Chasing flavor: Questions on PT2 rebuilds & 1st RDA purchase
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Well Country I'm glad you caught Metalhed's thread. For some of us, we gotta understand why we're doin' things. That thread and the m.c. thread really finally cooked with a lot of input and context. I'm trying to make it simple for newb's by documenting some standard resistance builds (menu) so they can quickly start seeing what tastes and vapes good for them. Then there's a universe of discovery. I ended up with 28 mods or so before I got there. I wish someone had paved the road ahead for me.
Let me suggest though to please try the simple hand wind off the wire spool. I've actually been demonstrating it to vendors in recent days. At one, we were both flabbergasted by how much additional vapor we got with torsion in varying degrees. But let me say, the hand of even a mature limited person like me can apply tremendous tension. And that energy is stored as metal memory. One of the totally unexpected consequences, that truly amazed me, is how much longer coils and wicks were lasting since I started those builds.
So I urge you to try it. It's a mind-blower as far as I'm concerned…and everyone I've demonstrated it to. If you go to the original microcoil better taste vapor threads you know the members who pioneered tensioning got it right. All I've done is postulate a simple method for doing it so we can move it along.
So chime in with resistance results if they're well validated and lower than you find on those threads.
Happy holidays Country.
Good luck!
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Hey Blue, thanks for the acknowledgement.
An outstanding little under-rated dripper is the Forge. Hard to find an authentic. But the clone is excellent, cheap and a great introduction to dripping. Its enormous advantage is the multitude of air-hole adjustments, comparable to some of the most expensive airflow adjustable designs. This will give you the opportunity to find your preferred optimal of airflow, power and resistance.
The clone with brass 510 and posts here
Chinex V6 RDA
It's capable of producing awesome vapor and flavor at about 1.1-1.2Ω, 28 AWG, 10/9, on ~2 mm (5/64"). This and a brass magneto or sentinel (original or clone) is a tremendous production combination coupled with an AW 18490 (keep it fused).
Happy Holidays! And keep those turns tight.
Good luck.
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Hey Blue, thanks for the acknowledgement.
An outstanding little under-rated dripper is the Forge. Hard to find an authentic. But the clone is excellent, cheap and a great introduction to dripping. Its enormous advantage is the multitude of air-hole adjustments, comparable to some of the most expensive airflow adjustable designs. This will give you the opportunity to find your preferred optimal of airflow, power and resistance.
The clone with brass 510 and posts here
Chinex V6 RDA
It's capable of producing awesome vapor and flavor at about 1.1-1.2Ω, 28 AWG, 10/9, on ~2 mm (5/64"). This and a brass magneto or sentinel (original or clone) is a tremendous production combination coupled with an AW 18490 (keep it fused).
Happy Holidays! And keep those turns tight.
Good luck.
Enjoy your posts. Very excellent, knowledgeable and experienced. Please stick around. We can all learn from your information, and I, for one, appreciate it. Keep up the good work. All the best.
Thanks Wizard, we could all stand a little magic. Just tryin' to get the newb's like me past the crunch. Helps them, helps biz, helps all. We could all use the encouragement. It's appreciated. Not everyone gets it. Glad to see some do.
Best of luck to you.
Happy Holidays!
Man, I really, really wish that had been enough for me. Life would have been so much simpler with the collection of carto tanks I have. So, TC I'm down with that. I have three different tanks just devoted to Halo Tribeca, one of my ADV's, as for me, it works best in a tank. But that's not the OP's proposition here, it's rebuilding. And soon Tribeca will probably migrate to high end RBA's, probably a Kayfun or Ody so I can max out that experience. With time, sometimes, expectations grow as we migrate from the ritual of smoking to a passion in vaping. For some sooner than others. And the OP seems to be on the fast track.
Congratz on the 50 days.
You have a great Holiday!
Good luck.
I too have Tribeca in my first carto-tank. Been vaping it for almost a week straight now and it sees to have lost some of its luster, i'm became pretty numb to the flavor after about three days. I going to change up to a different flavor next plus I just got my second tank so I can alternate and add a little variety.Man, I really, really wish that had been enough for me. Life would have been so much simpler with the collection of carto tanks I have. So, TC I'm down with that. I have three different tanks just devoted to Halo Tribeca, one of my ADV's, as for me, it works best in a tank. But that's not the OP's proposition here, it's rebuilding. And soon Tribeca will probably migrate to high end RBA's, probably a Kayfun or Ody so I can max out that experience. With time, sometimes, expectations grow as we migrate from the ritual of smoking to a passion in vaping. For some sooner than others. And the OP seems to be on the fast track.
Congratz on the 50 days.
You have a great Holiday!
Good luck.
Just answered ya on the other thread. Yeah, I find tastes in Tribeca I can't detect on other atty's (and particularly with Boge carts). And I really don't know the answer to that, yet. But I will be trying other temperature zones as I explained. The atomizer does make a big difference in some juices. But then consider, how do you like your steak? I like mine medium rare off a very hot real wood charcoal grill, not off the pan. And I know how sear that honey just right. But it does depend on the steak doesn't it?
Happy holidays and good luck.
I am not an expert, only been at it for 6 months. But I have tried many different genny style toppers, the best so far in my large collection is the KFL+ Original. dragon coil with cotton.
For the RDA The Immortalizer and or the Patriot Both ran with micro coils and cotton.
The best flavor comes from my HH357 cisco. I use it for testing flavors. I dont clean it between, I just keep in mind that the true flavor of the juice I am testing will not be pure for the first 3-4 refills.
IMO , You want flavor use cotton.
Also IMO your protank will never produce the flavor that a K-fun will give , or any dripper will provide.
For the RDA The Immortalizer and or the Patriot Both ran with micro coils and cotton.
The best flavor comes from my HH357 cisco. I use it for testing flavors. I dont clean it between, I just keep in mind that the true flavor of the juice I am testing will not be pure for the first 3-4 refills.
IMO , You want flavor use cotton.
Also IMO your protank will never produce the flavor that a K-fun will give , or any dripper will provide.
Sounds like you're way past the crunch. Congratz. And I hope so, I just got my first Kay and it's in the cue for a build. I have tried a few of the cisco's at different res. values. I'm flavor sensitive so I got plenty of results from just about anything but not much vapor from a carto atomizer. It diminishes the experience for me but I keep a few around. I like to try bakery flavors with them. Right on with the cotton. Still exploring varieties. I have to give a nod to the wicking product I've been testing for months, Nextel ceramic XC-132 in tanks is impressive in durability, performance and flavor. And I'm really looking forward to putting it through it's paces in the Kayfun, Ody, etc. Thanks for the feedback on the K. Sure hope you're right. However, I would add that a good part of taste is texture and in vaping that does include draw. The KPT is distinctive in its draw and so its own particular kind of vapor production. It does something peculiar to flavor just like a carto does. Still, I'd hate to be stuck with the just the PT forever!
Happy Holidays! Good luck.
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Sounds like you're way past the crunch. Congratz. And I hope so, I just got my first Kay and it's in the cue for a build. I have tried a few of the cisco's at different res. values. I'm flavor sensitive so I got plenty of results from just about anything but not much vapor from a carto atomizer. It diminishes the experience for me but I keep a few around. I like to try bakery flavors with them. Right on with the cotton. Still exploring varieties. I have to give a nod to the wicking product I've been testing for months, Nextel ceramic XC-132 in tanks is impressive in durability, performance and flavor. And I'm really looking forward to putting it through it's paces in the Kayfun, Ody, etc. Thanks for the feedback on the K. Sure hope you're right. However, I would add that a good part of taste is texture and in vaping that does include draw. The KPT is distinctive in its draw and so its own particular kind of vapor production. It does something peculiar to flavor just like a carto does. Still, I'd hate to be stuck with the just the PT forever!
Happy Holidays! Good luck.
Is there a link to this wicking material
Nextel ceramic XC-132
I am all about trying something new to improve the quality of "MY" vape.
You are so right about how it is tailored to your needs and style.
Thanks Wizard, we could all stand a little magic. Just tryin' to get the newb's like me past the crunch. Helps them, helps biz, helps all. We could all use the encouragement. It's appreciated. Not everyone gets it. Glad to see some do.
Best of luck to you.
Happy Holidays!
Rebuilding is all about understanding the fundamentals of the science, the mechanics, the equipment, the materials and targeting a specific coil for testing purposes. You also mention repeatedly these same things, and quite elegantly I might add. All roads lead to Rome. Figuring out what you like, as you also mention, is both the challenge and the goal. Experimentation and experience will take us to Vaping Nirvana. Keep putting it out there. The Forum needs the assets you bring. Thanks again! Happy Holidays to you and the family! Power up and Vape On!
Hey Pepple, thanks for your interest. I've been studying and testing this material extensively for almost four months. It is a highly heat resistant thermal insulator sheathing for electrical wire the perfect wick. It does not disembowel itself with heat and vibration as does silica to produce its wicking magic. It does so by nature of its finely delicate but tightly woven linear density. It's flavor remarkably close to cotton but less colored. More so in use as it doesn't foul to the extent that cotton does. So in effect it's utility is superior. Its durability far more so than any other potential non-metallic wicking media we know (except for ceramic wicking stone). There are quite a number of threads discussing it or dedicated to it since the flurry of interest in alternatives to silica (the scare) earlier this year. I took interest in this evolution but folks gave up too quickly including vendors and contributors to this forum that I've spoken and corresponded with. I've concluded that the issues were not the material, it wicks with a flow through (or potential) unlike any other material we're using; rather, it's related to material preparation, the exploration of which is in its infancy for vaping, and the fact that our very own techniques of designing coils and building were in a state of flux and maturation. I seized this opportunity to join two threads, lend a hand with research and sharing some of my results with this community and some retailers across the country in the hopes of generating better results among vapers and greater satisfaction with their product choices. I think that's good for the community and good for business, which we need to support us with their reliable product offerings!
There are two, just two, suppliers left for this product because of the premature and unfounded abandonment of this alternative. I mention them and a broader explanation with my post on the http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/clearomizers/486794-protank-microcoil-discussion-29.html thread at
Post #284: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ank-microcoil-discussion-29.html#post11506140
At present only SnG Vapor carries both the XC 116 (~3mm) and the XC-132 (~1.6mm). Both are hollow core and can be internally threaded! And the 1.6mm literally flows through that core. I believe consequently this allows the coil to run cooler during vaporization which gives it a host of benefits as a wicking medium. I routinely insert a needle to promote this phenomena during tank fills. But that's another discussion.
RBA Supplies does not as yet carry the XC-132 wick but I've had encouraging and interested conversations with the owner and believe he has the foresight to invest in this community and the potential future of this wicking media for us. I would suggest inquiry and encouragement if you like the product.
Thanks again very much for your interest Pepple. I think I might join you shortly on the Kayfun newb thread. See if I can learn something and pitch in as I start building mine.
Happy Holidays! Good luck.
I recommend the RSST to start with..... Much less finicky than the Aga T2's.
A lot of great information here for sure. I still think I'd prefer an RTA though, dripping seems a bit of a hassle for vaping all of the time. And with cartos so cheap, I mean, I only drip to test flavors. Is the vapor production that much better on a dripper style?
Sorry to sound like such a newbie but....
I still haven't worked up to building anything yet anyway though. Gonna get some kanthal with my next order though and start trying some different wicks.
Sorry to sound like such a newbie but....
I still haven't worked up to building anything yet anyway though. Gonna get some kanthal with my next order though and start trying some different wicks.
And when you do, you are in for some wonderful surprises. Vaping is so ultimately superior and satisfying than anything you may have experienced smoking. With the right preparation.
Blue it's like this, as I wrote pistoffo, some stuff just works in carto tanks. I also own a batch of Immortalizers, most originals, and experience some pretty awesome wet and cool or warm flavor. Depends on the build, the battery, resistance setup…and much more. So many factors, so many choices. The result varies when you go VW or straight mech. Then I own originals of the Trident and Helios as well. They're like Ferraris and Lamborghini's vs. the Rolls or Bentley that is an Ithaka. There is so much to explore and enjoy. But the key, I found in the few short months I've been in, and very actively rebuilding, is temperature — for finding the optimal resistance and power zones for your preferred flavors.
Is dripping that much better [than carto's]…? The short answer: Astonishingly, yes!
And for many of the same reasons that we enjoy anything of value in its composition, engineering, construction, adaptability, versatility, etc.
I recently got a Black Titan as the backbone for two black Immortalizers. It's an electrical powerhouse with high-amp batt's, But the Immortalizer is a delicate creature capable of incredible nuance if textured with the right ribbon build. Yet the set-up is unforgiving. Difficult screws that loosen during use altering resistance, coil geometry and flavor. The airflow control with the rotating sleeve is incredible but the results made haphazard by the preceding along with the careful arrangement of wicking and coil you prepared. Still I strongly recommend it, as did another poster for its incredible uniqueness in draw and taste having more similarity to me of the experience of a fine cigar than anything. It's sterling.
On the other hand, like most, I started with clones and one was the Trident. Now I have an original M16, a beast of a switch, with same of a gold Trident. It is the Ariel, the Bugatti, easy to slip behind the wheel, deft to the touch and flawlessly powerful with the simple introduction of high-octane cotton.
At the end of the day we both have a marvelously wonderful world of flavor experience before us. But it requires that you start your exploration with good tight electrical principles to make your way through this incredible vapor landscape. That's why I recommend the Forge for it's abundance of variability…among a choice of many, granted.
I wish you a great Christmas and Holidays.
Best of luck.
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MacTechVpr - By "simple hand wind off the wire spool." do you mean twisting the wire?
Good question TC. No I'm applying normal hand tension (perpendicular to the shank) to force the pressure into the wire. In that context when I say tension and torsion, I refer to the same thing, outward tension only. No longitudinal stress applied. In fact, the collateral benefit to this tension is that the wire follows a more natural path and the tendency to overlap is eliminated, if kept constant. Also as I demonstrated in at least one photograph, once the tension is released, as with torsion winds done on jigs, the coil perfectly retains its shape. No springiness despite the lack of torching which is unnecessary as the TEMCO wire I use is already annealed. There is more than enough force or pressure in the human hand to induce shape memory into a coil. And it saves a lot of time and fiddly. If you want to build rigidity into a coil you can still torch; and, right on the screwdriver bit. But why not start with the exact shape you want?
An important benefit is that the outward (last) turn, away from the grip or taped end, of the wire is absolutely straight, unhandled and untouched (after de-winding). Ideal for introduction as the short positive leg on a dripper or any topper as the end turn is perfectly joined in as complete of a turn as possible. The whole coil remains intact if you install it on the atomizer while still directly on the bit. You want to see a first fire contact coil (microcoil), build one of these. It's a beautiful thing TC. And simple.
Happy Holidays! Good luck.
Thanks for that question.
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