Ecigs to be treated as tobacco not a delivery device

[alphavap]

sorry if this has already been posted but I felt it was "big" news


FDA to regulate e-cigs as tobacco products - The Denver Post

 

[hairball]

That's great news!! The FDA finally admits they can't win.

 

[cookiebun]

Join the discussion here:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/legislation-news/182522-fda-regulate-e-cig-tobacco.html

 

[Dicot]

Although this seems good on the surface, I'm worried what this mean in terms of future taxation on ejuice and ecigs. Part of the tax paid on packs of cigs is due to a federal tobacco tax, as well as state tobacco taxes and even county taxes in most areas. So will this re-classification as tobacco give the government precedence to tax us all to hell like traditional cigs? With the e-cig market growing by the month, largely consisting of users switching away from traditional cigs, it's only a matter of time in my opinion.

 

[RufusExcellent]

It'll be okay--kind of like prohibition with folks mixing their own liquid in the bath tub and selling it clandestinely in underground vaping clubs. I look forward to it.

I imagine just the liquid can be taxed as it contains the nicotine. Could they also tax the hardware, I wonder?

 

[DC2]

Although this seems good on the surface, I'm worried what this mean in terms of future taxation on ejuice and ecigs. Part of the tax paid on packs of cigs is due to a federal tobacco tax, as well as state tobacco taxes and even county taxes in most areas. So will this re-classification as tobacco give the government precedence to tax us all to hell like traditional cigs? With the e-cig market growing by the month, largely consisting of users switching away from traditional cigs, it's only a matter of time in my opinion.

Tobacco products are basically supposed to be taxed in relation to the harm they are believed to cause.
And because of that, electronic cigarettes should be taxed at rates comparable to snuff and snus.

I assume these are the current Federal Excise Taxes...
TTBGov Tax and Fee Rates

TTB Tax and Fee Rate...

Tobacco Products          1000 units      Pack of 20
Small Cigarettes            $50.33          $1.01
Large Cigarettes           $105.69          $2.11
Small Cigars                $50.33          $1.01
 
Tobacco Products              1 lb.       Tin or Pouch
Pipe Tobacco                 $2.8311        $0.1769
Chewing Tobacco              $0.5033        $0.0315
Snuff                        $1.51          $0.0944
Roll-your-own Tobacco       $24.78          $1.5488

That doesn't mean they won't do something outrageous and without justification.
But it will be up to all of us to fight to make sure everyone is, at the very least, properly educated.

 

[CountVapula]

would we still be able to buy our juice and hardware over the internet thought? i dont think you can buy cigarettes over the internet.

 

[AttyPops]

All I know is:
1) I admit that I don't really know anything when it comes to all these regulations/taxes etc.
2) It makes my head hurt just thinking about it.
3) They shouldn't be taxed, or they should be taxed at a rate even lower than snus and snuff. Zero is best. They haven't proven any harm yet. Unless you tax nicotine. Then you tax gum, lozenges, patches, inhalers, potatoes, tomatoes.....

 

[DC2]

would we still be able to buy our juice and hardware over the internet thought? i dont think you can buy cigarettes over the internet.

The PACT act specifically states which products it applies to, and electronic cigarettes are not included.

That does not mean they can't ammend the PACT act, but we will see that coming.
And if it does, we will have to fight.

 

[Richie G]

Many a vaper has reduced his/her nicotine level to zero. For many of us, that is our goal. How then, can a non-nicotine e-liquid be considered a tobacco product of any kind when the ingredients are PG/VG and flavoring?

I've stated this many times before but I don't think it behooves us for the PV to be considered a drug delivery device OR tobacco related. Our devices and liquid should be in an all new category because the product is distinct from anything that has ever been on the market.

We should be riding the coattails of those folks who have weaned themselves off nicotine. If I was off nicotine I would be TEED OFF from this latest development.

 

[MDuncan]

i guess order up on juice b4 its taxed.
Shelf life is like 2 years isnt it?

 

[BILLB OKC]

Although this seems good on the surface, I'm worried what this mean in terms of future taxation on ejuice and ecigs. Part of the tax paid on packs of cigs is due to a federal tobacco tax, as well as state tobacco taxes and even county taxes in most areas. So will this re-classification as tobacco give the government precedence to tax us all to hell like traditional cigs? With the e-cig market growing by the month, largely consisting of users switching away from traditional cigs, it's only a matter of time in my opinion.

Of course it will. they will tax it to death.

 

[Brandigayle]

I think this is good news

 

[ccclady]

(Re-posting here, as I meant for it to appear here instead of whereever it is that it ended up...)

I don't understand all the legal and technical language in these reports, but the one thing that stands out to me is that "the FDA is now classifying e-cigarettes as tobacco products". If this is the case,why is it being seen as a victory for us and a step-forward?? The two main things I've come to understand since switching from regular cigarettes to vaping are...(1) it's NOT tobacco with it's associated 4,000+ chemicals in analog form; and (2) if it's now going to be considered as a tobacco product, wouldn't that make it subject to the same bans as well as exorbitant tobacco taxes that we've seen nationwide?? Can someone please explain it to me so that I can understand how this is a "good" thing?

 

[BILLB OKC]

(Re-posting here, as I meant for it to appear here instead of whereever it is that it ended up...)

I don't understand all the legal and technical language in these reports, but the one thing that stands out to me is that "the FDA is now classifying e-cigarettes as tobacco products". If this is the case,why is it being seen as a victory for us and a step-forward?? The two main things I've come to understand since switching from regular cigarettes to vaping are...(1) it's NOT tobacco with it's associated 4,000+ chemicals in analog form; and (2) if it's now going to be considered as a tobacco product, wouldn't that make it subject to the same bans as well as exorbitant tobacco taxes that we've seen nationwide?? Can someone please explain it to me so that I can understand how this is a "good" thing?

More government intrusion.
This will cause high taxes on eliquid and ecig products.
This will cause a bunch of funk fda regulations.
anytime the government gets involved to protect us from ourselves, you can bet it is going to cost us money.

I don't see ANY win for us, only UNCLE SUGAR and his gang of thieves..

 

[cookiebun]

(Re-posting here, as I meant for it to appear here instead of whereever it is that it ended up...)

I don't understand all the legal and technical language in these reports, but the one thing that stands out to me is that "the FDA is now classifying e-cigarettes as tobacco products". If this is the case,why is it being seen as a victory for us and a step-forward?? The two main things I've come to understand since switching from regular cigarettes to vaping are...(1) it's NOT tobacco with it's associated 4,000+ chemicals in analog form; and (2) if it's now going to be considered as a tobacco product, wouldn't that make it subject to the same bans as well as exorbitant tobacco taxes that we've seen nationwide?? Can someone please explain it to me so that I can understand how this is a "good" thing?

Seriously, the people who can answer these questions for you don't hang out in this part of the forum.
Legislation News
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/legislation-news/182522-fda-regulate-e-cig-tobacco.html

If you're worried about flavors being banned, taxes etc go to that part of the forum, read the threads and ask questions. You'll get some good answers.

 

[melloyello]

the prices must obviously go up eventually, due to them being regulated as analogs. they dont have a timeline as to when it will go into effect, might be months, might be years. im not smart enough to understand what all this means, will be interesting to follow the discussions from people in the know. i just cant believe that i cant puff my pv in my car with windows closed in hennepin county, MN.

 

[DrChong]

i'm only new to vapeing and my biggest worry was they'd ban it just as i'd started but it seems they aint going to (im from uk but as u well know whatever you guys do our government seems to follow suit)
But the tax thing i believe will be a real problem, the money they make on taxing tobacco products is ridiculous and if you tie in to the fact the amount of people who try an ecig and then suddenly they're sold, it wont be long until a HELL of alot of people are starting doing it so governments everywhere are going to try and tax the .... to high heaven.
the 0 nicotine users will be fine cause they can just homebrew it cheap as .... with stuff from the supermarket but nicotine users will be on the receiving end of it.
The only real way i reck will be getting e liquid black market, cause it'll cost a fortune,
think how much you can get out of a largish bottle of e liquid compared to cigs, they'll want to put like 30% tax on it

 

[ShannonA]

More government intrusion.
This will cause high taxes on eliquid and ecig products.
This will cause a bunch of funk fda regulations.
anytime the government gets involved to protect us from ourselves, you can bet it is going to cost us money.

I don't see ANY win for us, only UNCLE SUGAR and his gang of thieves..

Technically they can ban flavoring but they really don't have a way to keep up from flavoring our own... a bit easier to flavor e-liquid than tobacco.

 

[BILLB OKC]

Technically they can ban flavoring but they really don't have a way to keep up from flavoring our own... a bit easier to flavor e-liquid than tobacco.

it's the nicotine they will over tax and control