In similar vein to my previous post of nagging Australian Health Groups and Authorities
Using the online enquiry form for the Heart Foundation i asked for contact details for somebody involved in tobacco Harm Reduction and received the following correspondence. I have edited out the name of the correspondent.
Hi
I believe you were after some information on tobacco Harm Reduction? I work in tobacco control, specifically in working with local government to make outdoor areas smoke-free (such as playground, swimming pools and alfresco dining areas).
How can I help you?
Hi
Thank you for your response
I guess I was probably more after someone on the harm reduction in tobacco users front rather than control in terms of making areas smoke free. Specifically areas of harm reduction or alternatives such as the use of Swedish Snus or Electronic Cigarettes as opposed to smoking tobacco.
Any help you can provide pointing me in the direction of someone involved in these aspects ? Would be much appreciated
Thanks
Hi (edited out)
The best people to speak to about this issue would be Quit Victoria. You can contact them on 9663 7777 or fill out a question online here: Contact Quit Victoria - Quit Victoria.
I hope that helps.
Hi (edited out)
I dont mean to be rude but to be honest, it doesn't help. Quit Victoria are pretty well useless for this area of enquiry. They operate and are supported by organisations such as the Heart Foundation and dont actually have a policy of their own.
I can try them again, however people have contacted them in the past and been rebuffed along the lines of stating mantras about approved therapeutic products. They are not even interested in talking to people.
I'm not interested in giving up smoking. I already have. What I am looking for is an avenue to discuss alternatives with organisations who's focus is community health. i.e The Heart Foundation or the Cancer Council. I do not represent a vendor or make any money off of alternative products. I am also not looking for an endorsement of any shape or form. I am simply curious about relevant bodies understanding of alternatives.
I dont know if you are aware, but in New Zealand for example, alternative products such as electronic cigarettes are sold in chemists and the health department has conducted studies into the efficacy and risks of the devices. In Australia very little seems to be understood. I thought your organisation may have a view point of its own, or at least be aware that these things existed.
If there isn't anyone else you can think of in your organisation who i may be able to talk with I thank You for taking the time to respond and continue to pursue other avenues of investigation with other organisations and authorities.
Thanks
Hi
Unfortunately Quit and the Heart Foundation do not have any fact sheets on e-cigarettes.
My understanding (once again we dont have a position) is that there is insufficient evidence to show they help people to quit and there are question marks over their safety (as they're largely unregulated and untested) so more testing and research is needed. My understanding is that it is illegal to sell, possess or use e-cigarettes with nicotine cartridges in Victoria.
You can read this fact sheet from Action on Smoking and Health in the UK http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_715.pdf.
Unfortunately we dont have the staff capacity to do more work in this area however I can let you know if anything changes.
Thanks,
and my response:
Hi
Maybe i can provide you a quick fact sheet
(well i will try to be quick). I dunno if you will have time to read it all but here is some information I have compiled. As a person involved with tobacco, you understand what it does to people. I think you might be surprised how much research has been done into these things.
Firstly to answer your statement that it is illegal to sell, posess or use, e-cigarettes in victoria, this is untrue. There are several companies Australian owned and operated who sell electronic cigarettes and liquids for vapourising. What is currently illegal for retail is nicotine. Currently electronic cigarette users can import nicotine legally and posess using provisions in the TGA's personal importation scheme for unapproved medicines.
Secondly you made points about their efficacy and relative risks.
Efficacy
While the evidence of efficacy is still largely anecdotal. Take me as an example, 28 Years old, smoked scince the age of 13... Dont remember what life is like without smoking. Tried it all before, replaced cigarettes with an alternative over night. Yes I am still addicted to nicotine, but i have significantly reduced my risk of cancer. There are a suprising number of people out there like me.
Dr Michael Siegel from boston university conducted a study in whic "Even though electronic cigarettes arent designed to be used to quit smoking, the study found that 31 percent of respondents reported having quit smoking within 6 months of purchasing an electronic cigarette. This is about twice as effective as traditional nicotine replacement products like the patch or nicotine gum, which only have a 12-18% average 6-month abstinence rate. In addition, the study found that almost 67% of respondents reported having reduced the number of cigarettes they smoked after using electronic cigarettes.
Health Risk
I will take this opportunity to point you to a couple of resources and reports with regards to the risk.
If you have made it this far before binning the email please at least take the time to view this link from Health NZ, http://www.healthnz.co.nz/cancerrisk.htm
Perhaps the previous link may have raised an eyebrow and you have a spare 10 minutes.... An article authoured by Professors at Berkley University and the Boston University of Public Health may be interesting... I'll paraphrase a small part of the article which can be found on Page 3....The level of cancer causing TSNA's found in e-cigarettes are similar to those levels recorded in the nicotine patch and shows them to be much safer than tobacco cigarettes and comparable in toxicity to conventional nicotine replacement products.
http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/centers-...ticle.jphp.pdf
If you have a bit more time skim read this report from Dr Murray Laugesen detailing research and toxicology tests done in 2008. http://www.healthnz.co.nz/RuyanCartr...t30-Oct-08.pdf
I hope you made it this far, as your response to my enquiries while misinformed to the point of thinking the products are illegal unfortunately is not uncommon in Australia and its not your fault, information of these products doesnt seem to be readily available.... It is in fact the reason why i contacted your organisation in the first place... I thought public health initiatives and research were the types of things you did and you may be able to shed some light on things for me.
Thanks again for your time
Using the online enquiry form for the Heart Foundation i asked for contact details for somebody involved in tobacco Harm Reduction and received the following correspondence. I have edited out the name of the correspondent.
Hi
I believe you were after some information on tobacco Harm Reduction? I work in tobacco control, specifically in working with local government to make outdoor areas smoke-free (such as playground, swimming pools and alfresco dining areas).
How can I help you?
Hi
Thank you for your response
I guess I was probably more after someone on the harm reduction in tobacco users front rather than control in terms of making areas smoke free. Specifically areas of harm reduction or alternatives such as the use of Swedish Snus or Electronic Cigarettes as opposed to smoking tobacco.
Any help you can provide pointing me in the direction of someone involved in these aspects ? Would be much appreciated
Thanks
Hi (edited out)
The best people to speak to about this issue would be Quit Victoria. You can contact them on 9663 7777 or fill out a question online here: Contact Quit Victoria - Quit Victoria.
I hope that helps.
Hi (edited out)
I dont mean to be rude but to be honest, it doesn't help. Quit Victoria are pretty well useless for this area of enquiry. They operate and are supported by organisations such as the Heart Foundation and dont actually have a policy of their own.
I can try them again, however people have contacted them in the past and been rebuffed along the lines of stating mantras about approved therapeutic products. They are not even interested in talking to people.
I'm not interested in giving up smoking. I already have. What I am looking for is an avenue to discuss alternatives with organisations who's focus is community health. i.e The Heart Foundation or the Cancer Council. I do not represent a vendor or make any money off of alternative products. I am also not looking for an endorsement of any shape or form. I am simply curious about relevant bodies understanding of alternatives.
I dont know if you are aware, but in New Zealand for example, alternative products such as electronic cigarettes are sold in chemists and the health department has conducted studies into the efficacy and risks of the devices. In Australia very little seems to be understood. I thought your organisation may have a view point of its own, or at least be aware that these things existed.
If there isn't anyone else you can think of in your organisation who i may be able to talk with I thank You for taking the time to respond and continue to pursue other avenues of investigation with other organisations and authorities.
Thanks
Hi
Unfortunately Quit and the Heart Foundation do not have any fact sheets on e-cigarettes.
My understanding (once again we dont have a position) is that there is insufficient evidence to show they help people to quit and there are question marks over their safety (as they're largely unregulated and untested) so more testing and research is needed. My understanding is that it is illegal to sell, possess or use e-cigarettes with nicotine cartridges in Victoria.
You can read this fact sheet from Action on Smoking and Health in the UK http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_715.pdf.
Unfortunately we dont have the staff capacity to do more work in this area however I can let you know if anything changes.
Thanks,
and my response:
Hi
Maybe i can provide you a quick fact sheet
Firstly to answer your statement that it is illegal to sell, posess or use, e-cigarettes in victoria, this is untrue. There are several companies Australian owned and operated who sell electronic cigarettes and liquids for vapourising. What is currently illegal for retail is nicotine. Currently electronic cigarette users can import nicotine legally and posess using provisions in the TGA's personal importation scheme for unapproved medicines.
Secondly you made points about their efficacy and relative risks.
Efficacy
While the evidence of efficacy is still largely anecdotal. Take me as an example, 28 Years old, smoked scince the age of 13... Dont remember what life is like without smoking. Tried it all before, replaced cigarettes with an alternative over night. Yes I am still addicted to nicotine, but i have significantly reduced my risk of cancer. There are a suprising number of people out there like me.
Dr Michael Siegel from boston university conducted a study in whic "Even though electronic cigarettes arent designed to be used to quit smoking, the study found that 31 percent of respondents reported having quit smoking within 6 months of purchasing an electronic cigarette. This is about twice as effective as traditional nicotine replacement products like the patch or nicotine gum, which only have a 12-18% average 6-month abstinence rate. In addition, the study found that almost 67% of respondents reported having reduced the number of cigarettes they smoked after using electronic cigarettes.
Health Risk
I will take this opportunity to point you to a couple of resources and reports with regards to the risk.
If you have made it this far before binning the email please at least take the time to view this link from Health NZ, http://www.healthnz.co.nz/cancerrisk.htm
Perhaps the previous link may have raised an eyebrow and you have a spare 10 minutes.... An article authoured by Professors at Berkley University and the Boston University of Public Health may be interesting... I'll paraphrase a small part of the article which can be found on Page 3....The level of cancer causing TSNA's found in e-cigarettes are similar to those levels recorded in the nicotine patch and shows them to be much safer than tobacco cigarettes and comparable in toxicity to conventional nicotine replacement products.
http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/centers-...ticle.jphp.pdf
If you have a bit more time skim read this report from Dr Murray Laugesen detailing research and toxicology tests done in 2008. http://www.healthnz.co.nz/RuyanCartr...t30-Oct-08.pdf
I hope you made it this far, as your response to my enquiries while misinformed to the point of thinking the products are illegal unfortunately is not uncommon in Australia and its not your fault, information of these products doesnt seem to be readily available.... It is in fact the reason why i contacted your organisation in the first place... I thought public health initiatives and research were the types of things you did and you may be able to shed some light on things for me.
Thanks again for your time
