Disappointing Epiphany I Just Had (I Decided to do Some Math)...Nowhere Near an Analog

[daniel2828]

Please don't even reference the VCU and Mr. Thomas Eissenberg's findings. It is well documented that the Virginia Commonwealth University is funded and supported by Philip Morris. Of course they are going to make "findings" such as that they persuade people into thinking e-cigarettes are insufficient when compared to analogues. It's called a return on investment, and PM is about to lose it big time due to our lovely emerging technologies.

Don't discredit the Eissenberg study too quickly. Dr. Michael Siegel puts a positive spin on the study here, now that more details have been released:

The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary

The ill-informed reporter of the CNN story was short on facts and was responsible (right from the get-go, starting with the headline) for sensationalize the findings and suggesting that the study proved that e-cigarettes were useless.

 

[Fenix-T]

You might need to redo your math. The old style carts held .30ml, and the newer carts have been bumped up to about .50ml per cart. I'm assuming you have the newer style carts, they've been out a while.

.15ml is very, very tiny.

But that still only comes up to 1.2mg per session, I think. I'm horrible with math

 

[emsmom]

If you read thru this forum, you will find that many mention the fact that they vape a lot more than they ever smoked. I know I vape a lot more than I ever smoked and have always assumed that it was due to getting slower and less nicotine delivery. I have not as of yet tried Halo, though plan to, but did find with the standard liquids, anything less than 36mg when I first started out was just not strong enough. If you haven't read the New Zealand study, that is definitely worth your time. It discusses the fact that the vapor seems to be absorbed thru mucus membranes in the mouth and upper airways, rather than the lungs and a lot less of the nicotine is absorbed. Again, this makes sense why so many find themselves vaping more than they ever smoked. You really hit the nail on the head though, regardless of how much nicotine we are actually getting, you are off the analogs, so that says a whole lot right there! Congratulations and keep on vaping.

 

[Belletrist]

i did some similar math when i started vaping--i use 1 ml cartomizers, though, and am not that good at math. i simply ordered 18 & 24 mg cartos so that i could (roughly) equate 1 carto to 1 pack of cigs; having said that i find i like to have some 36mg on hand for early mornings and 8-11 mg cartos for chain vaping. but i don't limit my sessions to anything like 6 mins...

i'd say i take a single drag every few minutes, and have more intense vaping session as well as going a couple hours a day with no vaping. at any rate, i'm going to do a semi quantitative nicotine exposure test next week (you can see my results here when i have them), because I'm interested to know how effectively i'm absorbing nicotine from vaping.

 

[Lilibet]

i did some similar math when i started vaping--i use 1 ml cartomizers, though, and am not that good at math. i simply ordered 18 & 24 mg cartos so that i could (roughly) equate 1 carto to 1 pack of cigs; having said that i find i like to have some 36mg on hand for early mornings and 8-11 mg cartos for chain vaping. but i don't limit my sessions to anything like 6 mins...

i'd say i take a single drag every few minutes, and have more intense vaping session as well as going a couple hours a day with no vaping. at any rate, i'm going to do a semi quantitative nicotine exposure test next week (you can see my results here when i have them), because I'm interested to know how effectively i'm absorbing nicotine from vaping.

Belletrist, I'll be following your experiment with great interest.

 

[68stang]

I'm not sure how this thread was so badly misunderstood. I'm not saying no nicotine is absorbed. I don't need to take a test to prove to myself that nicotine is absorbed from an e-Cig.

I believe that nicotine is absorbed (I don't think it's 100%, but I do think it is being absorbed).

The purpose of this thread was to clearly outline how very little nicotine there is to begin with in my cartridges, and to shine some light on how little nicotine there might be in your carts.

My cartridges hold 0.15ml of juice.

At 12mg of nicotine per ml, that is 1.80mg of nicotine for the whole cartridge! (pre-vape!)

That cartridge lasts me 5 "vaping sessions". That means that I can only expect to inhale 0.36mg of nicotine into my lungs (regardless of absorption rate! only 0.36mg of nicotine is going into my lungs per session!!)

Now, an analog causes the body to absorb roughly 1.0 - 1.4 mg of nicotine (for ONE!)

My WHOLE CARTRIDGE only has 1.80mg of nicotine in it! I don't finish my whole cartridge all at once. It lasts me 5 "sessions"!

AH hehe YES I see what you are saying. I think it proves while Nicotine is addictive, for me it wasnt the most adictive part of the analog. BUt the nicotine in the ecig allowed me to quit analogs and I am in love with them now

 

[crazyfl3x]

You might need to redo your math. The old style carts held .30ml, and the newer carts have been bumped up to about .50ml per cart. I'm assuming you have the newer style carts, they've been out a while.

.15ml is very, very tiny.

But that still only comes up to 1.2mg per session, I think. I'm horrible with math

Well, I've got the measured dropper that came with my Halo bottle as a measuring tool. It is marked off every 0.25ml.

With absolutely no filler in the cartridge, it holds exactly 0.25ml of fluid as per the dropper provided with my fluid. I really hope that Halo hasn't gotten the markings incorrect by half (because you're saying I should be bumped up to .50ml per cartridge).

With filler, it holds 0.15 (could be 0.17 or 0.18, but my measuring tool isn't capable of measure such small amounts, so I'm rounding to 0.15).

As for my math:

1ml of fluid contains 12mg of nicotine

So, 1ml divided by 0.15 (as that is what fits in my cartridge) = 6.66 (this means there are 6.66 "cartridge refills" per ml of fluid)

Now, divide 6.66 "cartridge refills" into 12mg (because there are 12mg of nicotine in that 1ml of fluid that is providing the 6.66 cartridge refills) and you'll get 1.80mg of nicotine per 0.15ml of fluid.

You can check my math like this:

If there really are 6.66 "cartridge refills" of 0.15ml per 1ml of fluid, you should be able to multiply the two and get 1ml...when multiplied together, you get 0.999ml (which is one thousandth from 1.000ml)...so that part is correct.

Now, since we know that the number of times you can refill a cartridge with 1ml of fluid at 0.15ml per refill is correct, we can now check nicotine content for correctness.

You check that by simply multiplying the number of cartridge refills 1ml provides when refilling with .15ml. We know that number to be 6.66.

So, we multiply 6.66 by how many milligrams of nicotine we figured we were getting per .15ml of juice (1.80), and we should get 12mg (as that is how many mg of nicotine are in one ml of juice).

6.66 X 1.80 = 11.98mg

So, now we know that's all correct (with the exception of being off thousandths and/or hundredths of a place) we can check the accuracy of the rest of it.

So, 1.80mg of nicotine per .15ml of fluid. .15ml of fluid lasts me 5 sessions.

So, 1.80 divided by 5 = 0.36mg of nicotine per "session"

 

[hyperdeficit]

that 1. something mgs of nicotine you are getting is a little bit more nicotine than a regular cigarette. not too bad. one cart= one cig. why try to go overboard and poison yourself with nicotine.

 

[crazyfl3x]

that 1. something mgs of nicotine you are getting is a little bit more nicotine than a regular cigarette. not too bad. one cart= one cig. why try to go overboard and poison yourself with nicotine.

Even if I non-stop vaped that one cartridge until it were gone, it would take me about a half hour to finish it...and I don't non-stop vape. I use it for roughly 5 or 6 minutes at a time and then put it down...then go back awhile later.

One cart may equal one cig, sure, but I'm not vaping that entire cartridge all at once. I'm spreading the intake of the 1.80mg of nicotine contained in my cartridge over a very long period of time.

Imagine you lit and then butted a regular analog enough times to make it last you a half an hour...see what I'm saying?

 

[curiousJan]

deftdrummer1, Tom Eisenberg rocks. He is on our side, as far as a non-smoker can be. The study showed, what it showed. Dr. E is here, conversing, learning and will design more provocative studies. Tom Eisenberg stands out as one of the few who really wants to know the truth. He knows more today than he did yesterday and is willing to admit that.

+1

..........10char

 

[Fenix-T]

With filler, it holds 0.15 (could be 0.17 or 0.18, but my measuring tool isn't capable of measure such small amounts, so I'm rounding to 0.15).

0.15ml is about 3 drops. You need some bigger carts. But like I said, dude, the carts hold roughly .5ml, I don't care what you little halo dropper says.

 

[uzzaperez]

Interesting. I'd be interested to find out the blood nic levels of a heavy smoker vs an equally heavy vaper. 24mg seems to work just fine for regular use, but I couldn't get any satisfaction from a 12mg. I try to avoid regular use of 36mg so that it will actually have an impact those times that I want a bigger kick.