FDA Godshall interview exposes how FDA deeming reg bans nearly all e-cig, how vapers can fight back

[stevegmu]

Steve,your girl friend analogy keeps growing in scope every
time you repeat it. if you are concerned bring her to a hospital.
bip gippers video is pure hyperbole.
you should know better.
regards
mike

Really? Lets see some links? I have always stated my ex girlfriend started sneezing after vaping a while around her, so I vaped in my vape room... It also makes my friend Pet'ulka's asthma worse, if she is having asthma issues.
Maybe she can dedicate her life to have vaping banned and be a hero to some also...
Fact is the anti vaping crowd is having such an easy time of it because some people and organizations laid the groundwork for them, albeit for cigarettes, but many see e-cigs as no different...

I also don't buy anyone being allergic to cigarette smoke also...

 

[skoony]

Really? Lets see some links? I have always stated my ex girlfriend started sneezing after vaping a while around her, so I vaped in my vape room...
Maybe she can dedicate her life to have vaping banned and be a hero to some also...
Fact is the anti vaping crowd is having such an easy time of it because some people and organizations laid the groundwork for them, albeit for cigarettes, but many see e-cigs as no different...

do you not know your own link history.
you supply the links.
also supply the medical prognosis that it is vaping causing her
sneezing.
also provide a written verifiable notarized statement by her,(your girlfriend)
stating your vapor makes her sneeze.
do you know what makes people i know sneeze?
barn yards.
regards
mike

 

[stevegmu]

do you not know your own link history.
you supply the links.
also supply the medical prognosis that it is vaping causing her
sneezing.
also provide a written verifiable notarized statement by her,(your girlfriend)
stating your vapor makes her sneeze.
do you know what makes people i know sneeze?
barn yards.
regards
mike

You made the accusation...
Barn yards should be banned. Maybe I'll make a living out of my hatred for barnyards...

 

[skoony]

You made the accusation...
Plenty of people cherish, defend and blindly follow dictators all the time. I used to be in the Midtown Q Group back in the day. I know how it is...

after reading your posts for almost two years it is apparent
you take two or three and,sometimes four sides of any debate.
you are getting a little more consistent lately.
regards
mike

 

[stevegmu]

after reading your posts for almost two years it is apparent
you take two or three and,sometimes four sides of any debate.
you are getting a little more consistent lately.
regards
mike

I know a thing or two about cults of personality...

 

[skoony]

I know a thing or two about cults...

been there done that?

you apparently know a lot about Prague too.
mike

 

[stevegmu]

been there done that?
mike

Yeah, years and years ago when I lived in DC I was recruited into the Midtown Q Group...

I don't see much of a difference between cults and anti groups, except the anti groups spread their message far beyond the cult...

 

[skoony]

Yeah, years and years ago when I lived in DC I was recruited into the Midtown Q Group...

and that means what to me?
if you have about 40 years i will bring you up to speed about my life.
regards
mike

 

[stevegmu]

and that means what to me?
if you have about 40 years i will bring you up to speed about my life.
regards
mike

I don't see much of a difference between cults and anti groups, except the anti groups spread their message far beyond the cult...

 

[Jman8]

when we see the deeming regs' we will both know.
all i am saying is as of right now the smoking issues are
dead,buried and,gone in the public's eye,the governments eye and,
any one who is paying attentions eye.
i am not saying this is good,right or,proper.

I disagree on the smoking issues being dead and buried. I can't deny that from smoker's perspective they are greatly curtailed.

Because they are greatly curtailed, and there isn't much backlash, I think vaping will follow similar path, but with more backlash.

the fight we are in now will forever define the power and reach of the government.
if we loose this,and what i mean by lose is having everything after 2007 regulated
out of existence its over for everybody.

I don't see that happening. I think it is possible, but unlikely.

I do think if everything up to 2050 were allowed on the market, but scrutinized / attacked by anti-vaping types, that it will eventually be a BV market in terms of manufacturing, and then local vape shops that are distributors of that (along with convenient stores for the BT versions of vape stuff).

we may think we are standing alone when in fact we are
all in this thing together.
the big trick is making us think we have separate causes.

regards
mike

Isn't this what I'm saying to you (and others) about the two causes?

If we lose the vape fight and your neighbor comes to you with an important cause to fight for, you could bring up vaping politics as reason you are reluctant to get involved and the neighbor could say, "oh that issue is dead, buried and gone. I'm talking about right now. If we lose this, we lose everything!"

IMO, thinking the smoking fight is done, makes me a lot less enthusiastic about fighting the vape fight. Fortunately current reality, with smoking being allowed on the legal market, tells me that fight is far from over.

It is clear from the way our adversaries fight us, that we are fighting the same two headed monster.

 

[stevegmu]

I don't see much of a difference between cults and anti groups, except the anti groups spread their message far beyond the cult...

Prague is a free country. They don't like the antis there...

 

[skoony]

I don't see much of a difference between cults and anti groups, except the anti groups spread their message far beyond the cult...

what cult?
are you referring to this mysterious Q deal.
let me take the opportunity to apologize.
you make the worlds most interesting man
boring.
regaRDS
MIKE

 

[skoony]

I disagree on the smoking issues being dead and buried. I can't deny that from smoker's perspective they are greatly curtailed.

Because they are greatly curtailed, and there isn't much backlash, I think vaping will follow similar path, but with more backlash.

from a practical point of view it is.
no media attention. no public attention. no political attention.
i am not saying the subject wont come up at a future time.
what i am saying is you can't fight two separate wars.
the war right now is to keep vaping out of the tobacco control
camp. the evidence is clearly on our side.
if we split our resources and try to drag smoking back into
this we can not win at this time.
if we win this fight its not only smoking that will get a second
look. there are many questionable decisions that will see the light
of day again.
regards
mike

 

[Jman8]

from a practical point of view it is.
no media attention. no public attention. no political attention.

I very much disagree. The vaping fight is constantly highlighting the smoking fight. In fact, I find it very rare that it doesn't. Just go look at OP of this thread if you have some doubts about this.

Which is partially the point I'm raising. If we (anyone on our side) has to put smoking down to raise vaping up, then vaping is in for a world of hurt. Helps to know that anti-smoking data is propaganda, often based on lies and the opposite of free market principles.

i am not saying the subject wont come up at a future time.
what i am saying is you can't fight two separate wars.
the war right now is to keep vaping out of the tobacco control
camp. the evidence is clearly on our side.
if we split our resources and try to drag smoking back into
this we can not win at this time.
if we win this fight its not only smoking that will get a second
look. there are many questionable decisions that will see the light
of day again.
regards
mike

Well, when I'm convinced that vapers will never bring up smoking in a vaping fight, I may be able to see what you are saying about 2 separate causes. For sure our adversaries do it, and unless you are very new to the vape fight (which I know you are not), then I think you very much realize that we vapers bring up smoking, with regards to vaping on all days of the week that end in "y."

 

[skoony]

I very much disagree. The vaping fight is constantly highlighting the smoking fight. In fact, I find it very rare that it doesn't. Just go look at OP of this thread if you have some doubts about this.

Which is partially the point I'm raising. If we (anyone on our side) has to put smoking down to raise vaping up, then vaping is in for a world of hurt. Helps to know that anti-smoking data is propaganda, often based on lies and the opposite of free market principles.



Well, when I'm convinced that vapers will never bring up smoking in a vaping fight, I may be able to see what you are saying about 2 separate causes. For sure our adversaries do it, and unless you are very new to the vape fight (which I know you are not), then I think you very much realize that we vapers bring up smoking, with regards to vaping on all days of the week that end in "y."

your views are fair enough but,remember i smoked for 38 years straight.
two packs a day or more at the end.
no one is forgetting smokers.
anyone who has payed any attention know's 'they' are
using the same tactics over again. the same game plan.
for the most part the same players.
one of our greatest advantages is realizing its a different war.
the old rules need not apply.
we need not have to say you did the same thing when we were
smokers. we are not smokers now.
we are vapers.
we have to make them deal with us as vapers not,ex-smokers.
till this day after two years smoke free when i am at the bar
i still will go out side to stretch my legs and have a vape.
i have no need to do so as i can freely vape in the bar.
maybe its force of habit? maybe its because those people
outside are not smokers to me.
they are my friends.
regards
mike

 

[nicnik]

I've just about had it with all of them.

Andria

Brace yourself, it could get worse. If the FDA deeming goes through, I'm looking forwrd to seeing what you have to say about them, then.

 

[AndriaD]

Brace yourself, it could get worse. If the FDA deeming goes through, I'm looking forwrd to seeing what you have to say about them, then.

Much the same, only MORE vituperatively.

Andria

 

[Kent C]

I'd like to see this translated from Libertarian to Liberal. You'd probably say it couldn't be done, but I think it could.

Not sure what it is you didn't get. I'll PM you.

 

[Kent C]

But I haven't advocated for eliminating stupid either.

Although I think Darwin might not object to such an idea.

Actually Darwin wouldn't be that concerned - he'd figure no need to co-opt nature, it will take it's course

 

[Sirius]

In order to 'deem', one must have a target for deeming/redefinition. In the case of ecigs, the target is cigarettes. And the only reason for that is what the anti-smoking advocates have done to that industry where it has become a given to demonize, tax, and regulate. Were it not for the cigarette, then, to what could they deem ecigs? This is guilt by association - and an association that makes no sense in terms of associating the harm perceived by some with cigarettes vs. the reduction of harm from cigarettes.

Vaping looks like smoking. Don't you know how this PC policed country works? If it offends it must be banned. And if this socialist government can get us to throw money at our problems to make them go away. They will see to it that we follow their examples.
[emoji6]

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