FDA FDA deeming regulation proposals

[Ms.P]

PLEASE STOP!!!

(1) We were asked to WAIT for CASAA to issue some guidance on what we should do and when.

(2) The petition contains false statements. The very first sentence is FALSE. The FDA has only PROPOSED regulations.

(3) The petition is poorly worded and contains spelling, grammar, and syntax errors. It doesn't help us if it reads as if it was written by a third-grader.

I understand how you feel; we're all _____ (nervous, scared, angry). But we can't go off half-cocked on our own with a petition here and a letter there. We need to put forth a unified effort and we need to do it intelligently.

Please don't sign the petition. WAIT for CASAA's guidance.

If you're not a member of CASAA, please join. If you are a member, please donate!

 

[Retro68]

http://.........blogspot.com/2014/04/sources-fda-to-release-their.html

"Former CASAA Lawyer Greg Conley will be coming on mod Envy this Saturday to explain the FDA regulations."

This may be of interest to some, I just hope I'm not doing anything wrong by posting the link.

Forgot to add, signed as well.

 

[Katya]

Mr.P, don't worry, Nobody at the White House will ever read this petition. I've already signed several--one even reached over 100,000 signatures.

They don't give a... what's the word now?

 

[Kent C]

Age restrictions do not work. Never have, and never will.

And they won't in this case. One could make the case that it will force kids to smoke but that's 'illegal' too. I think they'll make the right choice (and the cheaper one) since both will be illegal.

 

[Kent C]

Mr.P, don't worry, Nobody at the White House will ever read this petition. I've already signed several--one even reached over 100,000 signatures.

They don't give a... what's the word now?

They just mine the names and addresses.....

 

[Ms.P]

Mr.P, don't worry, Nobody at the White House will ever read this petition. I've already signed several--one even reached over 100,000 signatures.

They don't give a... what's the word now?

"hoot" ?? And - ahem - that's MIZZ P, tyvm.

 

[Katya]

"hoot" ?? And - ahem - that's MIZZ P, tyvm.

So sorry, Ms.P!

So sorry. I'm crossed eyed already from all this reading and can't see... what's the word now?

 

[Katya]

They just mine the names and addresses.....

They do??? And what do they do with them?????????????

Wait wait. Don't tell me.

 

[Kent C]

They do??? And what do they do with them?????????????

Wait wait. Don't tell me.

Ok stoopid limit

 

[Ms.P]

So sorry, Ms.P!

So sorry. I'm crossed eyed already from all this reading and can't see... what's the word now?

nuffin'? lol Couldn't come up with a good alternative.

 

[JohnD0406]

I don't know... I see the worst-case scenario simply leading to a huge black market, and importing (illegally of course) new equipment. US Customs confiscates a fraction of the packages containing contraband. You'll take your chances in losing your order, but I would expect 90% to get through without any problem. So, again, worst-case, this will drive the market out of the US and into other countries. Yes, that sucks, especially for US companies, but IMHO, not the end of vaping.

 

[JackInCali]

I

I don't know... I see the worst-case scenario simply leading to a huge black market, and importing (illegally of course) new equipment. US Customs confiscates a fraction of the packages containing contraband. You'll take your chances in losing your order, but I would expect 90% to get through without any problem. So, again, worst-case, this will drive the market out of the US and into other countries. Yes, that sucks, especially for US companies, but IMHO, not the end of vaping.

I would find it extremely ironic if I have to hit the black market to vape but get a medical ......... card and legally smoke {OTHER STUFF} lol. Something is very wrong with this country...

 

[JohnD0406]

I would find it extremely ironic if I have to hit the black market to vape but get a medical ......... card and legally smoke pot lol. Something is very wrong with this country...

Ironic indeed, but I don't even think the black market would be necessary. Juice companies could turn into cupcake flavoring companies for example. Only need to "certify" one product - flavorless PG/VG/nicotine - just add flavorings.

As for shipping, my most recent mod purchase from the Philippines was routed through China, then Japan, then to the US where it spent 2 hours getting through customs. Oh, and it was labeled as "CNC machined parts samples". Another was labeled as a flashlight. Totally unnecessary today, but in a couple years? Maybe. Let's not dismiss the fact that mods could be fitted with a cheap flashlight head, fully functional, at which point the "flashlight" really is a flashlight. It's late, and I'm coming up with this as I sit here tired and ready for bed - just imagine what the industry will come up with given smart people and 2 years time.

A friend who works in the shipping biz told me that it's common to route through countries as my last mod did, as the US doesn't check packages from Japan due to some contract (I haven't verified that, but even if not true, there are so many loopholes).

I also disagree with Grimm Green's comment about "the end of the Kayfun". Has he forgotten where it's manufactured? Not in the USA. Nemesis? Greece. You get the idea - back to that shipping thing again.

The FDA really does need to play it's cards smart, or this will go spinning way out of their control. We'll see...

 

[thanswr]

So what about buying devices/juices from other countries? Does the FDA have authority to stop importing of such items?

Do you seriously think the Chinese don't have a plan in place? My guess is ready and waiting to use it.

 

[thanswr]

My take on all of this is simple: If the FDA was able to recognize vaporizors as a health risk, they would have done so. In that case, today's report would have been vastly different.

The FDA has taken a "please present us with your evidence" approach that vaping is safe. No one has been sitting on their hands. There have been umpteenth studies that are already completed or will be completed soon.

Vaping will not be banned. Will it be regulated? Of course, and it should be.

If you're going to present a product as being safe, prove it.

If you're going to present a product as being a successful stop-smoking device, prove it.

In other words, prove your claims. Others have done and will be doing the studies. There's the evidence to present to the FDA.

Will it cost money to do so? Of course, but that will be the cost of doing business.

The fact is the "wild west" days of anything goes was never going to be forever. No more titanium dioxide travesties in vape juice.

It looks to me like the FDA is taking a look at an industry in its infancy and is letting it develop.

As for BT taking over: Maybe. They're a big business. Their business model is changing and they're going to change with it.

Did vapers get everything we wanted? Of course not. But neither did the hysterics that have sweeped the country. They're the big losers in this. The FDA turned their backs on hysteria.

IMO, The FDA has all but said "vaping is here to stay".

 

[Stubby]

Ironic indeed, but I don't even think the black market would be necessary. Juice companies could turn into cupcake flavoring companies for example. Only need to "certify" one product - flavorless PG/VG/nicotine - just add flavorings.

As for shipping, my most recent mod purchase from the Philippines was routed through China, then Japan, then to the US where it spent 2 hours getting through customs. Oh, and it was labeled as "CNC machined parts samples". Another was labeled as a flashlight. Totally unnecessary today, but in a couple years? Maybe. Let's not dismiss the fact that mods could be fitted with a cheap flashlight head, fully functional, at which point the "flashlight" really is a flashlight. It's late, and I'm coming up with this as I sit here tired and ready for bed - just imagine what the industry will come up with given smart people and 2 years time.

A friend who works in the shipping biz told me that it's common to route through countries as my last mod did, as the US doesn't check packages from Japan due to some contract (I haven't verified that, but even if not true, there are so many loopholes).

I also disagree with Grimm Green's comment about "the end of the Kayfun". Has he forgotten where it's manufactured? Not in the USA. Nemesis? Greece. You get the idea - back to that shipping thing again.

The FDA really does need to play it's cards smart, or this will go spinning way out of their control. We'll see...

The ANTZ must be jumping for joy and hope your views become mainstream. It is exactly what they want. Just roll over and make believe the black market will solve everything. Sounds like a great plan. In the meantime the vast majority of products now freely available to us disappear, B&M stores will be gone (nothing to sell), along with every medium the small producer and most larger ones. If this regulation passes as is, nearly everything now on the market will be gone, and that is not fear-mongering, thats reality.

As is, we are dependent on the FDA playing nice guy and making the application for a new tobacco product a lot less onerous. I would not want to put my eggs in that basket.

The black market may help those that already know there way around, but for the vast majority of current and future smokers who want to make the switch the black market is not going to help. The ignorant lazy attitude of black market solutions is in fact a death knoll for millions of smokers.

In the coming weeks listen to the real experts on THR and the politics behind this as in Bill Godshall, Carl Phillips, Brad Rodu, Gregory Conley and CASAA. Get educated on the real issues instead trying to impress us with your total lack of insight and foresight.

Okay, I may have been a bit harsh on that last one..... so it goes.....

 

[eeevilyn.]

I don't agree that vaping needs to be regulated by the FDA.

I also am with the previous poster about teens. Age restrictions do not stop anyone that wants to use something. Age restrictions will just make it harder for everyone. How does the online vendor verify age? Signature required shipping only? That's extra cost and a hassle because I'm at work as I'm sure many others are.

I'm waiting for CASAA to make their Call to Action but in the meantime I think it's important to question and discuss.

 

[tommy2bad]

My take on all of this is simple: If the FDA was able to recognize vaporizors as a health risk, they would have done so. In that case, today's report would have been vastly different.

The FDA has taken a "please present us with your evidence" approach that vaping is safe. No one has been sitting on their hands. There have been umpteenth studies that are already completed or will be completed soon.

The thing is why didn't they consider these umpteen studies showing vaping is safe? Instead they ignored them and will continue to do so no mater how many studies show any product is safe. see below as to why.

Vaping will not be banned. Will it be regulated? Of course, and it should be.

If you're going to present a product as being safe, prove it.

The drawback is proving that not only is a product safe in itself but that it has no detrimental effect on quitting smoking or atracting new users for tobacco products.
If you're going to present a product as being a successful stop-smoking device, prove it.[/QUOTE]

In other words, prove your claims. Others have done and will be doing the studies. There's the evidence to present to the FDA.

NO they have not, not one vapor product has been shown to the requirements of the fda that it is safer and neither has any other tobacco product.

Will it cost money to do so? Of course, but that will be the cost of doing business.

The fact is the "wild west" days of anything goes was never going to be forever. No more titanium dioxide travesties in vape juice.

It looks to me like the FDA is taking a look at an industry in its infancy and is letting it develop.

As for BT taking over: Maybe. They're a big business. Their business model is changing and they're going to change with it.

NO they won't change, not fast enough and this regulation is designed delibratly or acidently I don't know, to gift vaping to tobacco companies.
Did vapers get everything we wanted? Of course not. But neither did the hysterics that have sweeped the country. They're the big losers in this. The FDA turned their backs on hysteria.

IMO, The FDA has all but said "vaping is here to stay".

 

[Schwiggiddy]

1. I disagree it's fear mongering. informing people makes sense, but u can interpret how u wish.
2. They are setting up for bigger and better things without the fear of losing in court.
3. Yes I'll be allowed to Vape for 2 more years, the. Vape what BT sells, that's my thought I hope your right but I can't bank on your thought.

Don't confuse fear with motivation.

To paraphrase what someone said in another thread, I don't really like all of the scaremongering, but I am on the side of the people who are doing it, and if it helps to rally the troops, I'll not oppose it. Sometimes the troops need rallying.

The deeming regulations seem like a desperate, almost hilarious grasp by the FDA; they may just fall flat on their face and realize that trying to regulate anything other than the nicotine itself will fail.

 

[hlk]

The deeming regulations seem like a desperate, almost hilarious grasp by the FDA; they may just get fall flat on their face and realize that trying to regulate anything other than the nicotine itself will fail.

I agree... it seems rather than focus on nicotine they chose to worry about "FDA APPROVED" devices which IMO can never be enforced...Talk about barking up the wrong tree...

There are so many ways vape hardware can be used and sold. They must know this so it's kind of just going through the motions because they have to. I can see the vape stores with diclaimers stating that the devices are not intended for use with nicotine.. end of problem. Who is going to enforce this crap anyway?