DNA40 vs SX350j
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For the record the atomizer your referencing is not the same one I referred to in my initial post or the one demonstrating the mode switching and resistance reading failures on the dna 40 review. In actuality the one your referring to he used and had no problems with it from what I seen.
In his demonstration he used a known Kanthal 1.4Ω RTA placed onto the Evolv equipped device and it would only read .69Ω and persisted in "temp mode". he removed this RTA and placed it onto a SXmini which read the atomizer correctly at the resistance of 1.48Ω and fired it correctly. He again removed the RTA and placed it upon the Evolv equipped device and again it read at .69Ω and was still in temp mode. After this he described another user he seen experience the same problem except instead of sticking in "Temp mode" it was sticking in "Wattage mode".
It's certainly possible there are "wonky" connectors about causing some of these problems. And since Evolv doesn't make a device it's anyone's guess at what type of connectors are about or how stable they are so there is no real standard build for a dna 40 while were discussing them in general. IMO that's enough reason to have a mode selection rather than automagically select what mode of operation the device should be in especially when the specs for resistance between temp and power modes crossover.
In this demonstration he not only showed the device failing to switch modes to power mode but also to read the resistance correctly. Again not the RDA your referencing. Perhaps if the DNA 40 allowed the user to select which mode "Power or Temp" they were running in it may have read the resistance correctly IDK, or it may have been wonky 510 or user error as you imply.
At about 41:18 he demonstrates this problem
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And therin lies the rub with Evolve. I believe that Evolve will fix any issues with the DNA40, without question. But I am not willing to buy a new mod for a bug fix. I sold my original rDNA to get a new one with the latest updates to firmware. I'm not even sure why I did this other than I like Evolve products. But I say no more Evolve. Either provide user upgradeable firmware to allow me to install newer firmware to solve the niggling little issues that crop up in the development cycle of a device (a development cycle that is ongoing even after the release of a device), or just be aware I will not be buying any more Evolve powered devices. I was sorely tempted to buy the new Hana DNA40 V4S because I really like the form factor and price... especially with the sale they just offered, but stopped and said no because then I would be stuck with a buggy device that could never be fixed through a simple upgrade... even though small know issues exist that I have no doubt will be fixed shortly (with my luck within a week of me buying the mod).
I don't care if a device has a few small bugs that need to be worked on if I have confidence that the resulting fixes and updates can be easily applied and improve my device. But I do take issue with having to buy an entirely new device just for a simple firmware update.
Even if they just follow Provape's lead and only offer updates at a nominal charge through a dealer network, I would be OK with that. While not as ideal as allowing me to download and upgrade myself I can see the reasoning behind providing protection for intellectual property in this manner. It would certainly give me confidence that I wouldn't be feeling buyers remorse in a week when a bug was squashed that exists in my device that I just purchased.
But, ignoring me as part of the installed user base of their flagship product and offering no reasonable upgrade path for simple fixes? Well, just no Evolve. I'm done with that game and will just wish you chose to support me better.
I guess you now understand what playing in F mode on my dna meant to me... Mod in my left hand, C/F converter app in my right hand and adjusting temperature with my nose lol
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
If you can find a vendor that can make a minimum quantity order they state they can deliver units in Celsius on their data sheet.
"For manufacturers outside the United States, the DNA 40 is available as a special order with Celsius units instead of Fahrenheit. Minimum quantities apply. Contact Evolv for details."
Hmm...interesting.
The datasheets for the OLED displays I spec for several product designs (battery chargers) mention several times that the display can be screwed up by electrical noise (electro-magnetic interference, EMI) and that the display might need to be reset and the display data sent again if that happens. Considering that there are some fairly high magnetic fields in these devices (from current flow) along with inductive voltage spikes every time the battery current flow is stopped, it's pretty easy to understand that the display might have some problems unless the board design and firmware worked hard to minimize them.
Add on the fact that these displays are quite static sensitive and that the switching power supply on the board can generate a LOT of EMI if not properly designed and tested, I can easily see problems occurring.
Interesting theory that would explain why the screen scrambling only tends to occur when using nickel at high power, when there's lots of current being switched through the biggest component on the board, which happens to be an inductor.
The datasheet needs to be updated..... all DNA40's have F and C.....have for a while now...added due to public demand...
You can manually turn off Temperature Protection already. Has been that way for a long time.
From the data sheet:
The maximum temperature is adjustable between 200° Fahrenheit and 600° Fahrenheit. To disable the temperature protection entirely, adjust the limit up to 600 degrees, then press the UP button one additional time. The temperature limit will read OFF. This will also disable the prompt when a new atomizer is attached.
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I have both. Vapor shark rdna and love it. no Issues with the screen yet. Have sx mini m class and Tatroe atlas. Love them also. I think I like the sx 350 chips more and I feel like a traitor..lol. I bought the shark because it's made in the good ole us. Iam NOT weighing in the temperature control factor thought, hardly ever use it. Just seems like the sx350 is harder hitting and the power is smoother at the same setting as my shark. Then of course there's more power available also, but I almost never vape over 35 watts. It's a close race with me though, both are awesome.
Interesting, if that's a device failure it is the first one I've seen so far. I don't believe this to be the same type of design problem as the DNA or the potential problem Mooch described since it only appears to be affecting specific segment of the matrix rather than the entire screen. Can you link the Facebook group so we can read up on this?
For comparison this is indicative of most of the display issues I've seen on the DNA devices, You see it affects each and every segment of the matrix not just a single segment.
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Thanks for the clarification. You didn't correct me a week or two ago when I mentioned this to you so I was unaware.
Ahhhh (Screaming in rage) I have seen my fair share of those 3 on my Shark, 1 on my Hana and 1 on my FlaskInteresting, if that's a device failure it is the first one I've seen so far. I don't believe this to be the same type of design problem as the DNA or the potential problem Mooch described since it only appears to be affecting specific segment of the matrix rather than the entire screen. Can you link the Facebook group so we can read up on this?
For comparison this is indicative of most of the display issues I've seen on the DNA devices, You see it affects each and every segment of the matrix not just a single segment.
Ahhhh (Screaming in rage) I have seen my fair share of those 3 on my Shark, 1 on my Hana and 1 on my Flask
Please excuse my ignorance, vaping noob here. Do those three devices all use DNA boards? If so, the same model board (DNA40)?
Yes they all use Evolv DNA 40 boards. Evolv doesn't actually produce a device they only manufacture the PCB and sell those to modders who in turn install them into their enclosures.
Thanks! I had seen the DNA series of boards on Evolv's website. Very confusing thoughto a newbie as to which device uses what board.
Amazing technology! It is very tough to create a board that can be bought without a case and successfully installed by folks with varying degrees of electronics knowledge. I'm amazed there aren't more problems with these boards (from any manufacturer)!
I like & enjoy both. I recently purchased a Hana V4 with the "newest" Evolv chip. It is doing exactly as Vlad1 described in a prior post... My observation is that the screen does a full refresh every time you press or let off the fire button. It also does a full refresh approximately every 3 seconds while firing. I notice this because of the slight flicker of the screen -- obviously doing a full refresh. I have had one of the typical scramble screens that I noticed but it went away immediately. So it appears Evolv has come up with a workaround/band aid for the large screen scrambling issues.
That being said, I am 99% happy with the Hana V4 & its Evolv chip. Love the performance and the form factor of the Hana. My replacement Vaporshark rDNA is going back next week for a chip replacement. If the new chip works like the one in the Hana I will be a happy camper. (The screen issues have never affected performance but the VS scrambles pretty much constantly which makes the feedback available on the screen unavailable most of the time.)
The screen is slightly crooked in my SX Mini M, it goes through batteries tooooo fast (compared to an Evolv device), and it overshoots temps. I still love it!
Being an early adopter of new tech requires a fair level of frustration tolerance. (Speaking as someone who is on the other side of these things in another type of tech industry.) I like how things are progressing with both though. Innovation, not perfection and all that.
That being said, I am 99% happy with the Hana V4 & its Evolv chip. Love the performance and the form factor of the Hana. My replacement Vaporshark rDNA is going back next week for a chip replacement. If the new chip works like the one in the Hana I will be a happy camper. (The screen issues have never affected performance but the VS scrambles pretty much constantly which makes the feedback available on the screen unavailable most of the time.)
The screen is slightly crooked in my SX Mini M, it goes through batteries tooooo fast (compared to an Evolv device), and it overshoots temps. I still love it!
Being an early adopter of new tech requires a fair level of frustration tolerance. (Speaking as someone who is on the other side of these things in another type of tech industry.) I like how things are progressing with both though. Innovation, not perfection and all that.
Interesting! Refreshing at the start/end of each fire button press would help negate the effects of any electrical interference (causing a screen glitch) caused by the starting or stopping of current flow. Refreshing during current flow is good practice too, just in case.
If the DNA 40 pulses current on/off in TP mode (still checking around about this....so much info to review!) then each time the pulse occurs there is a burst of electrical noise generated. If the board is pulsing nickel coils the average current/power might be similar to a steady current flowing into a Kanthal coil. But, the peak current for each individual pulse into a nickel coil could be much, much higher. This increases the electrical noise that is generated compared to using a Kanthal coil in non-TP mode. Add on that TP mode pulses the current (I think) often and you have an operating environment that is much more severe than when using Kanthal...which can easily lead to glitching in any nearby electronics.
Are these screen glitches only occurring in TP mode? Can nickel be used without TP? If so, any screen glitches using nickel when not using TP? The current levels might be higher but it wouldn't be pulsed by the DNA 40.
Add on that any temperature control/protection using nickel coils means that the first pulse into the coil could be huge because of its low cold resistance. I don't know if the DNA 40 starts off with low current level pulses (i.e., low voltage) and then ramps up as it gets an idea of the what the coils resistance is but, if not, even the shortest pulse at those higher current levels will generate more electrical interference. I'm guessing though that slowly ramping up the coil current, and therefore the temperature, would be frowned upon by vapers though. Seems like the DNA 40 would just hit the coil with a big first pulse (perhaps even just microseconds long) and then ramp the voltage level of each pulse after that. Or perhpas voltage and pulse duration.
A worst-case scenario would be that the DNA 40 doesn't adjust the voltage level at all, just the duty cycle and/or pulse width. That is, it only changes the number of times per second that the pulses are fired, or the pulse's width, in a temperature protection/control mode. Each pulse would still be at max voltage, generating max current, and would therefore create a lot more interference than when in other modes.
Need to find some find someone who has put a scope on the DNA40 when it's controlling temperature.
If it is electrical interference that's causing the problems then moving wires and adding filters (ferrites) to the wires to the DNA40 can, maybe, help. Lots and lots of variables here though. Better to redesign the board and mod the firmware.
A worst-case scenario would be that the DNA 40 doesn't adjust the voltage level at all, just the duty cycle and/or pulse width. That is, it only changes the number of times per second that the pulses are fired, or the pulse's width, in a temperature protection/control mode. Each pulse would still be at max voltage, generating max current, and would therefore create a lot more interference than when in other modes.
Need to find some find someone who has put a scope on the DNA40 when it's controlling temperature.
If it is electrical interference that's causing the problems then moving wires and adding filters (ferrites) to the wires to the DNA40 can, maybe, help. Lots and lots of variables here though. Better to redesign the board and mod the firmware.
If you "the consumer" is happy that's really the most important regardless of what your using. And as for the two problems you posted on the SXmini M, The slight skew of the screen has been reported by a few others as well. Varitube has reported it's a 5 minute fix to adjust the placement of the circuit board. So if you contact your vendor they should be able to resolve that for you pretty easily. As to the battery consumption Yihi has announced they are releasing a new update this month and it will include a "New Function: Power-Saving Mode" (to make the battery last longer) so perhaps that will help you in that area as well. I don't personally have a problem with battery use as I change out the battery each morning and don't look at it again until the next morning. Usually get between 18k-20k joules depending on battery. I'm not a heavy vaper about 5-7 ml juice a day so YMMV.
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