First off thank you for your well thought out post. I am going to address a few things you said. This is of course my 2cents on the subject.
I think there are a ton of good points coming up on this thread and it's awesome to see everyone discussing these options in a mature manner. I understand both sides of the coin, so here is my 2cents. The community (I'm guessing, as im semi new to the classifieds) has shown it can't regulate itself and is incapable of objective, respectful conversation like what is being conducted in this thread.
I don't think the community has shown that it can regulate itself. For example if a product sell in the secondary market for $400 I might now think it's worth that much but if it keeps selling for that it is what the market says its worth.
This means one of two things:
1) there shouldn't be any price cap, but then there shouldn't be infractions when users comment on seller pricing. This is the "market" communicating their disdain for inflationary pricing or profiteering. If you are trying to make a buck, some people wont like it. In the normal free market people comment that an item isn't worth the price all the time, no one gets .... hurt (I'm not running out to buy a chevy volt, or Microsoft Surface are you?).
This I agree with you almost 100%.
2) there should be rules on both sides, a range considered profiteering and limitations on comments. This sets guidelines and I don't think that is asking too much from members (especially if we can't manage ourselves). In an ideal world we would regulate ourselves.
My major concerns in dealing on the forums ar the following:
1) New users that don't necessarily know what something costs. Some of this stuff is made by "a guy" on "a forum" and new users might not know how to even get it or the pricing. Some commercially available things aren't obvious as far as pricing or where to get it. The LAST thing I want to see happen is new people (trying to quit smoking or trying to find what works) that want to try things and get turned off by pricing, negative user banter etc. What makes it even worse is when a newbie buys something that retails for $100 on the forums for $150 and feels burned. I know the defense "he should have researched" and that is just sad.
What is sad is that more people don't know to do the research first. It is so easy to do it now a days. I don't buy anything with out doing research first. Yes it sucks to get burned but what we should is always help people when they ask a question. I won't tell you how many times I have seen some ask a question and not get a useful response. It would help if we could post that the price is to high when we see it. Then no one could complain about paying to much when everyone was saying its overpriced.
2) People should be able to sell things above cost if they are "collector" items. Look, I have bought things WELL over retail, because that was the only way I was getting one and I wanted it.. I knew what I was getting into. But this shouldn't include hey, I bought 3 ZAPs and im going to sell them for $50 profit on each.. Not all of this can be considered "collector item" material. I think the current new rule does a great job of this, ZEN Titanium = Collector , ZAP = not.. for the most part, its easy... if its not ask someone, I've never had a MOD question left unanswered.
The collectable aspect of any good is not dictated my how rare it is but by how much of a demand is on a rare good. For example and just example I'm not saying anything about the items if there are four Zen Titanium's made and 10,000 ZAPs but only 5 people want the titanium's but 30,000 want the Zap the collectability for the ZAP is higher then the Titanium. The market decides.
3) Users selling and trying to recoup as new costs. I don't have a problem paying retail.. I DO have a problem paying retail + their shipping costs + their tax + their PayPal fees + my shipping costs. This is used stuff, though (mostly) maintained well. There is a cost of doing business and companies figure this into their retail cost, If you want to do the same that makes you a retailer. If you bought something and you dont like it Return it.. if you can't return it then by all means sell it but dont expect to get an as new price... I mean your MOUTH was on it, rubbing on your clothes and god only knows what.. that's used.. If you don't agree I have an iPhone 1 for sale right now as a collectors item, it has character.. only $399
I guess my problem is I don't know what the problem of making a profit is. If I'm not artificially inflating. Example Telling the GG has gone under to increase the want of a Ody. What's wrong with what I'm doing. You might not like it but its not wrong. If I post something for $400 that I got for $100 you dont have to buy it.
4) when non collector items are sold at a high cost, they have a tendency to continue that way. "I bought this on the forums, I want to recoup what I paid" I get upset every time I see this because I know someone got ripped off and someone else is about to. I dont know if there is a solution to this, but I feel over time this will subside.
I have to disagree with this when a low end product is sold at a high price we feel bad for that person but we don't buy the item from them. I mean we don't see a flood of $100 ego batteries because the crappy mall kiosks are selling them at that.
I think we have a really amazing community here, I think we can all rise above this. I think we need to stop crying wolf on people that are being reasonable, just because we want it cheaper. Supply and demand will dictate... this is the old debate of; do we want more "government" or less of it. If we are going to regulate it heavily then it will become a burdon to the mods and less fun for everyone.
If you want to "make a point" don't post nasty comments, sell your stuff at cost or below and choose to sell to someone you know will do the same. Though I dont think its out of hand or offensive openly offering to buy an item for retail price in the thread, again that is a polite civil way of the "market" dictating costs. I acutally ask this in all my sales, "if you dont think im being fair let me know, ill fix it"
Agreed this is what I do.
We all have to remember, this is a Privilege, a platform that is a service to us, that takes a lot of work to keep running smoothly. If we dont like whatever is determined as the set of rules by the MODS, we can all go figure out how to do it on our own. I for one will read the rules every time before I post, ask questions of a MOD if im unsure, and I will do what I feel is right for the person buying what im selling.
The other thing we can do I have civil discussion about the issue. Like we are doing here.
Sorry for the book
- DIg
Once again I think what we should is let the market dictate the value of the products. And let the market a.k.a all of us ( just incase someone didn't get that who I'm talking about) voice in a civil fasion when we disagree with the price of something. That way the info will be there and the person can choose for themselves if the item is worth it.
