Formaldehyde in Juice?

[Zakillah]

Not saying you are wrong, but can you provide a link or a shred of evidence of this study?

Old clearo?

That doesn't sound like any legitimate scientific study I've ever heard.

Here is a summary; cant find a link to the full paper right now.
Carbonyl Compounds in Electronic Cigarette Vapors: Effects of Nicotine Solvent and Battery Output Voltage

By "old clearo" I just ment that it sure cant handle over 4V without running dry; I dont recall which exact model they used.

 

[Alien Traveler]

Formaldehyde is a product of decomposition of PG/VG at a high temperature regardless of the wick material..no?

Yes.

 

[Alien Traveler]

Victor--just to be clear--formaldehyde Is NOT a byproduct of burning PG or VG at high temperatures!!

How so? Links?

 

[Spidey2011]

Understood. But you can get dry hit at low temperatures, and that's only an indication that wick is dry. But it doesn't mean that you inhaled formaldehyde.


Confused. Than it's byproduct of what?

Right. but you COULD theoretically have inhaled some from the burning wick. Doesnt mean you did. Even if you did, its such a minuscule amount and it's not likely that you're going to keep vaping that burning wick, so the side effects are negligible.

 

[Bad Ninja]

Here is a summary; cant find a link to the full paper right now.
Carbonyl Compounds in Electronic Cigarette Vapors: Effects of Nicotine Solvent and Battery Output Voltage

By "old clearo" I just ment that it sure cant handle over 4V without running dry; I dont recall which exact model they used.

Bad link.
Doesn't work.

 

[VictorC]

Right. but you COULD theoretically have inhaled some from the burning wick. Doesnt mean you did. Even if you did, its such a minuscule amount and it's not likely that you're going to keep vaping that burning wick, so the side effects are negligible.

Agreed. I just don't understand how the dry wick (with no PG/VG) can produce any formaldehyde at all.

 

[Robino1]

Bad link.
Doesn't work.

I broke link. It is the same that has been posted and broken many times. The same that Dr. F. disputed as to how they came up with the formaldehyde to begin with.

Trying to capture the link that leads to Dr. F's rebuttal to the formaldehyde.... Spinning wheels.... Ugh.

ps: just rebuild link in your browser

 

[Train2]

It's not dry dry, it's just too dry.

You've had a "dry hit" - a "burnt hit" right?
It's nasty, you spit it out, you didn't do something right...

See, WE can tell instantly "Dry hit = bad".

Someone did a study abusing crappy e-cigs, testing the "vapor" over 5 volts on a setup meant to run under 4. And guess what? They figured out "dry hit = bad".

The wick can't keep up, the coil isn't wet enough so it gets too hot, the juice "burns" - we call it that but it's not like in flames. It's also clearly not inahale-able.

So, to be safe, if your wick is too dry and you start to get a hit that's disgusting, burning, nasty - well, um..... don't do that. It's bad for you, there's a study.

Agreed. I just don't understand how the dry wick (with no PG/VG) can produce any formaldehyde at all.

 

[Robino1]

PLEASE READ! Breaking Links to Junk Science and Other Rubbish Posts | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[skoony]

Agreed. I just don't understand how the dry wick (with no PG/VG) can produce any formaldehyde at all.

its not that the wick is dry.the water content becomes to low
to effectively atomize the base mix so it will thicken up and
cook on the coil.
mike

 

[Robino1]

Found Dr. F's rebuttal: Verified: formaldehyde levels found in the NEJM study were associated with dry puff conditions. An update

 

[VictorC]

its not that the wick is dry.the water content becomes to low
to effectively atomize the base mix so it will thicken up and
cook on the coil.
mike

Aha...that explains. Thanks.

 

[RandyF]

I always enjoy these threads where all of the ex-smokers, who inhaled thousands of chemicals and multiple carcinogens for years, start over analyzing every singe ingredient in our e-juice. Where were all these arm-chair scientists when we were smoking??

 

[Alien Traveler]

I have checked with my coils - at 12 W (during dry burn, i.e. no wick, no liquid) coils have temperature about 1800F, close to melting point of iron. When vaping coils are cooled with boiling juice delivered through wick to temperature somewhere in between of boiling tempearture PG and VG, i.e. between 370 and 554 F. Dry hit means there is not enough liquid to cool coils and temperature may jump much higher than safe level and burn remnants of juice and wicks, providing not only unpleasant experience but some unpleasant stuff also. Fortunately after dry hit nobody will continue to vape at the same conditions, so amount of produced bad stuff is minuscule and not dangerous.

 

[Alien Traveler]

its not that the wick is dry.the water content becomes to low
to effectively atomize the base mix so it will thicken up and
cook on the coil.
mike

you are again about non-existent water...

 

[Pmwaker]

I'm not a chemist, but I don't see how there could be formaldehyde in the juice unless the manufacturer is putting it in there on purpose or you're melting your setup and inhaling the fumes.

formaldehyde and acetaldehyde are actually formed by the combustion of propylene glycol and glycerin respectively. However, like someone said before, you're not actually going to be able to vape at the levels that produce significant amounts of these two chemicals. Even on the high wattage systems, formaldehyde isn't produced much because the coils can take that much heat. You'd know when formaldehyde is being produced because you would end up burning your atomizer to get it.

 

[tj99959]

VictorC said: ↑
Understood. But you can get dry hit at low temperatures, and that's only an indication that wick is dry. But it doesn't mean that you inhaled formaldehyde.

Disagree:
The temp will not remain low.
For example we have been doing dry burns to clean coils forever, even back in the 3 ohms @ 3.7v days. The tungsten filiment in a flashlight glows white hot @ one volt. (no juice to keep it cool)

Fact is that the folks trying to get every last pennies worth out of their over priced little disposables are the ones most likely to experience those high temp dry hits.

 

[GinnyTx]

Thrasher I had to quit vaping the Worcestershire ..I'd always want a steak with it

..but you're right..I make my own if I can..sometimes I cheat with Lee & Perrins..but it's not hard to do..and a bottle will last a couple months in the 'fridge.

• 1/2 cup malt vinegar
• 1/2 cup apple cider vinegar
• 1/2 cup blackstrap molasses
• 1/4 cup naturally fermented fish sauce (find it here)
• 2 tablespoons tamarind paste
• 1 tablespoon naturally fermented soy sauce
• 3 tablespoons onion juice, or 1 teaspoon dehydrated onion
• 1 teaspoon ground black pepper
• 1/2 teaspoon cinnamon
• 1/2 teaspoon ground cloves
• 1/4 teaspoon cayenne pepper
• 2 tablespoons olive oil
• 2 shallots, finely minced
• 4 cloves garlic, finely minced
• 1 teaspoon freshly grated ginger
• 8 anchovies, minced
• Juice of 1 lime

I think we've all polluted our bodies ENOUGH and often really didn't know better..hence the concern.
Signed an ex smoker that believes it's never too late

 

[AndriaD]

I think we've all polluted our bodies ENOUGH and often really didn't know better..hence the concern.
Signed an ex smoker that believes it's never too late

I agree, Ginny; I think the main concern we have is that we switched to vaping because it's safer than smoking, so it's important to keep it actually safer, as safe as possible. There's nothing on planet earth that's 100% safe for 100% of everybody, but we do our best to keep it as much safer than smoking as we can. There's something really wrong with the grammar in that last sentence, but I be durned if I can find it.

Andria

 

[Robert Cromwell]

Formaldehyde is a product of decomposition of PG/VG at a high temperature regardless of the wick material..no?

Yep.