DNA40 vs SX350j

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Mad Scientist

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The M class I believe does follow a power curve against the resistance rise

With the wrong starting locked resistance if too low power delivery would be lower & end temp compared to setting

Too high a dry hit may be on its way with more power being sent to the coil & exceeding the TP setting

Something I have not checked is once the atomiser has been locked in does it fire a dead short or below its 0.05 limit

Need to get myself a dna40 to compare still

That's what I got, too low. No vapor and I was not happy -- Doh! I forgot to push those two stupid buttons again but now the coil is too hot for an accurate resistance reading and . . . Lol.
 

retird

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And now, back to (at least tangentially) the topic of this thread. I know I'm behind the curve with this question but here's what I noticed about the M-class behavior. I forgot (for the thousandth time) to press the two buttons on the M-class to set resistance when changing atomizers. The power it delivered throughout the vape was obviously based on the resistance of the prior atomizer from the last time I set resistance. So it would seem that, at least for the M-class, it does not use real time resistance data to calculate its delivered power. As a result, not only is the temp not accurate on the device, neither is delivered power. Atomizer resistance rises as the coil heats at each vape, so delivered power falls over the course of each vape.

For those "in the know," is this how the M-class works? Does the dna 40 use the real time resistance data in its power calculation?

Now we are getting to the meat of the difference between the SX and the DNA....
 

TKS

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And now, back to (at least tangentially) the topic of this thread. I know I'm behind the curve with this question but here's what I noticed about the M-class behavior. I forgot (for the thousandth time) to press the two buttons on the M-class to set resistance when changing atomizers. The power it delivered throughout the vape was obviously based on the resistance of the prior atomizer from the last time I set resistance. So it would seem that, at least for the M-class, it does not use real time resistance data to calculate its delivered power. As a result, not only is the temp not accurate on the device, neither is delivered power. Atomizer resistance rises as the coil heats at each vape, so delivered power falls over the course of each vape.

For those "in the know," is this how the M-class works? Does the DNA 40 use the real time resistance data in its power calculation?

Real time in the sense after it detects the true ohms it will base it off of that. Don't all temp control devices use real time resistance days when trying to limit the temp though? Or were you asking if it's constantly always reading out ohms whether your firing or not?
 

Yozhik

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The point remaining, making a temp controlled device that includes accurate thermocouple temp control is not a year out, it's over a year ago. Making a mass produced device that the masses will adopt and is not compatible with any existing stuff is, in my opinion, never.

It's known in the art even longer than that. As to backward compatibility, it's not hard. All you need is a decent 4port to 510 adapter that doesn't look like crap. The problem is industry standardization - i.e., will we see 5 different ways of doing a 4 port connector because no one wants to pay the other guy for his design. A market among early adopters will exist (after all, there are plenty of people who spend $300 on hybrid connector mods), but things will likely need to settle down before it goes true mass market. Even at that point, there could still be two competing approaches, because they may offer advantages and disadvantages in their designs that make both viable.
 

Mad Scientist

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It's known in the art even longer than that. As to backward compatibility, it's not hard. All you need is a decent 4port to 510 adapter that doesn't look like crap. The problem is industry standardization - i.e., will we see 5 different ways of doing a 4 port connector because no one wants to pay the other guy for his design. A market among early adopters will exist (after all, there are plenty of people who spend $300 on hybrid connector mods), but things will likely need to settle down before it goes true mass market. Even at that point, there could still be two competing approaches, because they may offer advantages and disadvantages in their designs that make both viable.

Exactly. But pioneers are needed on both ends -- manufacturers and users. I don't see it happening. I hope I'm proven wrong ;). Nobody wants to spend the money to develop the next Betamax (if you're old enough to know what that is lol).
 
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Mad Scientist

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Real time in the sense after it detects the true ohms it will base it off of that. Don't all temp control devices use real time resistance days when trying to limit the temp though? Or were you asking if it's constantly always reading out ohms whether your firing or not?

It's hard for me to tell exactly what it's actually doing because it's doing two things at once. Is it limiting temp or power or both because the initial set resistance is wrong? I guess I could watch the display in a mirror and try to figure it out but it's easier to ask here lol. Plus, several thread participants seem to know how the thing really works.
 

Yozhik

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I've noticed that people are talking about new innovative ideas for temp control and attys. What about ultrasonic vaping? Kinda like my Now Aromatherapy.

Ultrasonic e-cigs were actually the first approach to a modern commercial electronic cigarette. Hon Lik in China figured it out in 2003, but then found out that the droplets formed by ultrasonic were too large so he switched to resistance heating. Part of the problem with vapor is that we really don't know what exactly to be aiming for. A study that determines the best physical characteristics of vapor for user satisfaction could be a lot of use from an engineering perspective. Once you have that, you can figure out what mix of technologies can best get you an optimal result. Otherwise, it's still trial and error - which is nonetheless useful, but is much slower at innovation.
 
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dr g

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And now, back to (at least tangentially) the topic of this thread. I know I'm behind the curve with this question but here's what I noticed about the M-class behavior. I forgot (for the thousandth time) to press the two buttons on the M-class to set resistance when changing atomizers. The power it delivered throughout the vape was obviously based on the resistance of the prior atomizer from the last time I set resistance. So it would seem that, at least for the M-class, it does not use real time resistance data to calculate its delivered power. As a result, not only is the temp not accurate on the device, neither is delivered power. Atomizer resistance rises as the coil heats at each vape, so delivered power falls over the course of each vape.

For those "in the know," is this how the M-class works? Does the DNA 40 use the real time resistance data in its power calculation?

The resistance setting is the baseline for temperature calculations. So insomuch as the power is being controlled to reach and maintain a certain temperature, what the mod thinks the temperature is affects the vape. Power is calculated and controlled in real time, it has to be or temp control would not be possible.

And yes you have correctly noted that it is a significant issue to require the baseline to be set manually with each atomizer change.
 

JimScotty0

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The resistance setting is the baseline for temperature calculations. So insomuch as the power is being controlled to reach and maintain a certain temperature, what the mod thinks the temperature is affects the vape. Power is calculated and controlled in real time, it has to be or temp control would not be possible.

And yes you have correctly noted that it is a significant issue to require the baseline to be set manually with each atomizer change.
It is not a significant issue for me to set the baseline manually with each atty change. A very simple process and it works every time for me. That is the least of my worries with a TC mod. What I am concerned about is that the vape is consistent and that is exactly what I have experienced with the SXM. I don't have to worry that the chip made some flawed decision on what is the actual resistance. Once set it remains the same unless you are using a flaky setup that has resistance floating around all over the place and you need a chip to try and make up for it.
 
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dr g

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It is not a significant issue for me to set the baseline manually with each atty change. A very simple process and it works every time for me. That is the least of my worries with a TC mod. What I am concerned about is that the vape is consistent and that is exactly what I have experienced with the SXM. I don't have to worry that the chip made some flawed decision on what is the actual resistance. Once set it remains the same unless you are using a flaky setup that has resistance floating around all over the place and you need a chip to try and make up for it.

The previous poster pointed out the problems with projecting your personal routine on the population at large.

Do you also manually refine the setting?
 

JimScotty0

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The previous poster pointed out the problems with projecting your personal routine on the population at large.

Do you also manually refine the setting?
I have been using the same coil for about 10 days now changing wicks every 2-3 days and maybe 1x or 2x a day when I have let the device sit for an extended period I may set the resistance to see if there are any changes. I rarely see it go away from the .073 that it usually reads about 90% of the time. Sometimes if it is cooler or warmer than normal I might see it change to .072 or even more rare .074. Never anything more than that with my favorite coil so far using a twisted 26ga NI200 with a 30ga Kanthal A1, 3mm with 6/7 wraps on my Lemo 2 and my connections are very tight. I have had the same experience and resistance with 2 similar coils on the same Lemo 2 just prior to this current build. Now I would think with a prebuilt coil that has the wires pressed up against the pin with a rubber sleeve you might see more resistance variations but I don't see that with a build like the Lemo 2 and solid tight connections.

I vape a variety of ejuices using anything from 50/50 PG/VG to 100%VG so my temp settings do vary accordingly to give me the right warmth and flavor that I desire. My temp is usually between 385F to no more than 440F with my normal being around 400F. Today I checked the resistance in the morning and it was at .073. When I got home I re-wicked, juiced up and then after about 5 mins I checked the resistance again and it was at the same .073. I really don't see a need to recalibrate myself since I am mainly using the same atty and build. In either case, I always check after re-wicking or if I should change to another atty.

I did make about 10 of those same coils one after another with the same twisted wire so I would have a stash to use when needed. I use the same build on my Delta II and on my Kangertech Mini. The Lemo 2 seems to always give me right around the .073 but the Delta II around .079 and the Kanger Mini gives me around .059. Must be the atty's themselves having different resistances due to different metals, etc. causing a difference. Even the RBA's of the Kanger and the Delta are fairly consistent but not as rock solid that I get with the true RTA of the Lemo 2 which I tend to use the most.

I feel that as long as I calibrate the resistance with the atty attached and sitting on the SXM for at least 15 mins I will get repeatable performance and temp settings whether the device has been unused in my pocket for a while or quite cooler in the early morning sitting on my desk. As long as both the atty and mod are the same temp it all works the same for me. Now I haven't tried to do this outside in the winter or when in a very hot place such as in the open sun at the beach so I don't have experience with locking it with such extremes. But for my normal lifestyle in SoCal it works well for me.
 

dr g

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I feel that as long as I calibrate the resistance with the atty attached and sitting on the SXM for at least 15 mins I will get repeatable performance and temp settings whether the device has been unused in my pocket for a while or quite cooler in the early morning sitting on my desk. As long as both the atty and mod are the same temp it all works the same for me. Now I haven't tried to do this outside in the winter or when in a very hot place such as in the open sun at the beach so I don't have experience with locking it with such extremes. But for my normal lifestyle in SoCal it works well for me.

Not being able to vape for 15 minutes upon every atty replacement is quite a major negative.
 
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JimScotty0

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I don't vape while sleeping or at work, and do take breaks where the mod just sits there. This is a very small price to pay for the mod to have accurate knowledge of the resistance thus resulting in solid accurate performance.

Does the DNA40 accurately calibrate baseline no matter which atty is used at all temperatures and differences between them?

Sent from my SM-N915T using Tapatalk
 
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