Here's why the FDA is doing this?

Status
Not open for further replies.

markarich159

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Jun 30, 2009
1,169
45
PA, USA
36 months from now, 43% of Boge/Dekang eliquid users start deluging their primary care physicians' offices with strange pulmonary symptoms. Millions of dollars worth of tests(that Obamacare is not covering) are done to determine what's going on. Turns out that a strange malignancy similar to Oat Cell Carcinoma has formed requiring Billions in further medical treatment. Many will die, many will SUE. WHO will they sue????

If it was Big Tobacco that caused this, there is no doubt who would be forced to pick up the tab. But big tobacco did not cause this. There is no USA Big E-cig to take the liability should the above scenario actually occur. Do you think Dekang/joyetech will pay out, if you know anything about trying to recoup lawsuit winnings from Chinese companies, you know that won't be an option. Are you going to sue the guy working out of his basement that imported a few hundred units from China to make some extra bucks, there's nothing to win. You can't sue the government in a situation like this, they told you not to do it.

This is the type of hysteria the FDA is just at the beginning of creating. Do I think this "Oat Cell Carcinoma" scenario will occur, of course not. Anyone with any logical sense knows e-cigs are orders of magnitude safer then analogs. But, in the USA, the e-cig industry is in it's infancy and there's no one to take the heat financially, should, God forbid, the worst happen. Until some corporate entity large enough to cover the imaginary liabilty steps up, the FDA will not be satisfied. The ECA is a good start. The industry has to start watchdogging itself, making sure they have have their Sh*t together(from The Chinese suppliers to the guys selling out of their garage.)

As I said in another thread, like it or not, this is the FDA's job now. They now have the responsibilty of regulating the nicotine market. I see alot of people putting down the ECA feeling that their response isn't strong enough. The ECA is a PAC, their job is politics. You don't want to go swatting at an already angry bee. If they play the politics right, work with the FDA to start getting some real workable regs for the industry(and yes there are going to be taxes assesed-as I also said before) everything will be OK.

Feel Free to Discuss, agree or disagree. That's what's great about America.
 
Last edited:

Mac

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Jun 5, 2009
2,477
15,159
All up in your grill..
It's a nice theory but I DO NOT FOR ONE SECOND believe that it is why. These products have been used in china for more then 36 months. Besides, if that has been the arguement all along why are you the first person to say it? You really beleive this has nothing to do with political pressure from pharma groups? You work in the industry. Do you believe it's not corrupt? When we visit a psych doc and say we are feeling blue does he tell us to get more exercise change our diets and talk about our problems? Are doctors not recieving gifts and cash rewards from glaxo welcome? I mean I am not trying to be critical of you but come on! The greater good?

And yes I work at a mall sellin em. So a ban directly threatens my lower middle class lifestyle. Safe to say I have a vested interest.

The greater good? I remain unconvinced.
 

happily

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 25, 2009
1,974
20
anchorage, ak
I guess the FDA is attacking cheerios claims because they are not taxed and made in china as well. F-ing Dumb A's
My biggest thought would be why did they hold their tests for 2 months and why do they make believe we are inhaling antifreeze and pretend the e-cig is the only product containing nitrosamines. If the FDA was speaking honestly about findings that would mean something. When someone says read my lips cause they're lying out their ... it's a whole nother story
 

KrispyKrink

Full Member
Jul 31, 2009
38
0
50
No, the real reason is simple really. Kickbacks.

The FDA gets money from every drug/product that they "approve". There's Billions of dollar's in Tax revenue just from sales tax on tobacco. Then there's Billions more that various states collect in "for the children" health care tax, like CA rakes in every year.

Currently with electronic cigarettes there's no kickback tax revenue money other than the local/state sales tax collected from the unlucky person to purchase from a local retail source. After that it trails off to nothing when the user becomes more involved with e-cigs, they search the web, find sites like this and inevitably find new sources for product over the web were there's little to no tax money involved.

We by-pass the system, they don't like that.
 

Dilutetrips

Senior Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Apr 6, 2009
160
7
56
New Brighton, MN
FDA does not care about anything but money. So much BS from them and the anti smoking groups. Yes smoking is not good for me. Vaping I belive is better for me, but not good for me. There is 1000's of things that are not good for me. Due to all the crap that is in our foods, air, water that the FDA/gov does not say crap about. We have wall boards that houses are built with that the China will not let be sold in China. How many people in this country have had a drunk driver kill someone the love or know someone with a weight problem. These costs us more then smoking. How about the #1 cause of lung cancer in non-smokers (it is not second hand smoke) it is radon gas. Yet homes are being built or have been built on areas that are unsafe to live in because of radon gas. yet they FDA/gov does little to nothing. The goverment is @#$%ed up. We need to get people to wake up and see that the goverment is only doing things and making laws that make the people in power more money. the health and well being of the people in the USA is only important if you have money and in power.
 

DaMulta

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Jun 18, 2009
2,300
11
45
T-Town Oklahoma
Around 40% of everything that makes different kinds of medication here in the US comes from China unchecked for the most.

Here is the deal, It's the !@R%!ing taxes, and you can't say that is not. Just 1 pack a day one million users is over 1 billion dollars at 3 dollar tax rate lost. So who knows how much they are losing.

If E-Cig is declared a over the counter Nic stop smoking device there will be no sin tax, and there will be no age restriction on them. I'm really hopping that it does not fall under tob, because we will then have to start paying sin taxes. Then who knows how they will do it. By the Mg? By the Ml? I mean you can cut E-Liquid into more, and that is something that you can't do with Tob, Gum, or patches.
 
WHO will they sue????


ROFL!!

Yes, yes. The FDA's ultimate concern is in regards to who will be sued.

"Holy crap!! This stuff might not be safe!! Quick, let us regulate it so that way the American public will know exactly who to sue in case something goes wrong. Man I LOVE working at the FDA. We're like superheroes or something."
 

edlogic

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Jun 7, 2009
391
1
67
jax fla usa
www.edlogic.com
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premier_(cigarette)

They have been around for a long time, just e-cigs have never gained market share until now, and the taxes have been the major force behind people looking for a cheaper alternitive to regualr cigs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eclipse_(cigarette)

It seems the chinese have figured out a better way to deliver the nicotine. And it is impossible for a American company to compete with a chinese company.


say man ( speaking to your avatar image ) - i like your face much nicer since you had the makeover ->

now when your jack booted military and police thugs kick my teeth in - i will feel much better about it

can you put on a red cherry nose so i can laugh a little bit more as you continue taking away all my liberties and mastermind more false flag events as your predecessors taught you ?

thanks

oh yes - i believe you when you say that national health care is for our own good and the fda is worried about our health 3 years from now - just like nixon said that the hmo would be the best thing possible - i believed him also

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QkgUkM0o6Q
 
Last edited:

palermo45

Unregistered Supplier
ECF Veteran
Jan 4, 2009
99
1
www.nicapure.com
I guess the FDA is attacking cheerios claims because they are not taxed and made in china as well. F-ing Dumb A's
My biggest thought would be why did they hold their tests for 2 months and why do they make believe we are inhaling antifreeze and pretend the e-cig is the only product containing nitrosamines. If the FDA was speaking honestly about findings that would mean something. When someone says read my lips cause they're lying out their ... it's a whole nother story
There is nothing honest at all about he FDA!! The FDA knew full well and were 100% aware that electronic cigarettes where being sold in the USA for 2 years and did NOTHING!!! So as the e-cig gained popularity and made a "DENT" in the sales, thus affecting the sales of regular cigarettes. the patch, gum and nicotrol, they are now doing something!! How much more obvious could this be??
 

Mossman

Full Member
Jun 16, 2009
63
0
Lowell, MA
Why does government believe that touting our health and welfare are still plausible excuses for anything they do anymore?

Why? Because we keep on believing it!

We live in a nation of sleepwalking zombies who still cling to the notion that America is a benevolent democracy (which it never was), or a free republic (which it hasn't been for a very long time). Our system, in its present state is an Oligarchy. Which means; those who have the money make the laws.

Politicians don't run the show, they just push the buttons. So-called public health agencies are bought and paid for by the pharmaceutical industry. In 2005, the top 10 pharmaceutical manufacturers reaped more profit than the other 490 companies in the Fortune 500 COMBINED!

What kind of influence do you think that kind of money buys?

Do you ever wonder why you keep hearing more and more about prescription drugs being pulled off the market for causing DEATH or PERMANENT INJURY?? Where were the FDA's stringent testing standards in those cases?? It used to be, the only time you ever heard about someone dying from taking a pharmaceutical was if someone tampered with the Tylenol... At least then, you heard about it in the media... But now, the media's all bought and paid for too...

We all laugh and make jokes about the long list of side-effects that every pharmaceutical comes with these days, but has anyone noticed that the side effects keep getting worse and worse? Of course not... We've all been desensitized... We're not paying attention anymore. Not only are doctors over-medicating depression patients, but now, if that doesn't make you happy enough, we have anti-depressants to take on top of whatever anti-depressant you're already taking! Sure, it might kill you, but at least you'll die happy?

Do you ever wonder why the last time anyone came up with a CURE for anything was back in the days of Polio?? Is it because we've cured all the diseases that could possibly be cured? No, it's because there's no money in cures... If you cure somebody, you're not gonna get any more of their money... all the money's in TREATMENT... And these treatments create other conditions that need to be treated as well. But that's not enough either... Now we have treatments for problems that weren't even problems ten years ago! They're not even diseases... They're either inconveniences, or totally frickin' IMAGINARY. Sometimes I swear the pharmaceutical companies come up with the drug first, then try to invent a reason to take it.

We're all living in a freakin' Aldous Huxley novel, and no one seems to realize it! And the pharmaceutical companies all thank Ford as they jerk each other off for doing such a swell job of selling us their soma and making idiot Deltas out of all of us...

While we all smile, and take their stoopid pills, grateful that we're not like the Alphas and don't have to think too much... Thankful that we live in a country where we can be free to buy our cheap crap at Wal Mart, and continue our endless pursuit of distraction... Comforted by the belief that the people who are trying to take our happiness away by showing us how the world really works, are just a bunch of kooks and crackpots. All the while, oblivious to the fact that our ability and right to think for ourselves is either being denied or disabled.

Sorry about the rant (I didn't even really scratch the surface, actually)... I'm sure I'm probably preaching to choir for most of the folks around here, but there's still a lot of folks like the OP who need to WAKE UP.
 
Last edited:

RyanW

Full Member
ECF Veteran
Aug 14, 2009
19
1
I did not know this until about 2 hours ago, but Phillip Morris is actually now a subsidiary of "The Altria Group"

This is an exceprt from Altria's 2006 Shareholders meeting.

w ww.altria.com/download/pdf/investors_2006_AnnualShareholdersMeeting-Remarks.pdf (can't post links yet)


"The Altria family of companies generated a total of $17.8 billion in total taxes paid to federal, state and local governments in the U.S. alone in 2005, and that number more than doubles when taxes outside the U.S. are considered."


And thats old data from 2006 their profits have been rising steadily every year. That folks is an idea of the kind of money "vaping" stands against. And this does not include the taxes generated by all of the other manufactures of tobacco products as well. I think I remember reading in there somewhere (or maybe on another site been researching for a while) that the Malboro brand only has like 40% of the total market share.

Now heres what I don't understand. Supposedly the tobacco companies and the FDA are supposed to be trying to come up with a healthier solution to tobacco usage that will not have a negative affect on the US economy, that is actually mentioned specifically in the Family Smoking Prevention Act. (Don't have a link handy, but google can pull it up fast enough and the part mentioning the economic impact is pretty close to he begining) Anyhow, if that is the case and I was Phillip Morris...I'd stop fighting e-cigs (not sure that they are, but I don't think its too horrible of an assumption) and start selling the damn things myself. And if I was the FDA, I'd tell Phillip Morris that they needed to start selling their tobacco only in e-cig form :p There, everyone's problems solved, we get our e-cigs, with quality control (in theory anyhow), the jobs in tobacco industry remains intact(though they might change some), and they get their damn taxes.




OO and while I'm at it, though this is somewhat off topic...why in the hell is it considered to be "marketing to children" when you offer "sweet", "candy" flavors? Was I supposed to stop liking sugar back when I turned 18? Is something now wrong with me? Did I somehow get addicted to this horrible substance that is linked to obesity, diabetes, etc.. which the last time I checked is another of the nations biggest health concerns? Who exactly can I sue for not warning me that sugar was so damn addictive?!


*sigh*


Oh and what is another component of antifreeze....WATER. OMG everyone stop drinking water its a known component in antifreeze!

Antifreeze which by the way I am sorry to say looks like delicious Mt. Dew, and ever since I was a child I have been barely able to restrain myself from tasting it...especially since I've always heard that its super sweet (which is why your not supposed to leave spills about so animals don't get into it)

OK my turn...

/rant off
 

ProfessorDaffy

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Jun 12, 2009
576
7
Acme Looniversity
Around 40% of everything that makes different kinds of medication here in the US comes from China unchecked for the most.

Here is the deal, It's the !@R%!ing taxes, and you can't say that is not. Just 1 pack a day one million users is over 1 billion dollars at 3 dollar tax rate lost. So who knows how much they are losing.

If E-Cig is declared a over the counter Nic stop smoking device there will be no sin tax, and there will be no age restriction on them. I'm really hopping that it does not fall under tob, because we will then have to start paying sin taxes. Then who knows how they will do it. By the Mg? By the Ml? I mean you can cut E-Liquid into more, and that is something that you can't do with Tob, Gum, or patches.

I believe in he priciple of Occam's Razor. The simplest solution is generally the correct one. Maybe the FDA are just a bunch of dillweeds?

Oh, and the money thing, too.

--Prof Daffy
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread