Dual coil genesis...worth it or gimmick?

[Phone Guy]

Subject pretty much says it all. Curious if running dual coil SS mesh wicks at around 1.4 ohm total (2 @ 2.8 ohm) worth it on an evic battery?

Seems to me like a single coil setup delivers more vapor cloud, but I'm not 100% sure I've got it set up right or if my evic can't power it correctly?

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[MattyB1503]

Even with a DNA20 mod you'll still only be pushing 10 watts at each coil...

So no, I would recommend a mech for duals. Compared to a single coil: You may get a tiny bit more vapor, you may get a bit less but undoubtedly you will get a cooler vape with duals on an evic.

 

[Thrasher]

on top of what matty says its tricky as well. i have a couple genis I can do this too and the first thing you notice is the juice just vanishes lol
if you want to go duals get a cheap mech and shoot for 1 ohm or a little under and kapow its like a smoke bomb went off in your mouth.

 

[cghildreth]

Gimmick unless your pushing very low sub ohms. Here's why - When you're running dual coils, you are effectively splitting your amperage and wattage across two coils. One coil accepting the same total wattage and amperage will generally reach higher wire temperatures than two coils accepting together the same aggregate wattage and amperage. The single hotter coil will, assuming proper wicking, produce better vapor in both volume and flavor. When you get to very low sub-ohm setups, trying to run all of the amperage and wattage through one coil will often result in too much heat - you begin having problems getting your wicks to keep up, or problems in developing shorts and hotspots if using mesh wick because the heat burns through the oxidization layer. One possible solution to the wick issues with very low ohm rigs is to split your amperage and wattage across two slightly lower temperature coils.

Unless you're looking at the 0.6 ohm or lower range, I generally think its better to have one coil as opposed to two (or more).

 

[Phone Guy]

That makes sense. One part I'm not certain about is temperature. Is hotter better?

And since I'm running an evic and can not run sub ohm, looks like single coil is the magic number

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[LeoRex]

That makes sense. One part I'm not certain about is temperature. Is hotter better?

Depends on personal preference...

But yeah... coming from personal experience, I'd say dual coil is mech territory only.... I know there was some who will say that they use DC stuff on their regulated mods and like it... but I'd chance a guess that they like really 'cool' (low powered) vapes to begin with.

When I first got my dual coil Nimbus clone built, I tried to build something that would fire on my Vamo. I put together a 1.2 ohm DC using 32 gauge... The thing about the Vamo is that is actually IS capable of more than 15 watts... people just assume that 15 is the max since that is the max setting in variable wattage mode. But it actually can go much higher but you need to run stacked batteries to get there. I put on two fresh 350s, set it to 6.0v and checked the voltage across the posts and got 5.5v... That's 25 watts at 4.6 amps (just below the Vamo's 5 amp limit.

Now, while it could DO it, I would be somewhat concerned about the long term health of the internals of the Vamo... Something tells me that it might have some issues pushing that much current over extended amounts of time. Plus with all the quirks of having to deal with stacked batteries, adding into that draining them that hard would also give me pause.

So I just said to hell with it and threw it on my mech.... no worries on that one. Built a 0.6 ohm dual 28g micro and everyone's happy.

 

[cghildreth]

That makes sense. One part I'm not certain about is temperature. Is hotter better?

And since I'm running an evic and can not run sub ohm, looks like single coil is the magic number

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Vapor production is a product of two things - wire temperature and surface area. The more heat (within limits) that you apply over a broader surface area, the more vapor you're going to get. This all assumes that your wick is able to supply all the liquid that you coil can vaporize though. Too hot, and you run into wicking issues due to natural limitations on your wick's ability to get timely get juice to the coil for vaporization. The surface area/wire temperature is why so many people use 26 and 28g wire, or even ribbon wire - you get a lot more wire surface area to convert the liquid into vapor. You do however tend to run into some heat inefficiencies with the thicker wires, so as a result you've got to decrease the resistance to allow more amps and wattage to flow through the coil.

Flavor is largely dependent on how concentrated the vapor is. This in turn depends on vapor production and air flow. Obviously too much heat, and any juice will start tasting burnt or dried out. Also, too much air mixed in with the vaporized liquid and your flavor starts suffering.

What this all means is that there is a sweet spot. Juice delivery devices like cartos don't have the ability to vaporize much liquid. In order to be able to get adequate flavor, you've got to have a very tight draw and a very small vaporization chamber. With rebuildables which can vaporize a great deal more liquid, you can generally have a much looser draw and a larger vaporization chamber (which is also generally needed to be able to rebuild), because the vapor is so much more concentrated (assuming a proper setup) that you won't lose a ton of flavor by adding in a lot of air flow. More air flow means more impressive clouds. Clouds are worthless in my opinion though if the flavor is not spot on.

This has probably been way to detailed of an answer to your question. In short, your wire temperature matters, but hotter is not always better. You're looking for the sweet spot with your given wire and wick. You're looking for maximum concentration of vapor (not necessarily maximum size of clouds, though often there can be a correlation between the two), which depends in large part on how much liquid your particular coil can vaporize without overrunning the wicking setup that you've got. This all assumes though that your ultimate goal like mine is flavor as opposed to being able to "impress" chicks or your buddies with your massive clouds of vapor.

 

[Phone Guy]

No, I appreciate you taking the time to reply in detail. I actually wanted something like that

I kind of thought hotter was not better...but wasn't sure. I'm a cigar smoker.... not a cigarette smoker. Add to that, I'm not trying to quit cigars, I vape for flavor and because I can no longer smoke cigars in my house because I now have a grand daughter who lives with us. The rest of my family smokes cigarettes and are vaping to avoid analogs...

I think the cigar only smoker is a rare thing... the "craving" for cigars is nothing like craving a cigarette...my wife as an example will kill somebody when she's having a nicotine fit...which can be every 5 minutes or every hour...myself on the other hand, I can go weeks without touching a cigar (and have, still do -more now then before). So in my opinion, I'm not "addicted" in the nicotine sense...I'm addicted to the flavor of cigars, the experience, etc.

So bottom line I vape for flavor, and because I enjoy doing it. Not to get the nicotine fix. Plus I'm a tech kind of guy, and I love the gadgets it's become my new money pit - I mean hobby

Anyway, another reason I say all this is because my taste buds are not as spot on as most. My family tends to get burning taste when I can't.



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[Thrasher]

if ya want something to give you a whopping tasty cloud like a stogie then a cheap mech with a dual wick geni would be worth a shot to play with, i do have a dual hybrid and i can keep up with the dual coil dripper guys any day lol, when done right the vapor isnt real hot and the density of the vapor is overwhelming.

but in a general sense its not really practical on a VV mod or very efficient for juice.

 

[MattyB1503]

Man I use to love me a nice single malt Scotch and a Gran Corona, La Gloria Artesanos (Miami). I am now smoke free though but to each their own.

I second Thrashers post.

If you're good with your hands, understand Ohms Law and battery ratings; or willing to learn, a dual coil Genesis on a mech is probably my favorite set up.

Some of the lengthy posts may have forgotten to mention, if you run touching coils or 'micros' concentrated over the airholes, you'll be in Flavor Country...

 

[Jjshbetz11]

Tuneup means runsike ..... Chainsaws engines are just like my rc engines. After a while they need a new piston and sleeve witch is the tuneup. So add at least another hundred to that price. I don't understand why you won't believe me when I say I know what I'm talking about. Plus you have to be able to pull the pull start to see how much comp. is left on the piston/sleeeve and that's a far drive to pull a string, not to mention two stroke oil , gas, new gas can, new plug, new bar, new chain.

 

[Jjshbetz11]

Wools totally messed up there

 

[Thrasher]

lol - you in the right thread bro?

 

[Jjshbetz11]

Thought I was texting friend about a chainsaw mods please delete one of those days

 

[Thrasher]

LOL i had to reread the whole thread too........... thought maybe i missed something somewhere lmao

 

[Jjshbetz11]

Lol and it's only Monday

 

[minimalsaint]

I believe you know what you're talking about.

 

[Phone Guy]

LOL...yes, we believe you. In fact I always believe the guy with the chainsaw!

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[proraptor]

I like my steam turbine clone but will say it's a pain in the ... to build. A lot less room in there than a rsst