about how true these concerns are.

No battery expert here but again my understanding of li-ion batteries is that it does not harm them to charge them whenever you want. Unlike Ni-cads which have a memory li-ions don't and I don't think it reduces their life any more than dragging them lower before recharging. Don't over charge and don't drag them too low in power before recharging. I'm sure one of our battery experts will respond and be more precise in their answer to you.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Hi Islandswamp & welcome
Generally I've read the recommendation that if you can independently charge your batteries outside your mod do so. It seems to be related to a question of the quality of charging circuits in the mod. This is recommended for all mods but especially for Multi cell ones as they raise further questions relating to balanced charging among the cells. That said I suspect we've all used the internal charging one or more times and I can't really comment about how true these concerns are.

This was for mods from the first mods with replaceable batteries from years ago... mods make in the last 2-3 years have very little issues with charging but people keep holding on to outdated notions. Not to say that all mods are the same and I'm sure some might not charge perfectly, and considering that for any sealed mod (built-in non-removable), it's not like there's a choice anyways.

I've tested my dual mods with internal charging and even after several months, the batteries are still married just fine.

Note that when the nay-sayers rant about it, I never get actual proof from any of them.

Single battery mods aren't an issue.

Said plainly, the charging circuits are the same type as cell phones, so since I don't hear many say that they take their phone battery out to charge it, I think it's all good

No battery expert here but again my understanding of li-ion batteries is that it does not harm them to charge them whenever you want. Unlike Ni-cads which have a memory li-ions don't and I don't think it reduces their life any more than dragging them lower before recharging. Don't over charge and don't drag them too low in power before recharging. I'm sure one of our battery experts will respond and be more precise in their answer to you.

Correct on all counts.

Lithium batteries don't like a few things:

• over charged
• overly discharged
  
• heat

They don't mind being partly charged once in a while, one should top them off on a regular basis if being used a lot.

They prefer

• staying cool
• being charged gently
• charged at around 70% for long term storage
• cooled off for a few minutes if coming off a charger right after being topped off

You can do a full cycle (drain down to empty then fully charged - lowest voltage should be around 3V, below that, you're risking damaging the battery) once in a while, if you believe that it may extent it's life, but I've yet to see convincing results that would convince me that this is worth doing..

 

[r77r7r]

Welcome. I've had good experience with Belkin or Anker chargers and thick braided cables off of Amazon.

I'd try for a non- Smart charger that you can select Phone from or a similar lower charge rate.

I've been charging these things almost since I've started here and mostly choose the .5amp rate, and use the 1-2amp for if I forgot to charge.

The battery-in mods I use, I charge them when I feel like it. I think that the lifespan has more to do with the quality of the battery the maker chose to install than how I treat them, overall.

I get good life out of them.

 

[Islandswamp]

Oh yeah, I've seen your articles on MTG Goldfish! I have to admit I don't really read them though, as Vintage isn't really my bag. I used to follow Standard, but I don't play enough anymore to keep up. These days, I'm strictly into budget Modern.

I did take a quick look at your "Vintage on a budget" article. Then I looked at the "paper" prices and could not click the "back" button fast enough

Yeah that's me. I actually wrote about modern for nearly a year I think over at puremtgo, but I eventually started playing legacy and vintage and found I enjoyed them more. There are people who play on cockatrice and xmage, or untap.in a lot too, and many 15 proxy events.

 

[r77r7r]

I wonder just how many of us came from other forums by ecig folks spreading the word?

I came from a MC forum when someone mentioned that his cigalikes sucked back in 09. Stuck in my head for 2 yrs that there were options to smoking available. Kinda happy I didn't try then.

I have to imagine that PC gamers could pound the smokes away.

 

[Islandswamp]

I wonder just how many of us came from other forums by ecig folks spreading the word?

I came from a MC forum when someone mentioned that his cigalikes sucked back in 09. Stuck in my head for 2 yrs that there were options to smoking available. Kinda happy I didn't try then.

I have to imagine that PC gamers could pound the smokes away.

Yeah it seems like there has been a fair amount of smoker/gamer type people in all forms of gaming. But I also find that a lot of gamers are "nerdy" (I use that as a term of endearment BTW) and they're more likely to find the technical aspects of ecigs interesting than many other groups.