Explosion at Vape Blast

[Ozwald]

For those that think the community had no part in this, below are links to threads that as of this posting are all on the front page of the newbies forum

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/595598-what-your-first-mech-mod.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-dual-18650-mosfet-continuous-fire-issue.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/596017-looking-new-mech-mod.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/596018-help-drilling-out-rda.html

I read most of the threads and there wasn't a word about safety or any advice that perhaps they should invest in a good quality regulated device instead of a mech. Some of these folks have been around since...... August 2014.......

A whole lot of people on this thread are putting all the responsibility on the person who's mech blew, but he is nothing more then an end result of the ignorance that has been going on within a part of the community that is pushing extreme vaping (and acting as if it is the norm). The community has to take a good part of the blame for pushing the illusion that mech's with ultra low ohm's (I would also add ultra high watt regulated devices) are some sort of vaping nirvana.

Keep in mind that a join date doesn't mean a whole lot. Some people started vaping long before they found ECF (or decided they wanted to join). For myself personally, I read a ton of threads on here before I made an account. Same goes with electrical knowledge - I've seen some peoples' comments suggesting they don't know their stuff about electricity solely based on their join date. Again, speaking only for myself, I went through electronics classes back in high school & I've been an amateur radio operator for a good number of years. A friend of mine that I got vaping quite some time ago still hasn't joined, probably never will. He has a PhD in Astrophysics.

True, there are neophytes jumping in the deep end way before they should, but I wouldn't automatically assume much of anything solely based on when they joined the forum.

 

[tayone415]

Keep in mind that a join date doesn't mean a whole lot. Some people started vaping long before they found ECF (or decided they wanted to join). For myself personally, I read a ton of threads on here before I made an account. Same goes with electrical knowledge - I've seen some peoples' comments suggesting they don't know their stuff about electricity solely based on their join date. Again, speaking only for myself, I went through electronics classes back in high school & I've been an amateur radio operator for a good number of years. A friend of mine that I got vaping quite some time ago still hasn't joined, probably never will. He has a PhD in Astrophysics.

True, there are neophytes jumping in the deep end way before they should, but I wouldn't automatically assume much of anything solely based on when they joined the forum.

That's a good point and to add to that someone can be a member for years and have 1000's of post and know a lot less than a newer member.

 

[AlfyB]

But that hardly changes anything to the point Stubby is making...

 

[tayone415]

But that hardly changes anything to the point Stubby is making...

Ok, so the point he is making is that people aren't giving out safety advice to new members, even though some already have experience with owning mechanical mods. Also those people who bought it from a B&M should have been given safety information by the employees and the user should be doing his or her own research before jumping in to anything. It is good to give safety advice when it is needed, I usually do most of the time with batteries and ohms law if needed. But, he said he read the new members section and the whole threads and said he didn't see a single word about safety then posted links to those threads he felt safety was failed to be mentioned, but didn't take the time to reply to any of the threads himself to advise safety, but claims it's the responsibility of people to automatically give out safety advice and warnings. Which is actually worse to not do something and blame other people.

 

[AlfyB]

Well, if he's not spending time on the new member section, it's hardly his responsibility. Unless you're blaming him for not having posted on every thread he checked this time around especially for the purpose of checking them...

Come on, let's be realistic. He's mostly saying we could do things better when it comes to promoting safety first on the forum. I think he's right but it's not a blame game. Some vaping forums have standard welcoming messages with links to safety related documents hosted on the forum itself, each newcomer gets it when he joins. I'm not saying the ECF HAS to do this, or that it's the ECF's fault anything happened... Just, it might be worth reflecting on what messages are given newcomers when then join here. That's all.

 

[tayone415]

Well, if he's not spending time on the new member section, it's hardly his responsibility. Unless you're blaming him for not having posted on every thread he checked this time around especially for the purpose of checking them...

Come on, let's be realistic. He's mostly saying we could do things better when it comes to promoting safety first on the forum. I think he's right but it's not a blame game. Some vaping forums have standard welcoming messages with links to safety related documents hosted on the forum itself, each newcomer gets it when he joins. I'm not saying the ECF HAS to do this, or that it's the ECF's fault anything happened... Just, it might be worth reflecting on what messages are given newcomers when then join here. That's all.

My point was he took the time to look in to certain threads and claimed he read the whole threads and linked those threads in his post to try to prove a point, but the threads he read he didn't attempt to solve any issues by posting a reply about safety. So for the threads he linked it can easily be said it was his responsibility, if he seen a problem and could added to the solution instead of just posting links.

Also ECF does have a search button and stickies about sub ohms and many other topics, that should be read. People also need to be smart enough to research before they do most anything.

You can't blame others for something you could of done too but chose to ignore.

 

[exnihilo]

I'm not reading through 90% crapola, but did anyone mention the fact/possibility that convention centers may be less likely to allow vape oriented meetings after something like this, especially fire department permits, etc... Where said centers simply wouldn't want to incur the expense involved with updating their fire safety protocols to allow such future events to take place?

Tapa-shutup

 

[Equilibrium]

If things like this become a regularity, I see vapeing events being moved to outside venues.

 

[Ozwald]

That's a good point and to add to that someone can be a member for years and have 1000's of post and know a lot less than a newer member.

I've seen that myself - a member who shall be unnamed with well over 2000 posts, joined in 2011 & is still asking extremely basic questions.

But that hardly changes anything to the point Stubby is making...

I wasn't arguing for or against his point, just noting that a join date or number of posts doesn't mean anything in respect to someone's knowledge. If sincere questions are asked or safety needs to be addressed, regardless of post count, join date or even experience, it should be addressed. Still the responsibility falls on the person asking the question.

 

[AttyPops]

For those that think the community had no part in this, below are links to threads that as of this posting are all on the front page of the newbies forum

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/595598-what-your-first-mech-mod.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-dual-18650-mosfet-continuous-fire-issue.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/596017-looking-new-mech-mod.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/596018-help-drilling-out-rda.html

I read most of the threads and there wasn't a word about safety or any advice that perhaps they should invest in a good quality regulated device instead of a mech. Some of these folks have been around since...... August 2014.......

A whole lot of people on this thread are putting all the responsibility on the person who's mech blew, but he is nothing more then an end result of the ignorance that has been going on within a part of the community that is pushing extreme vaping (and acting as if it is the norm). The community has to take a good part of the blame for pushing the illusion that mech's with ultra low ohm's (I would also add ultra high watt regulated devices) are some sort of vaping nirvana.

While I agree that safety can't be stressed too much, I don't think all the other conclusions are flawless.
First off, most of the battery issues and fires have been with regulated devices, not mechs.
Secondly, some of those threads you linked (like the MOSFET one) are not about battery safety or SLR or such. The MOSFET one should be moved to the modder's section, and may be moved there after a bit. I wouldn't expect safety comments for that particular question (although the modder's discuss safety all the time too...not saying they don't). It wasn't about what battery to use, or what ohms, or anything like that...it was an electronic circuit question. It could use more details, but meh.

Some mech fans have stated mechs are safer. Others disagree. As a general rule I think "extremest SLR is pushing the limits of everything" and is a bad idea, this is the first case where I've seen such a "boom". I'm betting it was the mod's design at issue.

So can there be unsafe mods?...yep. We need to get them off the market.

What we really lack in this instance is full details. (I've skipped some posts though, so I may have missed them). What battery was used? What mech? (there's other questions too, but since any mod can short, I don't care about ohms right now, etc.)

I agree with you that we have to stress safety...particularly for mechs. All mech rigs should be designed to survive a continuous dead-short without exploding. THAT should be the standard. By "rigs" I mean...the battery used matters too. The combo of battery and mod.

 

[DaveP]

Yeah... I would To.

I also like that you said "Vent Holes" and Not "Vent Hole".

Because if a Battery Swells in a Tube, a single Vent Hole on the End Cap may be Worthless.

My Sigelei Zmax has about 5 holes on the bottom. My Provari has one, but it also has a top cap on the other end that utilizes a red rubber o-ring to secure it. That lets the cap pop off in case the battery swells and seals off the bottom hole. Still, they could have drilled a few more holes in the bottom battery cap.

 

[Equilibrium]

I'm not sure, but I think I'm gonna need a few more holes in this one if the battery ever vents... LOL!!

 

[AttyPops]

I'm not sure, but I think I'm gonna need a few more holes in this one if the battery ever vents... LOL!!
View attachment 366823

You know what I'd worry about with those types? Rain. (Guess I'm a worrier!)

That's a good design though. Even if it had a PAPER wrapper, or lightweight plastic around it...something that won't allow pressure buildup but also keep it kinda dry.

P.S.
What is that?

 

[Dredge]

Attypops thats the AR mod. Ar Mod - Best USA Made Mod By Tac Mods USA - All USA Made Mechanical

I almost got one, but didn't like the feel between my fingers. Its built to look like the rails of an AR-15, very heavy. Definitely dont drop it on a glass counter top haha

 

[tj99959]

Maybe we could mount a 510 connection on a LiPo bag.

 

[AttyPops]

Maybe we could mount a 510 connection on a LiPo bag.

Well, it would work!

IDK though:
Possessive: "My vape bag!"
Aggressive: "You vape bag"

And of course, the wife/GF will run around saying..."Here, hold my vape bag for a minute"...all the time.

 

[Equilibrium]

You know what I'd worry about with those types? Rain. (Guess I'm a worrier!)

That's a good design though. Even if it had a PAPER wrapper, or lightweight plastic around it...something that won't allow pressure buildup but also keep it kinda dry.

P.S.
What is that?

Yep... that's the AR and it is HEAVY and it IS a little rough on the hands. They could have "tumbled" it in a steel shot tumbler to calm down the sharp edges IMO but it will last forever and it can never be called a "pipe bomb". It's got 20 huge holes around it.

 

[DaveP]

I understand the talk about new members possibly being as electronically astute as the veteran members in this forum. Electronics and related training that many get early on fits right in with the ability to see how resistance, current, and voltage interrelate with vaping. I don't worry about new members who demonstrate that they understand how it all works. I worry about those who can't explain I=E/R and it's related permutations.

The ones I worry about are the new members who complain that their Vision Spinner won't heat up the .5 ohm coil they built. If they don't understand that and someone recommends a mech that they need to buy to fix the problem, then what's to keep them from not understanding the implications of a shorted atty coil once they have the mech?

"I didn't know" doesn't make any difference once a mech has blown up in your hand or spewed hot battery liquids into your pants pocket. I saw Rolgate's post in the New Members forum. Maybe it should be linked to a notification for anyone who has 500 or more posts under their belt.

 

[AttyPops]

I wonder if we couldn't apply the box mod solution to cylindrical mods...mech or not.

Most box mods have a cover that slides/pops off. Can't build up pressure. Not true for all though, so check first. However, for a tube style mod, they are all designed with threads on the ends. That's easier for garage shops to fashion compared to more complicated setups.

Another solution would be to use two 1/2 pipes that slide over top of each other. One holds the top, the other the bottom button. There's enough contact to make a good ground connection all over. Would "slide apart" under pressure? Or come apart? Hmmmmm.......

Of course there's variations, button near top, slot around it....etc.

 

[Dredge]

Yep... that's the AR and it is HEAVY and it IS a little rough on the hands. They could have "tumbled" it in a steel shot tumbler to calm down the sharp edges IMO but it will last forever and it can never be called a "pipe bomb". It's got 20 huge holes around it.

Since it has rails though...can you attach a taclight to it?