FDA Dr. Gottlieb testimony at Senate confirmation hearing 4/5/17

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sofarsogood

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I've just started listening to this, haven't heard it all the way through. Gottlieb used his opening statement to refer to tobacco/harm reduction. I paused the recording to write this and continue listening. The comment about tobacco and harm reduction comes at 23 minutes. I'm not far enoough along to see if vaping comes up in questions but he gave the Senators an opening to ask him about that.

FDA Commissioner Nominee Scott Gottlieb Defends | Video | C-SPAN.org
 

sofarsogood

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I just listened to that part of the hearing. I imagine it's the only questioning we'll see on the issue. What's hopeful is Gottlieb kept his options open but was positive in general. He has been affilliated with the American Enterprise Institute for some time and they are solidly on our side.

The message i get from the testimony is Gottlieb agrees that ecigs do more goodd than harm and he will try to prevent vapoccalypse. I think he might ask,, where is the science to justify a ban? He strikes me as NOT an ideologue. In general doctors want to cure things and they'll wave the dead chicken if it works and does no harm. (where are the reports of doctors treating illnsses caused by using ecigs?) This is all hopeful, but I'm still perfecting the stockpile. It's so inexpensive (for me) it's foolhardy to back off.
 

sofarsogood

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Along with 1 minute 43 and about 14 second mark - 1:43.15 about tobacco and ecigs and
once again talked about at the 2 hour 23minute and 35 second mark .
And now I've listened to the second exchange and Mr. Gottlieb is a good politician himself. He has to be deferential towards the people who work in the agency even if he disagrees with some otherwise he's demoralizing the people who are supposed to work for him. He could ask, well guys, where is the science to back up a defacto ban of all these products? I think Gottlieb is more on our side than the people preceding him but...i just swung open the freezer door and checked the shelf, yup, all presentt and accoounted for.

I wouldn't be very effective in a debate about e liquid flavor names. One of the reasons, but not the most important reason, I diy is because I want hardly any flavoring at all and i want to be able to vary the nic in small steps. But I also believe the flavoring issue is a red herring. When kids want junk they don't mess around, they get the real thing. It's grownups who need the flavors. What attracts kids to vaping or smoking is the visual part, 'it's the clouds bro'.
 
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WorksForMe

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Along with 1 minute 43 and about 14 second mark - 1:43.15 about tobacco and ecigs and
once again talked about at the 2 hour 23minute and 35 second mark .

He was on the Board of Directors for an e-liquid company? I never heard of Cure e-liquid.
 

WorksForMe

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If Gottlieb was involved in the ecig business we would dearly like to know more about that.

Yeah, me too. I was really surprised to hear Senator Murray mention it at about the 2 hour, 24 min mark in the video you posted. Dr. Gottlieb didn't deny it.
 
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sofarsogood

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Yeah, me too. I was really surprised to hear Senator Murray mention it at about the 2 hour, 24 min mark in the video you posted. Dr. Gottlieb didn't deny it.
He's not going to deny something that's true. He's unusually well qualifed for the job, the proverbial perfect fit, which is not to say he's going to be perfect for vaping.

Back to kids, a thought experiment, if there was no viisible vapor from ecigs the hard core smokers determined to quit would probably vape anyway but if there was no visible vapor from ecigs or smoke from tobacco I predict no kids would ever have any interest in either one. Let them satisfy their curiosity about the clouds without the nicotine (or even with nicotine) and very few kids will develop a life long habit.
 

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Yes it was interesting conversation indeed.

Its my hope that these regulations do not go into full effect perhaps a very water downed version as i firmly believe something will be done just hoping it wont be harsh as talked about on this forum
or it will hurt so many people as we do know that many simply cannot afford to buy enough needed if worse comes to worse.
A black market if arisen would be expensive as well .

Regardless the Mrs and i are so fortunate to have the funds and have secured a lifetime supply of all things we need just in case as we are not spring chickens anymore and did not want leave our enjoyable vaping and nicotine needs in someone else's hands.
 

sofarsogood

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I believe it's Kure. J. Clowney, of USC and Texans fame, also invested in Kure. It's a chain around NC, and maybe further out.


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I looked at the website for Kure. They franchise their name and busiess model. I think they mix in house. If Gottlieb invested in or advised them may be he doesn't think FDA rules should be putting them out of business. He would also have too argue that the applicable laws don't require them to do that unless science solldly supports it. In my view, so far, the FDA rules are driven by politics, not science. Something I'm reminded of watching the hearing is no matter how much Gottlieb sympathizes with us vaping is a small part of his issues. We need to hope he finds some people inside the FDA who think the deeming rules are too harsh.
 
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Rossum

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Its my hope that these regulations do not go into full effect perhaps a very water downed version as i firmly believe something will be done just hoping it wont be harsh as talked about on this forum
They'll never "go into full effect" without active, wide-spread enforcement. Look at Canada, where e-liquid that contains nicotine is technically illegal, yet there are numerous vendors who sell it openly. [Removed]
 
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sofarsogood

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This is interesting. The tobacco free kids group wants Gottlieb to excuse himself from all ecig decisions because he invested in an ecig company. By that logic he couldn't decide about anything.
"Campaign for Tobacco-Free Kids on Wednesday called on Gottlieb to recuse himself from all decisions involving e-cigarettes, given his financial stake in Kure, a vape store franchiser. "
FDA nominee won't commit to banning flavored e-cigarettes, cigars
 
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Bill Godshall

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From Reason:

Top Story: FDA Nominee Scott Gottlieb's Senate Hearing

President Trump's nominee for head of the FDA, Scott Gottlieb, appeared before the Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor and Pensions on April 5. In his introductory statement,Gottlieb said, "Whether it is combustible tobacco or dangerously addictive opioid drugs - we have the opportunity to help consumers move to less risky alternatives."

Sen. Bill Cassidy asked about shifting consumers toward reduced risk tobacco products products and the less-than-open stance the FDA's Center for Tobacco Products has taken toward less harmful alternatives to cigarettes. Gottlieb said, "I think Congress had great foresight in envisioning the opportunity for reduced harm products to transition smokers off of combustible tobacco onto reduced harm products."

He added, "these are ultimately empirical questions that can be adjudicated in the proper regulatory context. An e-cigarette, for example, or vaping products, might be a good smoking cessation tool, an e-cigarette flavor like chocolate chip cookie dough might not be."

In response to questioning by Sen. Patty Murray on e-cigarette flavorings, youth use, and whether he would weaken the FDA's "deeming rule." Gottlieb said he wasn't going to tolerate a rise in adolescent smoking and said he was committed to proper implementation of the Tobacco Control Act. He added it was an empirical question about when a reduced harm product can be a useful tool for transitioning people off of combustible and when it might be a gateway to adolescent smoking.

Asked if he was in favor of banning flavorings or marketing that "target our kids," Gottlieb said, "Certainly marketing practices that target kids, as I understand, are already illegal under the scope of the law. I think the issues of the flavoring and all these other issues that deal with the specific qualities of the vaping product are those kinds of empirical questions that I think career staff should be adjudicating in the Center and I want to provide them the proper support to make these judgments and make sure that we're finding a way to fulfill Congress's intent here that there should be reduced harm products available to consumers to transition them off of combustible cigarettes."
 

sofarsogood

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From Reason:

Top Story: FDA Nominee Scott Gottlieb's Senate Hearing

President Trump's nominee for head of the FDA, Scott Gottlieb, appeared before the Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor and Pensions on April 5. In his introductory statement,Gottlieb said, "Whether it is combustible tobacco or dangerously addictive opioid drugs - we have the opportunity to help consumers move to less risky alternatives."

Sen. Bill Cassidy asked about shifting consumers toward reduced risk tobacco products products and the less-than-open stance the FDA's Center for Tobacco Products has taken toward less harmful alternatives to cigarettes. Gottlieb said, "I think Congress had great foresight in envisioning the opportunity for reduced harm products to transition smokers off of combustible tobacco onto reduced harm products."

He added, "these are ultimately empirical questions that can be adjudicated in the proper regulatory context. An e-cigarette, for example, or vaping products, might be a good smoking cessation tool, an e-cigarette flavor like chocolate chip cookie dough might not be."

In response to questioning by Sen. Patty Murray on e-cigarette flavorings, youth use, and whether he would weaken the FDA's "deeming rule." Gottlieb said he wasn't going to tolerate a rise in adolescent smoking and said he was committed to proper implementation of the Tobacco Control Act. He added it was an empirical question about when a reduced harm product can be a useful tool for transitioning people off of combustible and when it might be a gateway to adolescent smoking.

Asked if he was in favor of banning flavorings or marketing that "target our kids," Gottlieb said, "Certainly marketing practices that target kids, as I understand, are already illegal under the scope of the law. I think the issues of the flavoring and all these other issues that deal with the specific qualities of the vaping product are those kinds of empirical questions that I think career staff should be adjudicating in the Center and I want to provide them the proper support to make these judgments and make sure that we're finding a way to fulfill Congress's intent here that there should be reduced harm products available to consumers to transition them off of combustible cigarettes."
What I read from his answers is he knows vaping issues very well, he's thought about it at length and he's a very good politician. He "invested" in a ecig franchising business called Kure. (May be he got his share by advising them.) I don't think he would have done that if he believed the full scope of FDA impending actions were justified by the science.
 

Bill Godshall

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sofarsogood

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If Scott Gottlieb was/is affiliated with Kure, vapers couldn't ask for a better nominee to lead FDA.

Some info on Kure

Kure franchise
KŪRE Vaping Lounge Franchise - KURE

Kure company overview
Kure Corp.: Private Company Information - Bloomberg

Kure files to raise $5 million
Vaping company Kure files to raise $5 million
So far we know he invested and then disposed of his interest last year. But that's enough to know he must be well informed. What ever position he takes he should be able to defend on the merits. His reponses to vape related questions were artful and politic to a fault and nothing he said ruled out what we are hoping for. But just because you are the boss doesn't mean you always get your way. I'm not going to depend on anybody to protect my vape, including Mr. Gottlieb. In the mean time, so far so good.
 
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