FDA Godshall interview exposes how FDA deeming reg bans nearly all e-cig, how vapers can fight back
- Thread starter Bill Godshall
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Better than most. My questions were to make a rhetorical and real point. I wasn't just 'wondering' lol...
I didn't mean that question to be directed to Jman. I'm gonna look for that info. I think someone on some thread posted a link about the study. I don't remeber if I clicked on it or threw up on it.
I found this so far. Gotta break the link, though:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/07/150708111015.htm
I was already aware that they can't be bothered to include the cost savings from premature death when they make these calculations, but I didn't realize they might go so far as including lost productivity from premature death, anyway. It's like they're working with a calculator that has no subtract function. Funny way to do economics.
So that's healthcare costs. Not fair to not use all costs and savings to justify taxing the cost to society.
We got away with not paying nearly enough tax all these years, would be the implication. Fuel for people to support taxing the hell out of all those former smokers turned vapers.
I don't recall anyone from the gov't showing up at the hospital offering to pay my dad's final expenses. And my mom's expenses for her COPD were covered by her private insurance, not the gov't. I'm wondering, if I finally kick the bucket due to COPD or lung cancer, is the gov't going to pay those bills?
Andria
They assume smokers sneak out of work every hour for 10 minutes to
have a smoke. They multiply this assumed 80 minute period by the average
wage to get a cost. They then call this a healthcare cost/lost productivity
cost and want a tax equal to this amount.
have a smoke. They multiply this assumed 80 minute period by the average
wage to get a cost. They then call this a healthcare cost/lost productivity
cost and want a tax equal to this amount.
With similar sleigh of hand I could make the "healthcare costs" of
each cup of coffee equal $11. Every bathroom break could cost
$7. Every bagel with cheese would be $5. A bagel without cheese
would be $4.37
each cup of coffee equal $11. Every bathroom break could cost
$7. Every bagel with cheese would be $5. A bagel without cheese
would be $4.37
Really? Is that from that study Bill linked to, or from somewhere else? I only glanced at that study.
So, then businesses are forced to force employees to take breaks if they want to smoke, and the government makes the smokers pay for it, and of course that money then goes directly to the employer who lost it, rather than to subsidize corn growing.
I don't understand where the 80 minute thing comes from.
Sure, why not fan the flames of the carbs vs fats wars in the process? Sounds like fun.
The latest word is, it doesn't really matter if you go low/no carb or low/no fat, as long as you reduce calories.
If I was getting billions of dollars a year from my unbalanced accounting
I would continue on and call anyone who complained about it bad names.
I would continue on and call anyone who complained about it bad names.
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Unintended consequences. They occur every single time government steps in to "fix" someone's perceived problem.
The "latest word" study that's making the rounds in the press right now is akin comparing the efficacy of nic patches with vaping in a lab, where none of the subjects have access to combustible tobacco. Such a study would conclude that both are equally effective. In the case of diets, a calorie is indeed a calorie, and this can readily be demonstrated by locking people in a lab for many weeks, where they are literally unable to cheat on their diets. But in the real world, the body metabolizes carbs much more quickly than fats, meaning you'll get hungry again much faster after consuming some number of calories of carbs than you would if you consumed the same number of calories in the form of fat. This makes the low-carb diet a much more effective tool in the real world, just like vaping is more effective than patches in the real world.
Yeah, I was mostly joking with that tidbit. There is a difference between effective at losing weight and effective at keeping you on a diet. The second is more complex and would have to account for personal preferences. A bit like THR actually, whether you vape or use ST, as long as you don't smoke. If you're someone who can't give up carbs but can otherwise restrict your caloric intake, you should lose weight.
As is often the case with people, there isn't one answer that is best for all.
The fight against smoking has run out of steam for sure. Who has an incentive any more? The smokers aren't stinking up the world of non-smokers. Non-smokers can go to a hotel or to work or pretty much anywhere else without having to breath stale smoke, so they don't have anything to get upset about. The politicians want to keep smoking going and collect the taxes. Corporations likewise. The only people still pushing to abolish smoking are the ideological zealots, and without the support of the politicians they aren't going anywhere.
The players in the vaping game are very different. The politicians and corporations want to get rid of it for financial reasons, as opposed to wanting to keep smoking around for financial reasons. The zealots see a new exciting cause to go for. Lies and propaganda are running rampant. But non-smokers have no skin in the game, nothing to gain or lose whatever the outcome, so no reason to get involved.
I know we disagree about the badness of smoking. But I think the one thing in our favour is that we have a better case than the smokers did. Last month I stepped back into the past on vacation and stayed in a smoking hotel. It used to be like that everywhere. After that experience I'm pretty sure smokers will never get to come back in from the cold. People might be offended by a stray whiff of blueberry, but it's not in the same league.
Well then, since I don't have a job, I guess I'm not costing them anything! Even when I smoked! Hah! (which I knew already, that I wasn't costing them anything.)
Andria
Except for those of us with gallstones. Some fat I can handle, but very VERY little cholesterol; I guess the bile ducts are blocked by the stones.
Andria
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