expensive mods

[dormouse]

It's not cheap for people to get small numbers of custom tooled metal parts made. I work for a custom computer hardware company and most of the cost of designing and tooling custom parts is up front. The only savings are in bulk pricing.

My mods are cheap plastic ones - $20 for a 3.7v box mod, $30 for a box bottom feeder. If I want variable voltage w/ evercool that would be $55+. They use plastic battery boxes that snap closed. But they can chip or crack if dropped. They aren't as sturdy as a metal mod. Not as artistic as a wood mod. But functionally, two 3.7v mods that use the same battery size are going to vape the same.

 

[RippleInStillWater]

How do you figure the button is in the wrong place ??? It's absolutely perfect IMO. As far as quality and durability is concerned I don't think anything can compare. Now I'm no expert as I've had very little other pvs but I can attest to what I hold in my hand all day to keep me off the analogs is one of my Reo's. They all have a slightly different feel ie size or aluminium versus wood. But all three that I have at the moment are the easiest simplest and most durable mod I've seen and investigated. I can't see myself using anything else. The quality and durability is well worth the moderate investment. So to the op yes some may be way over priced but if you do some research I do believe you can find what you want maybe even for a price you find satisfactory to yourself.

Fanboy alert!!!

I believe it really has to do with modders. If you have a shop, and you're an even 5 man building team, you don't have the kind of time to produce many mods. Therefore, the price must go up to accommodate, or people would be CONSTANTLY waiting on mods. We are not talking about huge factories making mods, and in many cases, we are probably talking about a one or two man (woman) maker...

JMO

Agreed, I think modders deserve at least minimum wage!!!

Value is an abstract concept. My ecigs are ALL worth what I paid for them. (I'm NOT smoking.)

Price, on the other hand, is just a market construct. Things cost what people will pay for them.

If people will pay enough to justify what goes into making them, then things are sold.

If people are not willing to pay the asking price, either the price lowers (if it was unnaturally high), lower cost producers replace higher cost producers, or the product doesn't sell and disappears.

We've seen this a little in the few years ecigs have been on the market. Some products have had dramatic price drops. Others vanish. And most products cost more when they first appear (and have novelty value), and get cheaper later on. (So do Apple products, or anything else.)

The things about mods, though- they cost what people are willing to pay, if someone can/wants to produce them for that cost. I sure wouldn't mind if they got cheaper. But there are reasons they cost what they do.

Another poster mentioned volume- mostly, we're dealing with products that sell thousands of units a year, if that. Some are hand made individual units, and sell dozens or perhaps a couple of hundred. When you compare them to children's toys, flashlights, or Chinese-made telescopes, you're comparing to products that sell millions of units a year. High volume allows lower profit margins, lower volume tends to require and support higher margins.

But also- I haven't had a Little Sister, so I can't talk about those. But good mods are a LOT different than flashlights or children's toys. Unlike every toy I played with as a kid, these are high drain, high voltage devices, and voltage (therefore conductivity) matters. Good mods are made to deliver, as nearly as possible, the full voltage of the battery to your atomizer. The need for good conductivity means using materials that children's toys don't. Also, try this: Buy a flashlight or children's toy that you think resembles a mod. Press the button or flick the switch. HOw does it feel? Quality? Usually not. Then, press the button 1000 times. Does it still work? Some will, some won't. BUt an average ecig user will press the button many thousands of times over the life of a mod. (I have an ecig with a counter, and found out that I take 200-to 500 drags a day.) Try this with your toy- it WILL fail, in weeks if you're lucky, but probably sooner. We expect our ecigs to take a LOT of use.

And, I carry mine everywhere. Drop it sometimes. Stuff it in my pocket, bang it against the table, you know.

I've had a lot of cheap and mid-range ecigs. (Cost $30 to $80, maybe.) Not a bargain if they wear out in a hurry. I've also had one riva battery explode when it gave up, which made me think again about bargain shopping.

I'm now awaiting the arrival of a fairly high end mod. (Apex Alpha Ultramax) I suppose I wish it were cheaper. Most of us would rather pay less than more. But if it works as it seems to (according to many users), I'm happy enough to pay what it costs.

Best,
Ande

I spend way too much on mine, especially for my precarious budget, but it keeps me off gretzkys with minimal effort and worry and less $$$ spent for sure in toto -- and that's all any of us are trying to do. Like with anything else, you get what you pay for in mods........

 

[DJ_Kalee]

I can feel your pain, the nice thing about trial and error on finding the right PV is selling or swapping. It seems like every month something bigger and better comes out. Everything will be outdated within the next few years you'll be holding an old fashion PV.

 

[chevelle]

In many cases, the price will be whatever the market will bear. Some will have the money to buy anything and everything on the market that strikes their fancy. Others, obviously will not. Whether an item is overpriced for what you're getting is a call that can only be made by the individual.

Personally, I have no intention of paying a lot of money for any custom mod as I have already built my own for a few dollars in materials and a couple of hours' time in the shop. I simply ignore all the hype. It probably works as well as any of the popular hand-made units out there and I could run over it with the car with no ill effects. However, I find that my Rivas/eGos work perfectly fine for my needs already - The mod just sits there most of the time.

The thing is, a lot of people don't have access to a machine/woodworking/electronics shop so, they are paying a price to someone who does and has the ability to use them. Whether the mod is actually that much better than anything else and worth the money is again up to the individual. It seems logical that if the expensive mods were junk, the word would get out pretty quickly here and demand for it would go away... The mod builder would then be out of business. Problem solved!

Finally, Are those makers who do charge high $$$ for their mods, gouging the consumer? NO! There is an incredible variety of quality PVs available at very reasonable cost from dozens of great vendors. These PVs work very, very well for MANY people. If there were no alternatives like this and I couldn't build them myself, I might have a different opinion on the whole matter. I'm just glad we have the huge range of equipment and juices that we do have and that thousands of people are using all of them to quit smoking. Just my .02

 

[Pamdane]

I agree in some aspects with the OP, but mostly not. I want to support American Made. Making mods is one of the few areas we have so many choices. A cheap box is a cheap box. Go look at some of the machined mods. GLV is a good example. He had to design, fit and get a sturdy product. Then he PERSONALLY ads the electronics. Then he bought a powder coater. He makes colors to choice. He buys the powder and does the personalization. His waiting list is about 2 months. The operation outgrew his home. His wife is his secretary, and has a young child to care for as well. Now he has a shop/store to pay for, to lower the wait time. He had to hire someone and train them. That is 4 people my $ is supporting. I'm ok with that. I get a well made, custom made product for under $150. He deserves it. Buzz is the same way, but he has started using cheaper mechanics. Went from full brass ends to partial, and the plastic portion of the end looses the treading quickly. BUT! Its an American made product, supporting a person who went into business on his own. He designed it, had it machined, and orders them made with a variety of colors. Not as personalized, but they are certainly sturdy and designed to last. My Buzz took a good bath once and still survived. Do that with cheap china electronics. I'm a mom on a budgeted income, cant afford a lot, but I know that we need to look out for ourselves. Our economy depends on bringing manufacturing back home. Well, these people are doing that. On the other hand, I hesitate to buy batteries and chargers from the mod makers. Batteries are ALL made overseas. In that area I shop around. For $5 I can get the same SET of batts they sell for $16 if I'm willing to wait the 2 weeks for shipping.
I'd also support the wood mod makers, if I were able to hold a box shape. I love the hand made wood look. Wood burning design is a skill. And the electronic component is done by hand as well. I would expect to have to pay for this.
So, decide where you priorities lie. If you want a cheap box mod, dont expect it to survive a bath. Dont expect it to survive too many falls off a desk or kitchen counter.
Its as true in mods as anything else: you get what you pay for. I want good products with good customer service, and I'm willing to balance the cost to get it.

 

[MiXoLoGiSt]

The bottom line is you get what you pay for! All the expensive mods are that way for a reason. The time, effort and money that goes into getting these mods made is well worth the money, not to mention the functionality some of them have. Or just the gorgeous looks of them are sometimes worth the money (Empire, Precise, GGTS). <--- those mods work awesome btw! Its not as easy or cheap as you think to have parts machined (here in the US) to get these mods made.

Basically, plain and simple, if you think they are overpriced, don't buy them. I am very happy with the purchase of all the mods i have bought! I have owned more than those listed in my sig and never have i once thought they aren't worth the money. They keep me off analogs and that's what matters.

 

[Sedateme]

Speak with your wallet. Nobody is forcing you to buy anything. Making mods can be easy. Some people can do it, others can't.

Fixing cars can be easy too, if you know how. How much money have you given to mechanics in your life? You could save all that money by learning automotive repair and doing the work yourself. Some of the labor charges are insane to have your car fixed, and for good reason. It takes special knowledge to do it right. I don't know how to fix cars, so I pay someone else who can fix mine.

Need dental work? Can you do it yourself? Probably not... good thing there are people out there who know how to take care of that.

Hailstorm giving you the "holy crap my roof has holes" blues? Grab a ladder and start re-shingling.... or pay to have someone do it.

Want the newest shiny PV with variable voltage... or a juice feeder... maybe a custom-turned aluminum body that looks completely sweet? Hope you have some expensive equipment to fabricate the parts... or the electrical knowledge to wire the components together without blowing up a battery... or the mechanical inclination to build more than a plastic box... or you can pay someone who already has the equipment and/or knowledge to make one for you.

Whether any particular mod is worth the money they are asking is up to you... you have the wonderful option of not buying it.

 

[dormouse]

On the flip side - Some people have bought expensive mods and then lose or damage an end cap or a switch and poof the model is no longer made or the company is gone. So if you so buy something pricey, buy it from someplace that plans to stick around, sells repair parts for old models etc.

 

[Boodle]

I'm grateful for the mod manufacturers in the USA and certainly don't believe they're getting rich - rather the opposite. Late nights in garages and basements fueled by passion, figuring it out... making a run, getting returns, re-tooling, buying small orders of supplies at premium prices, repeating the process until it's just right - almost and repeat. Work days 14-16 hours long, eating most meals in 5 minutes with a spork and rarely seeing the family. For every pioneer, success or failure, no one can ever take away the feeling of hope, passion or commitment that burned inside them as they made a product that was part of igniting a new industry and changing lives.

China will come, make a cheap copy and sell them for a fraction without worry of lawsuit ads begging you to call 555 Bad Ecig. This first wave of modders are full of hope and get the reward of knowing what they started is changing lives for the better but not much else, really. As the mod pioneers tire from all the arrows in their back a second wave will emerge and get rich without apology. I'm happy to pay the price of a couple of cartons of cigarettes for an American made mod to the brave pioneers. American ingenuity at its best is happening before us.

 

[chevelle]

On the flip side - Some people have bought expensive mods and then lose or damage an end cap or a switch and poof the model is no longer made or the company is gone. So if you so buy something pricey, buy it from someplace that plans to stick around, sells repair parts for old models etc.

Thats a good point mouse! Hard to know who would be in a better position to survive for the long haul. Unfortunately, going under is all too real a possibility for nearly anyone.

 

[Mudflap]

Economies of scale.

That's why.

 

[AlmightyGod]

I don't know about where you live, but I need to make a couple of hundred bucks a day to make ends meet. If I was selling $20 items with a 50% profit margin, I'd have to produce & sell 20 items per day. Even if it only took me half of the day to make them, I'd still need to market & sell it. Not to mention buying parts, handling warranty work, & other business related activities.

Economies of scale is 100% correct.

 

[alanselo]

If I had no choice and had to buy a crappy product at an expensive bloated price, I would consider it a ripoff.

When I have options, mentors, and information available to help me with those options then it is a choice I make and cannot feel "ripped off". I might and have made bad choices but no one forced them on me.

All of the mods are priced accordingly...
according to what the consumer decides to pay for it....

 

[kabonk]

I guess I look at it this way 3 cartons of cigarettes in my state =$186.00 lasted me about 2 weeks maybe less 1 Reo Grand $147.00 shipped still going strong 10 months later, provari w/ ext cap and batteries $200.00 4 cartons of cigarettes =$248.00. so I have well built PVs for less then it cost me to smoke in a month and I'm happy with them so I guess thats all that matters

 

[woolgrower]

Parkes Vaping has some decent looking tube mods for $25. Pretty tough to beat that.

 

[Goldenkobold]

China will save us one day, leaving only the most artistic and innovative mod makers standings. (I don't think the wood mod makers will be replaced by china, though they may be driven to a more extreme niche by comparatively lower prices) If you want to know how much your mechanical mod maker is gouging you over cost of production just go to emachineshop use there cad software and the dimensions of your favorite mechanical mod and see how much it would cost to make it (and remember emachineshop is often more expensive than a local metal worker would be...especially if your in a heavy industrial area...or a country with a failing economy), I think you will find most of the 200 dollar mechanical mods can be made, on your own, for 50-60 bucks.

But then your just stealing someone elses R&D, its like a mechanical torrent at that point.

China is going to be selling the provari like lavatube for 40 bucks a pop (on the high end) so even if a local supplier marks it up to $80 bucks, a whopping 100% mark up, they will still be half of what the provari costs at its "on sale" price of 159.99.

 

[ChaosAffect]

Parkes Vaping has some decent looking tube mods for $25. Pretty tough to beat that.

Yet another site that stole Vermonster, YZR, and my carto tank design from the VF modder's forum. That's the second I've seen. At least Stormy had the minimal class to credit where she got it. I really hate it when vendors steal DIY concepts and Jack up the price. $8 for $2.50 in parts, and 5 minutes in labor.

Sent from my GTablet using Tapatalk

 

[thorn]

Like many fairly new vapours I have spent an awful lot of money trying to find the perfect PV and juices. One thing has struck me above others and that is the price of many mods. If you take a tube mod it is a tube with a little circutry and a button to press, more or less the same as a torch or a childs battery operated toy. Why then is it I can buy a torch or toy for around ten dollars but a mod can easily cost up to $200! Now I am all for people making a decent profit but I cant help feeling more than a little ripped off sometimes. Today I recieved a little sister mod and I am the first to say that it works really really well. It is however made of a very flimsy plastic and a tiny wobbly switch so whilst it works well now I am not at all sure that it will last more than a few weeks at most. It has a bic lighter body but not as sturdy. I know it is a decent PV but in no other area do we pay $60+ for a bit of plastic and electronics. You can buy a cell phone for less and that is far more sturdy and has more complicated electronics. I realise they are not made in the same numbers as the other items but I still feel we are over paying for these items

A cell phone is not that cheap. They make their money in the contracts and the fact that you will pay them monthly for years. Same concept goes for inkjet printers as you will buy ink for the life of the printer and that is where they make their money.

Do you know why your car or computer is not working? No, you are not a mechanic or tech savvy, so you pay a local mechanic/repairman to fix your car/computer problem at $60/hour. He probably will not tell you it was a $1 piece of hose or broken cable that failed because then you would get upset just as you are now at this other product. But you are happy to have it working again. You are paying for a result, not what goes into achieving that result.

Now, why are some mods so pricey? Because they are hand made at a slow pace. I have built a number of them myself and can afford to spend hours and hours getting it right and making it pretty, as a hobby. But to mass produce them beyond 5 units? Now I have to calculate the man-hours plus all other costs involved to see if I will make a profit or loss on the deal. There is a point at which it is no longer a hobby in my spare time but trying to fulfill a demand for a profit. And since some mods are not made in China, Taiwan, or the Philippines, labor cost is higher for those.

Nobody is getting rich making the cooler looking mods because supply and demand will send customers to a competitor if the price is too high or quality sucks, no matter what it cost to make them. As much as I would love to see my mods hit the market, I will not go poor to do that. Support your local neighbor and take back pride in your country again. Remember the trickle down effect? It trickles around too!

 

[JQside]

But also- I haven't had a Little Sister, so I can't talk about those. But good mods are a LOT different than flashlights or children's toys. Unlike every toy I played with as a kid, these are high drain, high voltage devices, and voltage (therefore conductivity) matters. Good mods are made to deliver, as nearly as possible, the full voltage of the battery to your atomizer. The need for good conductivity means using materials that children's toys don't. Also, try this: Buy a flashlight or children's toy that you think resembles a mod. Press the button or flick the switch. HOw does it feel? Quality? Usually not. Then, press the button 1000 times. Does it still work? Some will, some won't. BUt an average ecig user will press the button many thousands of times over the life of a mod. (I have an ecig with a counter, and found out that I take 200-to 500 drags a day.) Try this with your toy- it WILL fail, in weeks if you're lucky, but probably sooner. We expect our ecigs to take a LOT of use.

You're not crediting mods makers for the long battery life do you? I don't think they have the money for R&D to extend battery life beyond what you see in laptops, flashlights, ipads, etc. Bottom line is, all the materials they need to make the mods are there for every entrepreneur adventurous enough to go into the business.

If there is another case where the oft repeated remark, "this is no rocket science" applies, this is one. It's a simple battery with a switch and a wicking mechanism. Long battery life is directly proportional to the size. You want one with a longer life? Get a bigger one. As simple as that. I'd be happy to see an e-cig the size of a real cigarette that lasts at least one day of vaping.

 

[El-ahrairah]

I dunno what to tell you. If a mod is too expensive, there are other, cheaper, options available. Nobody is holding your feet to the fire and making you buy an expensive mod. Hell, you can even build your own and they don't even have to be in a plastic battery box. You can use whatever you like!

But then, I bit the bullet and bought a Provari, so I may be a bit spoiled and pretentious. On the other hand, I haven't had the urge to go PV shopping since I bought it, make of it what you will.