Fda news release

[Vista Chris]

Good point, for now.

I hope they are taking their time and measuring their response.
Because we need someone to lead, or no one will follow.

I have seen zero come from the ECA that has helped vaping anymore then this forum has since it's inception (and the forum is free), but I won't go off topic more then that in here

I am interested in posting everything that everyone wants me to about this topic wherever I can. I will start at our blog and send out links from there so if you've got info, please send it.

I am currently working on a full rebuttal for every single syllable the FDA spewed in their press release today.

More to come soon. Any help is appreciated.

 

[ladyraj]

The methodology decided upon by the FDA when constructing the e-cig study was flawed from the beginning. When formulating an hypothesis, all variables should be considered that may impact the topic under study. All pieces of the puzzle are required to complete the task.

The FDA chose to pair the e-cig with the Nicotrol product designed to be a cessation device. The e-cig is a smoking alternative, not a cessation device. It is obvious that NRT, which produces no vapor/smoke, will have less additives and constituents than a smoking alternative. So what exactly was the point of the study? NRT marketing???

A more informative and valuable analysis would include the variable that is the alternative to the e-cig. One has to ask why wasn't tobacco smoking included? The benefits of the e-cig when compared to cigarettes would be readily obvious. After all, the data points and measures were all tobacco specific and adding cigarettes would be an easy task. Further, a continuum of harm could have been "proved" that would enable the populace to make informed choices of acceptable levels of risk.

I submit the question to ask the FDA is why time and money was wasted to measure apples to oranges rather than a straight-forward analysis of the types of apple and which was healthier.

 

[Vista Chris]

Thanks. I feel better after getting that typed. It's going to get lost here though... what can we do to get it posted somewhere prominent? Put it in its own thread and sticky it?

It's right here for now. It's a start.

TheIllustratedMan

Keep em coming guys.

 

[SSRob]

OK, I was not home earlier, but now I am, and have had a chance to let this all settle. There are a lot of things that I could say here, but I'm just going to put out the facts.

25 pages of text and this is to date the best post I've read on the entire forum, ever.

Thank you
Rob

 

[ladyraj]

I have seen zero come from the ECA that has helped vaping anymore then this forum has since it's inception (and the forum is free), but I won't go off topic more then that in here

I am interested in posting everything that everyone wants me to about this topic wherever I can. I will start at our blog and send out links from there so if you've got info, please send it.

I am currently working on a full rebuttal for every single syllable the FDA spewed in their press release today.

More to come soon. Any help is appreciated.

What can I do to help? Research is a passion of mine so just tell me what you need...and I'll get it.

 

[TheIllustratedMan]

25 pages of text and this is to date the best post I've read on the entire forum, ever.

Thank you
Rob

Thank you Rob. Please please please use it however you can. I plan on drafting a letter to my representatives based around it. If someone else wants to do the same and make a form letter that we can all use, that would be cool. I've cracked the beers, so I'm not sure I'm good for it tonight.

EDIT: cvapure, I posted a comment on your blog correcting the links at the bottom, but I see that you fixed them, so I guess you can ignore the comment. Or post it. Whatever.

 

[Vista Chris]

What can I do to help? Research is a passion of mine so just tell me what you need...and I'll get it.

Thanks Lady

Any tidbits of info you can find that refute the FDA statements are great.

I opened a new tab dedicated exclusively to this topic at our blog and we pingback with all the big ecig news sites so the more we can get posted up there the better.

I am working on my own rebuttals but facts about ecigs, specific info on ecig ingredients, anything like that I think would help.

 

[Vista Chris]

Thank you Rob. Please please please use it however you can. I plan on drafting a letter to my representatives based around it. If someone else wants to do the same and make a form letter that we can all use, that would be cool. I've cracked the beers, so I'm not sure I'm good for it tonight.

EDIT: cvapure, I posted a comment on your blog correcting the links at the bottom, but I see that you fixed them, so I guess you can ignore the comment. Or post it. Whatever.

I saw it that's why i fixed thanks!

You're on!

 

[ladyraj]

Thanks. I feel better after getting that typed. It's going to get lost here though... what can we do to get it posted somewhere prominent? Put it in its own thread and sticky it?

Great info, thanks! The link below is to a forum is run by a professor at Boston University, Dr Siegel. He used to be a tobacco control advocate until he saw the antics of his peers and opted out. The Doc is an e-cig advocate and has great contacts.

The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary

 

[Bones]

The FDA chose to pair the e-cig with the Nicotrol product designed to be a cessation device. The e-cig is a smoking alternative, not a cessation device. It is obvious that NRT, which produces no vapor/smoke, will have less additives and constituents than a smoking alternative. So what exactly was the point of the study? NRT marketing???

:

Yea well they actually did us a favor with that - The e-cig tests as being on par with the Nicotrol - Exposing the Hypocrisy of their actions - Look at what Illistrated posted - The e-cig is no more harmful than the NRT - Depending on the math - LESS -

 

[katzndawgs]

All I can say is that since I quit smoking and started vaping, my lungs are clear, I no longer cough up "oysters", I'm no longer "short of breath", and I no longer wake the Hub up in the middle of the night hacking and gagging. My husband is a physician and he is very much in favor of vaping as a much safer alternative to smoking!

 

[Vista Chris]

Great info, thanks! The link below is to a forum is run by a professor at Boston University, Dr Siegel. He used to be a tobacco control advocate until he saw the antics of his peers and opted out. The Doc is an e-cig advocate and has great contacts.

The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary

This is all great stuff. I am trying to get it into bite size pieces for easier distribution and reading. Everyone needs to read this!

Please help share, you can find the pieces here: tobaccoanalysys

 

[Kent C]

I am disturbed that that one ingredient was in the SE cartridge as there was no need for it to be in there at all. But then again, only regulation and oversight is going to stop that.

Sun

Widespread news that it was SE would also stop it and if there is no ban, SE has got some work to do to regain any consumer confidence.
Consumer Reports - when it wasn't so biased, did a lot more in shaping the safety of some products than any regulation. (athough some regulation was a direct result of Consumer Reports analysis).

UL listings is another thing consumers look for in order to judge the safety of electrical products. UL is a private company.

In many instances, gov't regulation is a result of lobbying firms to get gov't to favor their companies rather than 'safety or consumer concerns'. It (favoritism) has also been the impetus in the creation of many of the 3 and 4 letter agencies. The ICC was initially manned by former railroad execs that favored railroads over the trucking industry - their 'plea' was for 'fair shipping rates'. Once trucking got more business and bigger, some ex-truckers were appointed to the board. Then the railroaders and truckers conspired against the barge companies etc. etc.

 

[CArtVapr]

Although we saw it coming, I just am shocked, didn't think it would happen like this. It's one thing to regulate, tax, but to manipulate the public and ultimately ban is horrible. I've got a group of friends who are just waiting for me to give them the full demo of E-cigs before they buy, and now I'm thinking some of them won't want to deal with such a fight. Why would anyone want to get involved with the E-cig with such confusion and problems that come with it. Even if they like it and want to buy, sounds like there will be issues. I now am beginning to regret unfortunately promoting this site to possible newbies, cause I know as soon as they start reading on, they will be convinced it's not worth buying in to it. The 100.00 buy-in for the full setup with e-liquid would be looked at like an unrealistic toy, not a true necessity. I'm full in now and could care less about regular cigs, I'd rather brew my own e-liquid and or go to Tijuana, or the local dark drug selling park, than smoke regulars again. There's a lot of us, but just not enough yet. It just began to spread like wildfire, so many people want it that I have met and shared it with and now, I'll be just the rare one with the strange device that people think is not any better than real cigs - what a bunch of crap.
There's still a long way to go and hopefully the companies will regulate their own, test, prove, people will fight the court, get on the news and tell the real story. Maybe it's just what we need to get it across to multi millions more people with the controversy.
I know I for one will make up my own cards and pass them out to all smokers, or people who are curious, telling them what's up - AINT GOING TO STAND FOR THIS SH*T !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol

 

[Vista Chris]

Why would anyone want to get involved with the E-cig with such confusion and problems that come with it.

It's really not that confusing. There is what the FDA says, and then there are the facts.

We are trying to make sure that they are placed side by side in the most clear manner possible for anyone interested.

The FDA is smearing the issue into "save the children, carcinogens, nicotine gum works, chantix is approved, flavors are for kids, noone knows what's in the vapor, these aren't approved like our diet pills are (that we need to use after eating fast food burgers that are considered SAFE?!?!)

In fact, in my opinion 99.99999% of the confusion with ecigs is directly related to the FDA's involvement. Confusion, smearing and twisting of the facts is their only hope in this one. Don't give in.

 

[eric]

Preach it, brother.

 

[CArtVapr]

It's really not that confusing. There is what the FDA says, and then there are the facts.

We are trying to make sure that they are placed side by side in the most clear manner possible for anyone interested.

The FDA is smearing the issue into "save the children, carcinogens, nicotine gum works, chantix is approved, flavors are for kids, noone knows what's in the vapor, these aren't approved like our diet pills are (that we need to use after eating fast food burgers that are considered SAFE?!?!)

In fact, in my opinion 99.99999% of the confusion with ecigs is directly related to the FDA's involvement. Confusion, smearing and twisting of the facts is their only hope in this one. Don't give in.

Yep of course, it's unfortunate - I will also do my best to educate people of the truth, and look forward for more proof to back up my statements, e-cig is safer ( or safe ).. 1%, bla bla bla, it still might be a completely safe alternative. It obviously is SAFER than regular cigs. Will see what happens, the advertising to children aspect is the most troubling and rediculous, if they were so concerned they would take the candy smoking bubble gum cigarettes off the market - I've seen them recently. My niece can buy a pack of bubble gum cigs and puff a smoke before chewing the gum, wow... Ugg

 

[jimik]

I should be receiving my first e-cig in the mail today and already it looks like vaporizing nicotine is about to get the ban bat.

It is nice that the FDA is checking up on this stuff, I am all for knowing what I am putting in my body. That said, I can't help but feeling this is going to lead to a complete ban on e-cigs. I hope that they do put some regulations up, make it as safe as possible but at the same time allow us to make the ultimate decision regarding if we wish to use them or not.

 

[EdensDaddy]

Amen cvapure. As someone who is still awaiting his first ecig and seeing these scares about their content I still say compare this analysis to those of an analog. Compare ppb to ppm which means multiply by 1000 to ppm to come up with fair numbers. It all comes down to money. Always. No matter how you look at it. The tobacco industry has their hands in the smoking cessation programs. Has anyone else bought a pack which included a "want to quit?" fold out with cessation propaganda? I certanly have. They are scared to death that the population is being introduced to a method of delivery in which they have absolutely no control over. They want to squash it while it is still fresh... Don't let them. I am not sure if it will help or not but there is a petition on truesmokers dot com and if anyone knows of any other activist groups feel free to post. Stand strong, increase our numbers, and we will prevail

 

[Vista Chris]

Now that it's 2am and i'm on a tyrade tonight , I will proceed to sum up how I view my experience with the communication between the ecig community, the public, and the FDA:

Vaper: Hey, check this out! I cut my smoking in half the first day I tried this!

FDA: But can you prove it's safe?

Vaper: Well they've been around for a few years, and no ones become seriously ill or died.

FDA: Ok, now prove they're safe.

Vaper: Well I've had mine for a week now, and smoked maybe 3 analogs. That's 140 analogs I didn't smoke! And I didn't kill anyone in the process! yay me!

FDA: Yea but they aren't proven safe.

Vaper: Well I feel better, at least better then I did when I was on chantix... I mean, I got really depressed, even suicidal...

FDA: This isn't about chantix, we're banning ecigs. Stay on topic.

Vaper: Well there are thousands of people using this, I would go as far as saying tens of thousands, and only mild side effects have been reported. They seem to be the only thing NOT making me overweight, or depressed, or stressed, or ill, or anything else.

FDA: Well until you prove them safe we're telling the public their children are in danger and should run away from you if they see you. Thanks for your concern.

Public: huh?

The end.

(bedtime for me )