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I guess I was thinking more about speaking the explanation rather than printing it... momentarily forgot the topic
I'll just go lurk now
Why? It's ok to digress. And it's not much of a digression anyway. If the explanation is too long for a brief conversation, it sure won't fit on a card.
humm, think about this also: The concentration of whatever components are in the e-liquid, in inhaled vapor is likely to be very small, because with each puff only a minute quantity of e-liquid will be vaporized, and greatly diluted by inhaled air.
Now in exhaled vapor, things are even more diluted, because we all "lose" a lot of water in our natural breathing.
... and even in inhaled vapor, there's probably a large percentage of water because of PG's water retaining properties.
Now, do you want to write that in a small card, or just say "water vapor"?
Now in exhaled vapor, things are even more diluted, because we all "lose" a lot of water in our natural breathing.
... and even in inhaled vapor, there's probably a large percentage of water because of PG's water retaining properties.
Now, do you want to write that in a small card, or just say "water vapor"?
humm, think about this also: The concentration of whatever components are in the e-liquid, in inhaled vapor is likely to be very small, because with each puff only a minute quantity of e-liquid will be vaporized, and greatly diluted by inhaled air.
Now in exhaled vapor, things are even more diluted, because we all "lose" a lot of water in our natural breathing.
... and even in inhaled vapor, there's probably a large percentage of water because of PG's water retaining properties.
Now, do you want to write that in a small card, or just say "water vapor"?
Again though, the analysis you linked to dealt with UN-inhaled vapor. And a non-standard composition liquid. And even the poster you linked to said the testing methods were flawed and probably wrong.
In the end, unless there is some remarkable chemical change going on somewhere, the vapor will be composed of the same components as the liquid.
I'd really like to see two versions. The "it's not a cig" defense/explanation card, and a second "Glad you're interested" sales/website card. Should free up space for each purpose, and I'd like to have one that was most appropriate to each situation I expect to be facing.
I think this is an important subject for all of us vapers and ex-smokers.
It's unfortunate there aren't more studies on this available.
You are right about the components of the vapor being the ones on the e-liquid, because unlike in a cigarette, there's no combustion, and so no chemical changes.
But it's precisely for that same reason that the concentration of those components in the actual vapor is very reduced. Most of what you inhale is just air.
And as I said, even more so in exhaled vapor.
It's unfortunate there aren't more studies on this available.
You are right about the components of the vapor being the ones on the e-liquid, because unlike in a cigarette, there's no combustion, and so no chemical changes.
But it's precisely for that same reason that the concentration of those components in the actual vapor is very reduced. Most of what you inhale is just air.
And as I said, even more so in exhaled vapor.
Well, true. But that's kind of missing the point. When someone asks what's in the vapor, they're not asking about the air the vapor is diluted in.
If you put it like that, sure, but would that be relevant?
Imagine for a moment that in the e-liquid is pure PG, and that, in what you inhale/exhale, the relative quantity of PG was 1 part for each gazilion parts of "air".
Would you say: the vapor is composed of 100% PG?
I would say: the vapor is composed of "air" (with negligible traces of PG.)
Imagine for a moment that in the e-liquid is pure PG, and that, in what you inhale/exhale, the relative quantity of PG was 1 part for each gazilion parts of "air".
Would you say: the vapor is composed of 100% PG?
I would say: the vapor is composed of "air" (with negligible traces of PG.)
but its not just air.
vapour or vapor (ˈveɪpə)
— n
1. particles of moisture or other substance suspended in air and visible as clouds, smoke, etc
vapour or vapor (ˈveɪpə)
— n
1. particles of moisture or other substance suspended in air and visible as clouds, smoke, etc
Sorry, pmos, I don't mean to be argumentative with you, but no I wouldn't say that. Because it's ducking the point of the question. And we don't need to duck it. People who don't know what our vapor is made of have a legitimate question, and we don't need to evade it. We just need a simple, easy way to explain it. That's a challenge , but the answer to that challenge is not to deflect it by trying to just call it "air". And let's face it, if you blow a puff of MaxxFusion vapor in someone's face, no one's going to buy it if you try to tell them it's just air, will they?
what would be the proper approach? To have someone analyse what is exhaled? I'm in no way being argumentative just wondering the best way to end this argument.
Of course not. The 1 part per gazilion parts was just an exaggeration of the argument. The vapor is definitely not "air", and I wouldn't advise anyone to say that.On the other side, exhaled "air" is completely saturated with water. It has a relatively humidity of 100% (you can look it up).
So, the vapor that you see, is definitely composed of a lot of water.
The water comes from your body, as part of the breathing mechanism.
I suppose it will eventually come to that, and that will beneficial to all (like most info), but if exhaled vapor had a large concentration of anything harmful I'm sure we would already know.
There are a lot of people trying very hard to find some argument just like that to ban e-cigs at this time.
Just imagine: 2nd hand vapor as a hazard.
oh I agree pmos, its bad enough that people here in the states are crying that the PG is antifreeze and causes cancer.
Which is why the IVAQS research is so important, to answer definitively the question of second hand vapor.
But in the meantime, I just think it will be better to describe it as vapor, but not make false statements like it being 99% water vapor.
But in the meantime, I just think it will be better to describe it as vapor, but not make false statements like it being 99% water vapor.
You know what kind of guy I am? I'm the kind of guy who actually does look stuff up when someone says "you can look it up."
On the other side, exhaled "air" is completely saturated with water. It has a relatively humidity of 100% (you can look it up).
So, the vapor that you see, is definitely composed of a lot of water.
The water comes from your body, as part of the breathing mechanism.
Air Temperatures in Respiratory Tracts of Resting Subjects in Cold
"100 per cent relative humidity of expired air occurs only when the ambient air is hot and humid. Under other conditions expired air humidity is always less than 100 per cent."
But to me that's a moot point, because including the moisture of your breath as part of the e-cig vapor would be deceptive. The question is about the vapor, not your breath. Yes, you are breathing out air, and with it water vapor, along with the e-cig vapor. But the person asking youbwhat's in the vapor isn'r asking you about the normal products of exhalation, they are only asking about the vapor from the e-cig. Confusing the issue by including your normal breath is deceptive.
Gosh, I hope you pressure those Chinese engineers with half as much doubts
Better believe I do!
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