Do You Believe In Aliens or UFOs?

[Surf Monkey]

It is pure speculation though that cannot be confirmed through different experimental methods and repeated by millions.

Saying that shows that you know nothing about statistical analysis or the science of probability.

 

[Bones]

How is a planet twice the size of earth, with a climate much more hostile than earth's remotely similar?

You are confusing the difference between "EXACTLY THE SAME" and "REMOTELY SIMILAR" -

"REMOTELY SIMILAR" By its very definition is VERY DIFFERENT -

 

[gashin]

I come from a biological science background - everything is based on hard evidence and the only "sciences" that take probability seriously are astronomy and social psuedoscience. No real scientist would claim anything based on probability - just as astronomers and astrophyscists are still hesitant to say that life does exist outside of earth. Just an example - most biological models established in the past 50 years have been changed or disproven because of hard research data - since many astronomers base their claims on theories and models with practically zero hard evidence, what does this tell you about the probability that what they are saying is inaccurate?

1) No one is saying that alien life is FACT. We're talking about likelihoods and beliefs here. You're trying to hold us to a standard that we never set. That's not an honest way to have a conversation.

2) Maybe you should read up about the science of probability because you're discounting an entire discipline out of hand for reasons I'd consider more than a little suspect.

 

[Surf Monkey]

I come from a biological science background - everything is based on hard evidence and the only "sciences" that take probability seriously are astronomy and social psuedoscience. No real scientist would claim anything based on probability - just as astronomers and astrophyscists are still hesitant to say that life does exist outside of earth.

Well, that's very self righteous of you. Congratulations.

The point remains. You're trying to hold us to an unreasonable standard. The topic of the thread is "Do You Believe In Aliens or UFOs?" not "Can You Provide Evidence That Aliens Exist?"

Getting it yet?

 

[Bones]

I come from a biological science background - everything is based on hard evidence and the only "sciences" that take probability seriously are astronomy and social psuedoscience. No real scientist would claim anything based on probability - just as astronomers and astrophyscists are still hesitant to say that life does exist outside of earth.

And - We are discussing ASTRONOMY - so you can't discount it -

 

[Surf Monkey]

You are confusing the difference between "EXACTLY THE SAME" and "REMOTELY SIMILAR" -

"REMOTELY SIMILAR" By its very definition is VERY DIFFERENT -

DingDingDing!

 

[gashin]

We can't discuss why people believe in UFOs/Aliens?

Well, that's very self righteous of you. Congratulations.

The point remains. You're trying to hold us to an unreasonable standard. The topic of the thread is "Do You Believe In Aliens or UFOs?" not "Can You Provide Evidence That Aliens Exist?"

Getting it yet?

 

[Bones]

We can't discuss why people believe in UFOs/Aliens?

Sure we can - But that would be based on the whole probability thing - You don't like that -

 

[gashin]

We can discount it because contemporary astronomers have provided nothing concrete. They haven't proven any of their models and this is the reason why astronomy is often considered to be a fringe science and is financially treated as such by the government and educational institutions. If people who believe in aliens are basing their beliefs on the belief that the astronomers who are providing these numbers of probability are actually credible, their beliefs are really faith rather than fact.

And - We are discussing ASTRONOMY - so you can't discount it -

 

[Surf Monkey]

We can't discuss why people believe in UFOs/Aliens?

WE can. I don't know if YOU can.

We were trying to have a conversation about it until you blew into the thread and started saying that all our opinions were invalid. It's one thing to disagree. It's quite another to use questionable debating tactics to basically shut down any speculation or statements of opinion by the opposition... IN A THREAD THAT'S ALL ABOUT SPECULATION.

 

[Surf Monkey]

We can discount it because contemporary astronomers have provided nothing concrete. They haven't proven any of their models and this is the reason why astronomy is often considered to be a fringe science and is financially treated as such by the government and educational institutions. If people who believe in aliens are basing their beliefs on the belief that the astronomers who are providing these numbers of probability are actually credible, their beliefs are really faith rather than fact.

Doooood.

Belief. Faith. Where's the difference? You're talking about two sides of the same coin.

It's like saying "this thing isn't transparent... it's see-through!"

 

[Bones]

We can discount it because contemporary astronomers have provided nothing concrete. They haven't proven any of their models and this is the reason why astronomy is often considered to be a fringe science and is financially treated as such by the government and educational institutions. If people who believe in aliens are basing their beliefs on the belief that the astronomers who are providing these numbers of probability are actually credible, their beliefs are really faith rather than fact.

That's odd - It sure seemed like you thought it was a hard science when Copernicus was doing it a few posts back - Do you even remember what you said? - I can still read it you know -

 

[gashin]

I said contemporary astronomers - Copernicus was less of an astronomer than a geologist/geographer. He didn't base his calculations on some unprovable fuzzy image but rather on easily repeatable experiments which were confirmed by other scientists and navigators.

That's odd - It sure seemed like you thought it was a hard science when Copernicus was doing it a few posts back - Do you even remember what you said? - I can still read it you know -

 

[gashin]

OK I give up - all I was trying to prove that many peoples' belief in UFOs/Aliens is based on an unproven science... if they knew more about the assumptions that astronomers make when they throw out their numbers do you think they would still believe?

Doooood.

Belief. Faith. Where's the difference? You're talking about two sides of the same coin.

It's like saying "this thing isn't transparent... it's see-through!"

 

[Bones]

OK I give up - all I was trying to prove that many peoples' belief in UFOs/Aliens is based on an unproven science... if they knew more about the assumptions that astronomers make when they throw out their numbers do you think they would still believe?

There are no assumptions made about how many stars can be counted when you LOOK UP!

 

[shivadance]

So long, and thanks for all the fish.

 

[shivadance]

There is a distinctive difference between belief and theory.

I do not believe in god.
I do believe in the theory of relativity.

Neither can be proved per se, however they are completely separate issues.

As to aliens/other life and the possibility thereof: who said that alien life has to be carbon based, visible in our light spectrum or even from our dimension?

How self-centered we humans are. We may never have the capacity to see, hear or understand alien life forms, assuming they exists. And considering what a short time we've been looking, and how pathetic our technology is (we can't even cure cancer yet) we don't stand a chance of detecting anything yet. Any other life forms are probably using this cool technology and our tech is so 'old school' they can't even pick up our signals.

 

[Bones]

What he said -

 

[Liscab]

I just wonder if we are real,you could say seeing is believe, but for me not seeing if not a reason to dinied my blindness on what other people have said to see

 

[Liscab]

There is a distinctive difference between belief and theory.

I do not believe in god.
I do believe in the theory of relativity.

Neither can be proved per se, however they are completely separate issues.

As to aliens/other life and the possibility thereof: who said that alien life has to be carbon based, visible in our light spectrum or even from our dimension?

How self-centered we humans are. We may never have the capacity to see, hear or understand alien life forms, assuming they exists. And considering what a short time we've been looking, and how pathetic our technology is (we can't even cure cancer yet) we don't stand a chance of detecting anything yet. Any other life forms are probably using this cool technology and our tech is so 'old school' they can't even pick up our signals.

But we could be the most advance living soul in the universe or the toys of a computer hacker where we are the files.