Help with safety concerns regarding high wattage devices

[Imfallen_Angel]

The same reason some people drive a 500 horsepower sports car to work while others drive a prius. People prefer different things. Simple as that.what works for you may not work for somoeone else. What works for someone else may not work for you.

On my side of this question, I'm not talking about preference, I'm curious to the difference in the experience.

For example (as I said above), I just got some drippers, one was preloaded with a VERY heavy/thick coil that at 60W, it was barely getting hot, while with my NI200, at 30W was instant heat. I understand that had I have a 150 or 200W mod, that thick coil would have probably light up like a Christmas tree, but... my question is, how different would the vape itself be different? The liquid is being vaporized, the surface of the coils going from a few (maybe 4 or 5) rolls of thick wire, opposed to a lot of rolls from the much thinner gauge would probably by in favor of the 18 rolls.

As Tommy said (up) that the only real difference is the power needed and the thick coil takes a lot longer to heat up and cool down... but is there nothing else to it?

I don't see why you guys are getting a bit abrasive about the question as per Lynn's post is simply asking the "why" the need to more and more watts...

Having a 500 HP car on a highway that you can't go over 70mph, isn't going to get you there faster, but will burn a lot more gas... and being heavier for the larger engine, a smaller finely tuned car with 200HP could easily be able to get to the max speed a lot faster.

 

[Tommy-Chi]

On my side of this question, I'm not talking about preference, I'm curious to the difference in the experience.

For example (as I said above), I just got some drippers, one was preloaded with a VERY heavy/thick coil that at 60W, it was barely getting hot, while with my NI200, at 30W was instant heat. I understand that had I have a 150 or 200W mod, that thick coil would have probably light up like a Christmas tree, but... my question is, how different would the vape itself be different? The liquid is being vaporized, the surface of the coils going from a few (maybe 4 or 5) rolls of thick wire, opposed to a lot of rolls from the much thinner gauge would probably by in favor of the 18 rolls.

As Tommy said (up) that the only real difference is the power needed and the thick coil takes a lot longer to heat up and cool down... but is there nothing else to it?

I don't see why you guys are getting rude about the question as per Lynn's post is simply asking the "why" the need to more and more watts...

Ahhhh! I was only responding in kind, and her initial statement seemed off putting. I've been on here since September 2015, and lurked for many months before that. I see ppl chew ea other up over how many watts others vape at so I avoid threads where the arguments are typically ongoing. Why, Why, Why, intrude or stoop to denigrating name calling when the other persons happiness is involved.

More watts equals more juice consumption, more satisfying vape (it's only hotter if you do not know what you're doing), far more vaporization of the e-liquid consumed (for better nic hit, and robust clouds).

Compare 10W to 50W. The gains seen are similar in magnitude to going from 50W to 200W. Everything is relative as long as everything can be tuned.

Don't forget that a mod that can vape at 200W can also vape at 10W/20W/40W/... so there is no limit as to the flexibility of the unit.

 

[speedy_r6]

On my side of this question, I'm not talking about preference, I'm curious to the difference in the experience.

For example (as I said above), I just got some drippers, one was preloaded with a VERY heavy/thick coil that at 60W, it was barely getting hot, while with my NI200, at 30W was instant heat. I understand that had I have a 150 or 200W mod, that thick coil would have probably light up like a Christmas tree, but... my question is, how different would the vape itself be different? The liquid is being vaporized, the surface of the coils going from a few (maybe 4 or 5) rolls of thick wire, opposed to a lot of rolls from the much thinner gauge would probably by in favor of the 18 rolls.

As Tommy said (up) that the only real difference is the power needed and the thick coil takes a lot longer to heat up and cool down... but is there nothing else to it?

I don't see why you guys are getting a bit abrasive about the question as per Lynn's post is simply asking the "why" the need to more and more watts...

Having a 500 HP car on a highway that you can't go over 70mph, isn't going to get you there faster, but will burn a lot more gas... and being heavier for the larger engine, a smaller finely tuned car with 200HP could easily be able to get to the max speed a lot faster.

I was mostly posting in regards to her question as follows:

I really don't understand why people need 20/40/50/100/200/300 watts to quit smoking. Is this a game? If so it is rather silly. More of an obsession.

The reason why people do it is the same as why they want a 500 horsepower car on a highway that they can go just as fast on with a 1980s 70hp econobox. People have different preferences. With thicker wire, you can get bigger clouds, so long as you know what you are doing. End of story. With your thin gauge wire, you risk overheating it if the liquid vaporizes too fast. With the thicker wire, it heats up slower, but due to so much more surface area, puts off more vapor(as well as having more surface area to be cooled by fresh liquid from the wick). It is really something hard to describe until you try it and either find out you like it, or it isn't for you. As I said earlier, some people get their kicks from being a tootle puffer(the 70 hp econobox out for a sunday drive). Other people get their kicks from going for huge, dense clouds(the 500hp sports car at the drag strip). Others want somewhere in the middle and go for a moderately powered build that doesn't give monster clouds, but gives them what they want(the 200 horsepower tuned car out hooning at an autocross event).

People just enjoy different things. I have tried everything from 5 watts to 250 watts. Personally, my sweet spot is around 110 watts. I like the warm, dense vapor that I get with higher power. I like the way it feels filling my lungs. Using higher power, I can heat up that larger coil in an instant and be happy. Vaping at low power doesn't really do much of anything for me. For others, vaping at high wattages and getting dense clouds causes throat irritation and they find it uncomfortable, but absolutely enjoy the pleasure they get from tootle puffing all day long.

I wasn't trying to be rude about it(though I did think Lynn's comment calling people who want to vape at higher wattages "silly" was a little rude). I was just trying to explain that everyone has a different preference. At the end of the day, live and let live. We are all in this together.

 

[sawlight]

Tommy and I have gone around a bit before, I don't see the need for that much power. But as he started to state, as long as you have a good way to feed the juice and plenty of air flow, it works fine. I don't feel the need for huge clouds and I'm a miser with my juice.
I've got a friend that mainly just drips, mainly runs mechs and most of his builds are around .2 ohms. It works for him, fine. But he's also normally got a 100ml bottle of juice in his pocket to feed the silly thing! He works at a vape shop and gets gear and juice for a steal.
I use NET juice, I'm broke as a joke and have to count my pennies. I also like a tighter draw, I can do lung hits, but I like replicating a cig so it's an easier conversion for ME.
As said, different strokes for different folks. If you can afford the toys, afford to feed it and like it, go for it. I'm just now starting to get up to 30w using TC, but that works for me. No one is wrong here.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Thanks for the replies... it's my scientific mind that's really interested in this and enjoying your feedback quite much.

So on the scientific side, doesn't the liquid evaporate at the same temperature anyways... so slower to get there with the larger gauge, where the need for the wattage... as far as surface, having 5 rolls of thick, opposed to 20 rolls, doesn't it balance it out? Possibly let more space between them to let more liquid get vaporized?

I've been reading a lot, and overall, it's hard to have a conclusive answer.. as you guys are saying, it's a personal preference. Would it be possible that the big difference is due to the mech mods experience?

I stick to regulated, and found TC to be a much better experience (for myself) between using Kanthal, NI200 and Titanium, Kanthal is fine but no TC, find it that a good pull regardless of wattage, tends to go from cool to hot in an annoying way, TI is metallic to me, so I've stuck to NI200 and been quite happy with it.

That said, I've tried going from the full rainbow of the watt range, balancing the temp, and between everything, don't find much difference once I pass 35-45 W, but I know, this is most certainly due to me using TC.

But in terms of cloud production, of heat and flavour coming through, I've found that it's fairly darn great, I like my vape warm to a bit hot, the clouds I can make has made some cloud chasers look twice at my very "vanilla" mod/tank.

So it's all good all around.. I can understand people not understanding a few things, heck I have plenty of questions myself and enjoy learning (and just started diy liquids and got a few drippers...(loving my DeadModz!)) so I'm around to bug you guys...

Never though vaping would turn into this hobby, and aside a very few bad apples, the vaping crowd have been amazing!

If only vaping would become a political approach, we'd have world peace within a year!

 

[lynn508]

Sorry to offend you guys with the term silly. In my day it took a whole lot more than the word silly to offend people, but I'm not a special snowflake these days like a lot of others.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Sorry to offend you guys with the term silly. In my day it took a whole lot more than the word silly to offend people, but I'm not a special snowflake these days like a lot of others.

I've never considered the word "silly" as an insult, if anything, it's endearing to me... so

Heck, I got suspended in a forum (not this one) once over saying that I considered something asinine (and still do)... just my personal opinion on the subject, wasn't meant to offend, but the mod that suspended me took it waaaaaaaaaaaay too personal. It was ok for him and "his side" to rant about it and say that the "other side" was a bunch of things though. The worse part was the thread was a "open" thread about "what bugs you". I don't really go there all that much. Another forum, someone kept trying to "prove me wrong" over something really stupid (quality of plastic on a toy), and his buddy was a mod, and I ended up kicked out from that thread.

I guess some just get touchy about anything these days... but this is the internet, so take it with a grain of salt.

 

[speedy_r6]

I don't think anyone was offended. I just said that it was a little rude. To me, it seems kind of dumb to be pushing away a vapers who don't do exactly what you do when we should all be trying to stick together to push back against the FDA regs.

 

[lynn508]

I tend to state my piece and move on. I am all about sustainability, back years ago when people were buying cartos by the hundreds I couldn't understand the concept. People want easy and now look at the regs just out....how long would those cartos have worked unless you had a million. People couldn't understand that back then but I think they may have a clue lately.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

I tend to state my piece and move on. I am all about sustainability, back years ago when people were buying cartos by the hundreds I couldn't understand the concept. People want easy and now look at the regs just out....how long would those cartos have worked unless you had a million. People couldn't understand that back then but I think they may have a clue lately.

Well, you have to take in account that the earlier e-cigarettes were the pioneers. Many wanted something more, as even today, I know of people that get "duped" and get the little kits at crazy prices, then find that it doesn't work for them and they consider going back to cigarettes. (I blame greedy stores and lack of knowledge)

So I'm assuming that some of those that wanted (or needed) more, didn't have much of a selection and mech mods were born.

Fast forward a few years and now we have a huge selection (that grows every day) of regulated mods that can provide a decent vape that can satisfy most people.

The "old school" mech mod enthusiastic have years of experience and most have mastered the skills and knowledge that requires a dedication that newbies won't have, heck, I'm no newbie, but never had the interest or devotion required.

Sadly, many newbies go into vaping for cloud making for the "cool" factor only, not really proper reasons, and we end up with these types on the news when they short out their mods and boom it goes.

But that said... the wattage thing, I understand it to an extent, but consider it a hold off from older tech/approaches. I do consider the old school mech mods people I've known to be very intelligent and great people and if they can make it work for them and they do it safely, it's just fine. I just know that it's not for me, but that we are all on the same team.

I find that my experience with the reg. mods have been great, and switching to the sub-ohm gear has been a "game changer", so from my old gear where 12W was the standard, with my approach of TC and such, 35-45 is where I find what I'm happy with.

I've never tried a mod with over 60W capacity, I've seen them in action, etc. and I see it as a balancing thing... different gauges, different wattage, different materials, in the end, I don't think there's much of a difference anymore due to all the advances done in the last 2 years alone, but it it works for everyone regardless of their approach... it's all good!

Again, we are all on the same team... I think that we can jest about it in good humour, be curious, ask, express opinions, and as long as we are "united" as it's all about the same goal (isn't it), then we can have fun with it.

Life's too crappy to get upset about stuff like this really, let's enjoy and have fun together, and help newbies to do things "right" so they can quit smoking!

 

[lynn508]

It is great to see the clouds but that is all they are clouds. If that is what works that it is all that matters. I hope you have lots of vg stocked. I gave up living in the clouds about 30 years ago. Today all I care about is the next 10/15 years.

 

[sawlight]

Well, you have to take in account that the earlier e-cigarettes were the pioneers. Many wanted something more, as even today, I know of people that get "duped" and get the little kits at crazy prices, then find that it doesn't work for them and they consider going back to cigarettes. (I blame greedy stores and lack of knowledge)

So I'm assuming that some of those that wanted (or needed) more, didn't have much of a selection and mech mods were born.

Fast forward a few years and now we have a huge selection (that grows every day) of regulated mods that can provide a decent vape that can satisfy most people.

The "old school" mech mod enthusiastic have years of experience and most have mastered the skills and knowledge that requires a dedication that newbies won't have, heck, I'm no newbie, but never had the interest or devotion required.

Sadly, many newbies go into vaping for cloud making for the "cool" factor only, not really proper reasons, and we end up with these types on the news when they short out their mods and boom it goes.

But that said... the wattage thing, I understand it to an extent, but consider it a hold off from older tech/approaches. I do consider the old school mech mods people I've known to be very intelligent and great people and if they can make it work for them and they do it safely, it's just fine. I just know that it's not for me, but that we are all on the same team.

I find that my experience with the reg. mods have been great, and switching to the sub-ohm gear has been a "game changer", so from my old gear where 12W was the standard, with my approach of TC and such, 35-45 is where I find what I'm happy with.

I've never tried a mod with over 60W capacity, I've seen them in action, etc. and I see it as a balancing thing... different gauges, different wattage, different materials, in the end, I don't think there's much of a difference anymore due to all the advances done in the last 2 years alone, but it it works for everyone regardless of their approach... it's all good!

Again, we are all on the same team... I think that we can jest about it in good humour, be curious, ask, express opinions, and as long as we are "united" as it's all about the same goal (isn't it), then we can have fun with it.

Life's too crappy to get upset about stuff like this really, let's enjoy and have fun together, and help newbies to do things "right" so they can quit smoking!

I guess I'm "old school", I went to mechs because I wanted/needed something that lasted longer than 30 min and I was tired of dropping cigalikes daily, just to have them not work anymore! I could drop a mech, and it would still work! I started out with an Altsmoke BB, still have it even! Even have the USB pass through for it! Yeah, imagine that! Plug it into your computer or cig lighter and keep going after the battery dies! But I mainly used cartomizers. My first foray into rebuilding was a used DID clone. What a miserable POS that thing was! Can't say I've ever gotten it to work! But I've gotten an AGAT, a ZAP and an IHybrid built and working. You want some skill and patience? Get a roll of SS mesh, wrap it with Kanthal and figure out how to keep it from shorting out! More fun you say? Take an IHybrid to Disneyworld in a wheelchair and sort the thing out after everyone bumps into you, in the rain!
It's so easy now days, I don't understand why there is so much fear about mechs right now, just think a bit and check what you are doing! The ZAP was a real nightmare! Trying to keep it from shorting while working on a VERY regulated mod! Mechs are just as safe as you make them and to be honest, I'm fearful we are going to be seeing a lot of reports of these multiple battery regulated mods blowing up as people aren't practicing safe battery protocol with them.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

I guess I'm "old school", I went to mechs because I wanted/needed something that lasted longer than 30 min and I was tired of dropping cigalikes daily, just to have them not work anymore! I could drop a mech, and it would still work! I started out with an Altsmoke BB, still have it even! Even have the USB pass through for it! Yeah, imagine that! Plug it into your computer or cig lighter and keep going after the battery dies! But I mainly used cartomizers. My first foray into rebuilding was a used DID clone. What a miserable POS that thing was! Can't say I've ever gotten it to work! But I've gotten an AGAT, a ZAP and an IHybrid built and working. You want some skill and patience? Get a roll of SS mesh, wrap it with Kanthal and figure out how to keep it from shorting out! More fun you say? Take an IHybrid to Disneyworld in a wheelchair and sort the thing out after everyone bumps into you, in the rain!
It's so easy now days, I don't understand why there is so much fear about mechs right now, just think a bit and check what you are doing! The ZAP was a real nightmare! Trying to keep it from shorting while working on a VERY regulated mod! Mechs are just as safe as you make them and to be honest, I'm fearful we are going to be seeing a lot of reports of these multiple battery regulated mods blowing up as people aren't practicing safe battery protocol with them.

Well, you have to consider that many (like myself) are rebuilding coils and such but having to take the factors for a mech is way more devotion that I and many are able or want to do.

It's "easier" thanks to all the info and support, but still, it requires the desire to invest the time. A lot of vapers are people just trying to quit smoking, not get into a major hobby. And some people couldn't handle programming a VCR, you really think that you'd want people like this trying to not blow themselves up?

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

It is great to see the clouds but that is all they are clouds. If that is what works that it is all that matters. I hope you have lots of vg stocked. I gave up living in the clouds about 30 years ago. Today all I care about is the next 10/15 years.

Well, I'm not a "cloud chaser", I use regulated mods, but after going sub-ohm, that does do clouds in a fair manner, it wasn't about the clouds, it was about getting the "right" feel, the thickness of the vape, the flavour. What "converted" me was trying new flavours at the store and having their demos give me such a huge difference to my little mod and small tank... I wanted "that" feel and got something that would. My little mod/tank would barely give me anything close only if I pushed it (and burned out a few coils doing so).

My wife was the smoker that vaping was the only thing that worked... I do it because I simply enjoy it.

The "funny thing" I ended up with cancer, and a type that when I read about the effect of cigarettes of it, to see if exposure to cigarettes could have made things worse, I couldn't believe what I found... smoking could have helped prevented it (a bit).

Talk about irony.

And I can understand from your posts that you don't see the point of "clouds"... simply, it's because for the cloud chasers, it went from stopping to smoke to a hobby... no different than building model cars, or such. And if you've never tried a good mod with a good tank and never had that thickness, smoothness, and extra flavour, it's kinda part of why you don't see it... it's all about balance and what works for you.

 

[lynn508]

I never could program a vcr, I have problems trying to deal with my cell phone which I resisted as long as possible. But I build my own coils and make my own liquids. This is where what is important to you comes into play. Quitting a 47 year addiction to cigs was very imprtant to me.

 

[sawlight]

Well, you have to consider that many (like myself) are rebuilding coils and such but having to take the factors for a mech is way more devotion that I and many are able or want to do.

It's "easier" thanks to all the info and support, but still, it requires the desire to invest the time. A lot of vapers are people just trying to quit smoking, not get into a major hobby. And some people couldn't handle programming a VCR, you really think that you'd want people like this trying to not blow themselves up?

I don't see it's that much harder. Do you know what you need to build to be withing the realm of what your mod will operate within? You have to build coils that are lower than "this" and higher than "that" otherwise it wont work, right? Same thing for a mech. Know your battery, know your mod. Same thing. Build a coil too low for either, the mech might go BOOM, or just burn the coil, build it to low for the reg and it wont work. But how often do you build out of spec? Do you check your coils before you try them, or just throw them on the mod and see what happens? I bet you test them.
Don't get me wrong, I get what you are saying, I've read enough threads about the "noisy Cricket" to last me a lifetime! But there's inherent dangers in everything we use to vape! If they aren't smart enough to set up a VCR how are they setting up the fancy whazoo vape gizmo box they just bought? How are they labeling and keeping the batteries married in the multiple battery mod they just bought? I'm much more fearful of the multiple battery mods than I am of mechs TBH! When they start going off it's gonna be real bad!
I don't have the answers and I'm not trying to fight with you, but read through the new members section some night. Read about how they went out and bought this 1000 watt mod and the vendor recommended they buy these 60 amp 5000mah batteries to go in it! It's scary! It's not just the end user, there has to be education for sellers of this equipment as well.

 

[herb]

Sorry to offend you guys with the term silly. In my day it took a whole lot more than the word silly to offend people, but I'm not a special snowflake these days like a lot of others.

I much prefer people just say what they think without worrying about offending somebody and being "politically correct" , that kind of thinking is destroying this country .

That being said i also find it "silly" but the people who prefer to vape high wattage shouldn't care about what anyone thinks, i don't care if others think my tootle puffing or whatever it's called is silly either.

People should just do whatever they feel like doing, ( preferably legal) and not worry about what others think about it.

 

[lynn508]

I have 15 mechs and I am stocked. JUst because I don't like high wattage doesn't mean I'm stupid. I just don't care to push the envelope anymore.

 

[lynn508]

I cannot stand the term tootle puffing. This must be a new creation of the uninformed masses. We like what we like whether it be low or high wattage. Seems those that go through lots of juice a day enjoy it. I hope you make your own liquids.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

I never could program a vcr, I have problems trying to deal with my cell phone which I resisted as long as possible. But I build my own coils and make my own liquids. This is where what is important to you comes into play. Quitting a 47 year addiction to cigs was very imprtant to me.

Glad to hear it.. the wife couldn't get off the habit until vaping... over 25 years and from a family of very heavy smokers.