Erythritol Vs Sucralose

[Molchi]

Till now they are still in the EU, and to be honest i'm not sure if i will still be alive when they leave and i'm "only" 41

Yea, Stevia seems to be way more popular, problem is that a lot of people keep telling it has an offtaste almost a bit like Licorice

 

[hell_storm2004]

I think you are referring to Aspartame. That was a by product of fertiziler made in the late 60s. Come to think of it, even that can be a sweetener in eliquids, can't it? Or it composition doesn't make it suitable for vaping?

Never fear, Boris is on the job. And October 31st is pretty close. So I guess the businesses will be a little apprehensive now of shipping to mainland Europe.

India banned vaping last month and I was traveling through with a few days stop there. I tried looking for some vape stores on even online. But found nothing! Luckily nothing got seized!

 

[Molchi]

He is still, they already are talking about reelctions again since the 31. is almost impossbile now. After all that horrible news from India and even from your Gouverners over there, the Brexit is atleast a bit funny, almost like a Monty Python movie

 

[hell_storm2004]

India is in a sorry state right now. I was following the news, looks like sale, promotion, distribution is illegal. Individual consumption is not. But assuming everyone turns to making their own juice, there are no nicotine suppliers available at all. But in fact, everyone will turn to cigarettes since it's simpler!

As far as US goes, there will a be a turnaround at some point. There is a larger vaping crowd and a little bit of lobbying. Which unfortunately is not available in other parts of the world.

UK and Canada seem to be the most accepting of vaping culture. Don't know about Germany, France, Netherlands, Russia etc.

 

[Molchi]

Yea saw all the judge-stopped-bans, since i watch a lot US-youtubers, like Grimm Green. But even after the state-problems isn't there still that FDA-Thing next year where every manufacturer has to do something redicilous expensive? Hope Trump stops that Bulls...

Germany is almost the same as the UK, we even don't care about the "Tanks can only have 2ml rule" and the leader of Cancer research center said it would be fatal if Vapers would go back to smoking cause of the misleading News from the USA

 

[hell_storm2004]

Believe me, vaping laws are the least of Trump's concerns right now!

I believe we make it to a better world somewhere in the future. Let's face it, cigarettes have been around for centuries and vaping like around 10-15 years. So there is a thing like who is this new kid on the block??

Oh Ethyl Maltol might be readily available in Germany wouldn't it?

I got all my info from this video:

 

[Molchi]

True, there are still the problems like: How to fix the toupee on his head the same way everyday and such tings

Yeah, that would be available, even TFA has it i think as Cotton candy, problem is that it seems to mute flavours alot. Now i found some people that say if stevia has almost 100% reubasomething A, there should be no offtaste, and also wayne from diyordie didn't mentoning anything like an offtaste. Maybe i should find some and try it.

 

[hell_storm2004]

Yeah I can guess from the name that it might be a bit overpowering. But I just placed an order for all three lychees and the TFA sweetener for now. I will make my Erythritol from crystals later on!

 

[bombastinator]

Till now they are still in the EU, and to be honest i'm not sure if i will still be alive when they leave and i'm "only" 41

Yea, Stevia seems to be way more popular, problem is that a lot of people keep telling it has an offtaste almost a bit like Licorice

All “supersweeteners” have an off taste. This is because they’re a lot sweeter than sugar. This makes them not wash off the tongue like sugar does. The sweetness kind of keeps going. Xylitol doesn’t, but that’s because it’s not a supersweetener. The downside is because of this you have to use vastly larger amounts and it tends to give people ........ because of the sheer volume of indigestible material. Also the volume is too high to be able to sweeten an ejuice. Sugar has the same problem with ejuices.

 

[bombastinator]

I think you are referring to Aspartame. That was a by product of fertiziler made in the late 60s. Come to think of it, even that can be a sweetener in eliquids, can't it? Or it composition doesn't make it suitable for vaping?

Never fear, Boris is on the job. And October 31st is pretty close. So I guess the businesses will be a little apprehensive now of shipping to mainland Europe.

Could be aspartame. Both were introduced to the US about the same time and its easy to confuse them for me. A usable ecig sweetener has to be able to handle heat. One of them can’t.
Aspartame - Wikipedia
Sucralose - Wikipedia
Erythritol - Wikipedia
Stevia - Wikipedia
Erythritol is not a supersweetener. It’s actually less sweet than sugar. It’s a sugar alcohol like xylitol, malitol, or isomalt. A lot of it is going to be needed to sweeten something.

India banned vaping last month and I was traveling through with a few days stop there. I tried looking for some vape stores on even online. But found nothing! Luckily nothing got seized!

 

[wetclay]

Sucralose is still the standard sweetener in eliquid. Really sweet. Start at 1-2% and add in small steps if needed. Gunks coils and not stable at high temps.
Stevia extract consists of Reb A (gives sweetness) and Reb B (bitter and licorice aftertaste). If you want stevia without aftertaste you should get extract with >97% Reb A. Of course the price will go up with that. Stevia is less sweet than sucralose, but interestingly much more heat stable. That's why it is recommended for baking. It dissolves poorly in PG. More than 5% and it will precipitate.
Erythritol is very heat stable as well (as opposed to sucralose) but it mutes other flavors. Like EM ( which isn't a sweetener really. It smells sweet rather than taste sweet. It mutes flavors.)
One interesting sweetener that I want to try is monk fruit extract. Stable to very high temps. Would like to hear any opinions about it, if someone tried it.

 

[bombastinator]

Sucralose is still the standard sweetener in eliquid. Really sweet. Start at 1-2% and add in small steps if needed. Gunks coils and not stable at high temps.
Stevia extract consists of Reb A (gives sweetness) and Reb B (bitter and licorice aftertaste). If you want stevia without aftertaste you should get extract with >97% Reb A. Of course the price will go up with that. Stevia is less sweet than sucralose, but interestingly much more heat stable. That's why it is recommended for baking. It dissolves poorly in PG. More than 5% and it will precipitate.
Erythritol is very heat stable as well (as opposed to sucralose) but it mutes other flavors. Like EM ( which isn't a sweetener really. It smells sweet rather than taste sweet. It mutes flavors.)
One interesting sweetener that I want to try is monk fruit extract. Stable to very high temps. Would like to hear any opinions about it, if someone tried it.

Never heard of monk fruit extract. Apparently it’s really new outside China where it was never really researched. The refining process seems really involved to me. It’s much more complex than a standard extraction. This implies there are going to be a lot of variants depending on how that particular batch was refined.
Siraitia grosvenorii - Wikipedia
These things seem to take 20 years or so to go through testing and approval so it’s still listed as having unknown properties in the US and EU. Chemicals are chemicals though. Monk fruit extract seems to be unusually complex. It’s not one chemical but several that seem to interact.

{Hard pass from me personally. It’s going to take a lot of time and money to figure out what it is and how it works and by the time they do I’ll be too old for it to matter}

 

[wetclay]

Never heard of monk fruit extract. Apparently it’s really new outside China where it was never really researched. The refining process seems really involved to me. It’s much more complex than a standard extraction. This implies there are going to be a lot of variants depending on how that particular batch was refined.
Siraitia grosvenorii - Wikipedia
These things seem to take 20 years or so to go through testing and approval so it’s still listed as having unknown properties in the US and EU. Chemicals are chemicals though. Monk fruit extract seems to be unusually complex. It’s not one chemical but several that seem to interact.

{Hard pass from me personally. It’s going to take a lot of time and money to figure out what it is and how it works and by the time they do I’ll be too old for it to matter}

It is approved and available in US for use as a sweetener. You'll find some brands on Amazon. It's a new in the global markets, though been used in China for a long time. Seems to complement sweetness of stevia when used in foods and drinks. Interestingly, OOO flavors has a liquid MFE concentrate and nude nicotine sells 5% in PG for eliquid use. So my guess, it is being used in eliquid already.
I don't think we have any safety study for any flavoring compound that goes into eliquid (or PG/VG). Definitely not one that would favor using one sweetner over another. If it ticks the three boxes (safe if ingested, water soluble, heat stable), we use it and hope for the best. Hope one day we'll have some solid data to show what is safe and what is not.

 

[hell_storm2004]

Yeah I was reading about Monk fruit. Since it's fruit it might be fructose. Don't know if the flavours are made from authentic stuff or artificial junk. But since I am a newbie, even I would like some info if anyone has it.

 

[hell_storm2004]

The fruit looks hideous!!!

 

[Izan]

Yeah I was reading about Monk fruit. Since it's fruit it might be fructose. Don't know if the flavours are made from authentic stuff or artificial junk. But since I am a newbie, even I would like some info if anyone has it.

HS,
If you want to be sure of the purity, use the synthetic version.

"There is little substantive difference in the chemical compositions of natural and artificial flavorings...The distinction in flavorings--natural versus artificial--comes from the source of these identical chemicals and may be likened to saying that an apple sold in a gas station is artificial and one sold from a fruit stand is natural."


Cheers
I

 

[Molchi]

Thanks for all the infos wetclay, really informative. Seems like i should get some stevia, already saw some with 99% reubA. Good to know about the poor disolving in pg, maybe ethanol as i did with my menthol is the better choice then

 

[bombastinator]

It is approved and available in US for use as a sweetener. You'll find some brands on Amazon. It's a new in the global markets, though been used in China for a long time. Seems to complement sweetness of stevia when used in foods and drinks. Interestingly, OOO flavors has a liquid MFE concentrate and nude nicotine sells 5% in PG for eliquid use. So my guess, it is being used in eliquid already.
I don't think we have any safety study for any flavoring compound that goes into eliquid (or PG/VG). Definitely not one that would favor using one sweetner over another. If it ticks the three boxes (safe if ingested, water soluble, heat stable), we use it and hope for the best. Hope one day we'll have some solid data to show what is safe and what is not.

Might have gotten right in because it’s “natural”. More natural than most “natural” things even.


Still not super enthusiastic. There seems to be a really complicated refining process and it can go anywhere from “we squished a fruit, 1% sweetener” to all sorts of oddities. I’m sticking with stevia. That stuff was pretty much what it is now in the 18th century.

 

[wetclay]

Thanks for all the infos wetclay, really informative. Seems like i should get some stevia, already saw some with 99% reubA. Good to know about the poor disolving in pg, maybe ethanol as i did with my menthol is the better choice then

I'm not sure about solubility in alcohol, but no harm in trying.
In PG 5% is the standard (what is available in ready made stevia in PG). You may be able to push it to 7.5% with heat and continuous mixing/shaking. One thing I notice with stevia even at 5% is that it tends to precipitate, so make sure to shake well before each use.

 

[wetclay]

Might have gotten right in because it’s “natural”. More natural than most “natural” things even.


Still not super enthusiastic. There seems to be a really complicated refining process and it can go anywhere from “we squished a fruit, 1% sweetener” to all sorts of oddities. I’m sticking with stevia. That stuff was pretty much what it is now in the 18th century.

Being "natural" does not impress me. Actually I usually stay away from "natural" in eliquid. What caught my attention is that mogrosides, the active compounds in MFE, are heat stable to 1100 F (just like RebA). Sucralose only stable to 300 F or so.
I'm waiting to hear from someone who used MFE before I give it a try myself.