Does this seem right to you?

[DC2]

I hear you DC.

I know you do Zoid. I know you do.

The question has always been how to get our message across.
And so far, we haven't come up with a solution.

Money is one way.
We don't have it apparently.

Activism is the other way.
And that is the only thing that has gotten us to where we now stand.

But the question is, how firm is our footing?

 

[zoiDman]

The concept of "intended use" may come into play here.

Kinda like the way in California for Years you could Glass Tube that you put Water in AS LONG as it was sold to Smoke tobacco. And Not Anything else.

Only in Reverse.

Go to Amazon and Read Descriptions for VG. Most have No Intended Use. Or if they do, it might say its for Skin Care or Topical Use Only.

The FDA Can't Touch these Products when they are Marketed in this way. Now if you say that the Stuff in that Bottle is to Put in your "Smoke juice" to Make Massive Exhaled Clouds?

Well... Now that is a Different Story.

But that would be Stupid to Market a Product. But then Again. Nobody said that Some OEM's/Retailers are all that Bright when it comes to the Way they Market/Label their Products.

 

[DC2]

I believe the FDA is under the HHS which is a position appointed by the President.

Yes indeed.

 

[oplholik]

Maybe Ess. Depot needs to remove the ecig mention from their description.

 

[DC2]

I'd still like to know what ever happened to the ATF? Because they sure lost this turf war!

Hey, the war is not over yet!
It's just beginning.

 

[DC2]

Mashed cauliflower is amazing.

When we were doing the low-carb diet, my wife made a pretty good cauliflower version of mashed potatoes.
And the best thing was that you can load it up with all the butter you might need.

 

[DC2]

Heck I figure if that time ever comes I will go back to smoking and let my family sue the federal government when I die for forcing back on cigarettes...

Someone might need to bring such a lawsuit some day.
It might be the last resort.

 

[DC2]

Kinda like the way in California for Years you could Glass Tube that you put Water in AS LONG as it was sold to Smoke Tobacco. And Not Anything else.

Well, I know that where I live (Vista) they swept through the "alternative shops" and confiscated lots of stuff.
I think they eventually lost in court, but some businesses went out of business as a result.

If the politicians care enough to make a move, they will make it.
And the chips will fall wherever they happen to fall.

The public being on our side will help a lot more than it will hurt.

 

[zoiDman]

I know you do Zoid. I know you do.

The question has always been how to get our message across.
And so far, we haven't come up with a solution.

Money is one way.
We don't have it apparently.

Activism is the other way.
And that is the only thing that has gotten us to where we now stand.

But the question is, how firm is our footing?

I have Discussed this Topic Many Times with Many People. It always seems get back to the Same Answer. Find the Smallest Source that can Reach the Largest amount of People.

And that source is Simple. The Retailers.

How Many people go In and Out of a B&M every day?
One Registered Supplier here on the ECF posted that there Power was down. So they were having a Problem keeping up with the 300 Orders a Day. 300 People a Day.
And I know One Large e-Liquid Retailer that does 2,000 Order a Day!

But Very Few Retailers have played Any Role on Promoting Activism.

Grass Roots is Great. But ECF Members make up about 1% of the e-Cigarette Lawn.

Retailers need to Step Up.

 

[zoiDman]

...

The public being on our side will help a lot more than it will hurt.

Then some will have to Grit their Teeth and Except that the General Public isn't very Educated. And Susceptible to claims like Cartoon on e-Liquids Bottles are geared Towards Children.

But then were Right back at the Beginning of this Debate.

BTW - The Opposite of what you said is True Also.

The public NOT being on our side will Hurt a lot more than it will Help.

 

[DC2]

I have Discussed this Topic Many Times with Many People. It always seems get back to the Same Answer. Find the Smallest Source that can Reach the Largest amount of People.

And that source is Simple. The Retailers.

How Many people go In and Out of a B&M every day?
One Registered Supplier here on the ECF posted that there Power was down. So they were having a Problem keeping up with the 200 Orders a Day. 300 People a Day.
And I know One Large e-Liquid Retailer that does 2,000 Order a Day!

But Very Few Retailers have played Any Role on Promoting Activism.

Grass Roots is Great. But ECF Members make up about 1% of the e-Cigarette Lawn.

Retailers need to Step Up.

If I could like this post 1000 times I would probably like it at least 789 times.


I've been to ALL the retailers in my area.
And that's a lot.

And I brought them CASAA cards and encouraged them to get a display case from CASAA as well.

Some of them had no idea what was going on in the legal realm.
And some of them did, but didn't seem to care.

But a few of them were on top of it.
That's a lot too few though.

The entire exercise deflated me.
And I'm not sure I have recovered yet.

 

[skoony]

Ok Mike.

You got the First Part Right.

why do you think they are switching to the term
tobacco products. when the CDC released there
underage youth study of cigarette and e-cig use
they did not say cigarette use was at a record low
9.xx%,they said the use of tobacco products is
about the same and rising.tobacco products.
regards
mike

 

[zoiDman]

If I could like this post 1000 times I would probably like it at least 789 times.

...

Cool. I'm Batting .789

LOL

I remember when you Went around to those B&M's. And How Excited you were before you did. And I remember what you Posted after you got back.

I had Never seen you that Discourage.

 

[zoiDman]

why do you think they are switching to the term
tobacco products. when the CDC released there
underage youth study of cigarette and e-cig use
they did not say cigarette use was at a record low
9.xx%,they said the use of tobacco products is
about the same and rising.tobacco products.
regards
mike

To Included products that have an Ingredient that is Derived from Tobacco Plants. That is what the word "Deem" is for in "Deeming".

Hey... If you Believe that the FDA can Regulate products that Can't Legally be "Deemed" a Tobacco Product and then Enforce Regulations using the FSTCA, That cool.

I have some Patio Chairs to Re-Web.

I guess we'll just have to Disagree.

 

[caramel]

Then some will have to Grit their Teeth and Except that the General Public isn't very Educated. And Susceptible to claims like Cartoon on e-Liquids Bottles are geared Towards Children.
.

Say Zood, did you know that getting naked causes earthquakes?

Canadians among foreigners blamed for Malaysian earthquake - The Globe and Mail

At this point they're engaged in a dispute over the dress code instead of checking whether it can have anything to do with earthquakes. That was taken as a given. Pretty much like we're discussing cartoons without checking first their appeal per age group.

 

[bluecat]

That's because it is alcohol based.

I was under the impression VG (or at least the wally word brand) is 99.5% VG and .5% water.

Or do you mean the VG ingredient is alcohol based?

 

[DC2]

I was under the impression VG (or at least the wally word brand) is 99.5% VG and .5% water.

Or do you mean the VG ingredient is alcohol based?

As far as I know, VG is considered an alcohol.
Same as PG is.

If I'm wrong, which I don't think I am, please let me know.

 

[bluecat]

Someone might need to bring such a lawsuit some day.
It might be the last resort.

It is basically what is happening in America today.

 

[bluecat]

As far as I know, VG is considered an alcohol.
Same as PG is.

If I'm wrong, which I don't think I am, please let me know.

I don't know. So I would be learning something too. All I know is that it burns my severely chapped lips. I just put some on and no burning, well they aren't chapped either. but man I love that little sweet jolt it has.

 

[skoony]

To Included products that have an Ingredient that is Derived from Tobacco Plants. That is what the word "Deem" is for in "Deeming".

Hey... If you Believe that the FDA can Regulate products that Can't Legally be "Deemed" a Tobacco Product and then Enforce Regulations using the FSTCA, That cool.

I have some Patio Chairs to Re-Web.

I guess we'll just have to Disagree.

the term use to be a derivative of, pre-ecig.
its now derived from. as in copying,mimicking,
replacing,taking the place of in whole or part.
derivative of and,derived from do not mean the same
thing.
biodegradable plastic bags are a derived from the
plastic bag even though there is no plastic in them.
plastic is a derivative of oil.
e-cigarettes are derived from the tobacco product
the cigarette which is a derivative of tobacco.
regards
mike